Does the DfE guide schools on how many KS4 options they should have, and do I have grounds for appeal over this?

[weathergod]

My daughter is in year 9, and choosing her options for next year. Maths, English (x2) and Science (x3 or combined) are compulsory. Then she needs to choose 3 options (with a humanities subject and a language encouraged, but not compulsory). All the other schools in the area have 4 options, not 3. I'm cross about this and my questions are:

1.Is there a minimum number of KS4 subjects recommended by the Government for a broad and balanced curriculum?

1. Is this restriction to 3 options likely to reduce my daughter's options at A Level?

1. If I appealed for a place at another school on the grounds of wanting 4 options, would I have a good case?

Sounds normal to me.
My DS had to do maths, english x2, science x3 one MFL and either history or geography and so only had one completely free choice.
9 GCSEs is plenty.

Not sure why you are so concerned about this OP. Why are you worried? There are only so many hours in the school day and so many lessons that fit in the school week. What does your DC want to study that they can’t?

It's fairly normal for schools to offer triple in the same number of lessons as combined, and perfectly doable for stronger science students.

It is also pretty normal for triple science to take up one more option in many schools.

Especially with the new syllabus, providing more time seems sensible.

Hang on, I think OP is worried because the school are offering 7 or 8 GCSEs rather than offering 8 or 9 which is what she wants. If her DD does double science it would be

Maths
English
Science
Science
Option 1 language
Option 2 humanity
Option 3

= 7.

I’d be concerned if my DC was only doing 7 GCSEs too.

Sorry, ignore me. Just realised it’s English x 2. 🙄

It seems low to me as 10 or 11 is normal at our comprehensive school, depending on whether it is double or triple science:
Maths
2 x English
2/3 sciences
RE
History or Geography
Language
Then a choice of two from a wider mix

11 is unusual these days since the GCSE reforms. DD took 10 in 2016.

Mine would have been disappointed at that. I thought 9 was pretty standard 10 if doing triple science, I don’t know any that only offer 8.

Having said that even though they would not be happy I don’t think I would create a fuss about it at this point. It’s unlikely to achieve anything and more likely to make it into a bigger issue for your DC.

DS is skid y9. He's just taken his options - his school select pupils for triple or double science. The double science people get an additional free choice. A modern language or IT is compulsory, and a humanity subject and a creative subject is encouraged.

So
Eng Lit
Eng Lang
Maths
Science x 3
History
Music
Spanish

So 9. This seems pretty standard locally (including the people I know at private school), and is one more than was normal when I was at school (1980s).

A choice of three options is normal, and 9 is a perfectly good total number of GCSEs

It really has gone back to the days of O Levels (because of terminal exams) when 9 (+/- 1) was the norm

You are being ridiculous.

You can pay for iGCSEs for additional subjects if you think your child is missing out on a specific subject but how much flexibility do you think there can be?

You seem not to understand how the scheduling works.

No.
no.
no.

Most A level courses only ask for 5 GCSEs

9 and a better work life balance seems sensible

DS did 10, but actually I wish he'd done 9 and had more time for those. He's now yr 13 and only one of his GCSEs was linked to his A Levels, history. His degree choice is linked more to economics and politics, which he only picked up in 6th form (and which are likely to be his highest grades).

I think people are being pretty unfair calling the OP ridiculous. It is irrelevant that you need 5 GCSEs for A-level, as very often specific GCSEs are required to do certain A-levels. So yes, she's allowed to be annoyed if her child's options in life are narrowed earlier than other children's. Why should my kid at a normal comp be given two extra choices than hers? I'd be annoyed too.

My dd did nine but also did the short course RE GCSE in year ten.

Just send her to a different school if you are unhappy with the school you have. It's not uncommon to move at this age.

Quite a lot of schools that do more exams don't have that many more 'free options'.

DD's school have:
Core:
English Lit
English Lang
Maths
Combined Science

Option 1:
Geography or History

Option 2:
RE and Citizenship - pick one at end of Y9 for early GCSE in Y10

Option 3:
Languages: 1 of German, French, Spanish or Latin

Option 4:
Arts: one of Fine Art, Graphics, Photography, Textiles, Music, Drama

Option 5: Free choice from any of the above options or Triple Science, Classical Civ, Psychology, Sociology, Economics, Computer Studies, Business Studies, PE, Design Tech and Food Science. BTEC in Creative Media Production.

They all have to take basic PE and Infotech but no exam.

SEN students can opt out of languages after discussion with tutors.

Will the school facilitate an exam in another subject? Loads of the London schools will put native MFL speakers in for their mother tongue GCSE but they are either taught offsite or in twilight classes.

I'd say it's your child's school that is the outlier ColouringPencils not the OP's. 11 subjects is pretty unusual nowadays.Many (probably most) schools have reduced the number of GCSEs they offer since the new, much more demanding syllabi were introduced. Generally the time so generated gets used for extra maths and english lessons.
9 GCSEs is more than adequate for the vast majority of pupils and will allow access to every post 16 and post 18 route that I am aware of. It allows for a fairly broad range of subjects and most children are likely to achieve better overall grades with slightly fewer subjects. Poor or inconsistent grades at GCSE are far more likely to close doors than "only" having 9. 9 is plenty and still allows for a manageable workload that facilitates extracurricular activities and interests.
There will be some children who can manage 9 with ease, get fabulous results and still excel at other things with no detriment to their well being of course, but they are in the minority. Schools have to make curriculum and timetabling decisions that are in the interests of the majority of their pupils. The OP's child is not being deprived, they're getting the same kind of choice as most others their age.

I don't think you have any grounds to appeal on the what GCSE's the school offers.

At my DC's are doing

English Lit (Gcse taken in year 10)

Year 11

English Lang
Science (top sets to triple science, other double science)
Math
PHSCRE

French (again top set encouraged to continue)
Drama
History
Geography.

She also doing optional A level in English Literacy.

Have just moved DD b/c she had heart set on doing Art and Music and her school wouldn’t allow it (cos of timetabling blocks). I would have found another way if she had been otherwise settled and happy at school but as it was I’ve moved her.

There is nothing to stop you transferring your child to another school at this point. If this is something you want to do then do it now before she starts Year 10. If the school you want doesn't have a place then ask to go on the waiting list.

For an appeal to work you must show that the school can give your child something that is essential for their education that they cannot give elsewhere. If, for example, your child had already been learning Mandarin for years with the view to taking it to GCSE and A Level, and the school did not offer Mandarin as an option but School A does offer it then you need to also show that your child can't also do a Mandarin GCSE elsewhere (by doing it themselves for example, maybe there are no Saturday or evening classes, and the school refuses to allow your child to attend a class outside of the school setting during the week), that other schools within a similar distance that also offer Mandarin don't have places. I would say an appeal on those grounds would be unlikely to succeed but it is always your right as a parent to appeal, and you can then know that you did absolutely everything possible.

Statistically the majority of students sit 9 GCSEs according to .gov website. Ds1 sat 9 due to combined science, didn't stop him taking a science at A level and achieving an A star. Ds2 sat 10 GCSEs as he did individual sciences but they are accelerated in year 9 to get them there, there is no option block to take it in. In all he sat 23 exams plus 2 oral exams, French (hard) and English (easy.) It is a lot now that it is all exams and no coursework for the majority of courses.

There has been some rounding in the figures of number of pupils but to demonstrate

26.2% take 9 GCSEs
24.9% take 8 GCSEs
17.2% take 7 GCSEs
12.2% take 10 GCSEs so in fact lower than those who take 9, 8 or 7.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/infographic-gcse-results-2022/infographics-for-gcse-results-2022-accessible

Are the 3 options preventing her taking a subject she really wants to study is the first question I would ask. For degrees 9 is plenty and it is best to have one less and have higher grades than one more and lower grades.

@SheliaBeCalmNow I think they usually do triple science or combined science in the same timetable, but the triple classes get through more content. It's great that your DS1 got an A star at a-level, but pretty shocking if his school put him in that position, in my opinion. He would have had to work a lot harder than other A level students to catch up on material he could have been taught at GCSE.