GCSE C grade students - unlikely to go on to A-Levels??

[Enb76]

Is this true? I have seen people say in some of the threads that if a student is around a C (a 4?) grade then they are unlikely to go on to A-Level. I may be a little out of the game but I thought C and above was A-Level and below a C was probably unlikely but didn't mean you were out of the game. I did my GCSEs in the early 1990's so I appreciate things have changed - including that grades are now numbered. My child is only currently choosing their GCSEs

@Quantity5

TeenPlusCat - using GCSE Eng and Maths as an absolute gatekeeper to Level 3 is dreadful. It’s also a gatekeeper to many level 2 college courses so you see able students who end up doing multiple level 1 courses rather than moving through the levels that will give them jobs.

When the B Techs are gutted and the T levels more widely taken choice has narrowed again for our more vulnerable learners who have always been more heavily represented on B Tech courses.

One of the problems here is that if a sixth-former has not got level 4 in English or maths, they have to continue studying towards that - government rules. That means that letting in the odd student who hasn't commits the sixth-form to providing them with GCSE teaching. They're unlikely to have enough students in the same boat to make that sensible. Hopefully, such students can find an alternative provider that has GCSE retake classes.

@Comefromaway Correct - much longer than five years ago! I'm completely out of date with the system now, but wanted to illustrate that it is entirely possible to outperform expectations due to sheer hard work and determination. Based on my predicted GCSEs I was told I wasn't clever enough to do A-levels and that I should do a GNVQ instead. Well I showed them! Three Bs was enough to get into Cambridge at that time. However, I realise it's down to circumstances and the individual concerned, and it has to be the right choice / route for them.

Our 6th form doesn't budge. If you've not got Level 5 Maths or English you're not in. You could have 9s in the subjects you want to take at A Level and it doesn't matter.

@CornishGem1975

Our 6th form doesn't budge. If you've not got Level 5 Maths or English you're not in. You could have 9s in the subjects you want to take at A Level and it doesn't matter.

Ouch! Ours let's you retake one.

When DD was at school her 6th form didn't offer GCSE retakes. If anyone needed to retake maths or English they went to the local 6th form college. Her school only offered A levels post 16.

@Chakraleaf Yeah it's harsh, but they're massively oversubscribed so I suppose they don't need to.

Yes, DD's 6th was oversubscribed, but as there was an alternative option it wasn't an issue.

Yes there are several colleges and other 6th forms near by who have different requirements so there are other options for students.

And if the 6th form is massively oversubscribed it's not going to turn down people who passed with all the grades for someone that needs to do a retake.

I've had to try and talk dd2 out of sixth form. :(

@Enb76

'4 - low c So a 4 is just a pass'

Ah, so it's not really a C as I was translating it. It's a bare minimum pass.

'This is why it is so important to protect the Btecs that the government are hell bent on abolishing.'

Well this seems mad. Surely we should widen the opportunities post GCSE if there are a significant number of children who do not have the right academic framework to sit A-Levels.

In the experience of posters here, do BTECs ect... hold the same, lesser or greater weight than A-levels in wanting to go into 3rd level education?

Yep and they have been around for decades, are well understood by industry etc etc. My grandfather did one in the 1950s.

BUT the government want their new 'T' levels. They are not funding BTEC courses in subjects that have T Levels, they have had to backtrack on the rollout.

I hope they go the way of GNVQ, Vocational A Levels AKA AVCE etc.

The 14 to 19 diploma could have been a great addition had it been implemented in a better way.

@Enb76

I can see the rationale in not having 200 different BTECs in Engineering (I have been doing some light reading) commonslibrary.parliament.uk/level-3-qualifications-reform-whats-happening-to-btecs/

And while I can see that there are objections they seem to be centred on not losing public money rather than the fact that the current system is already fit for purpose.

I do not know enough about it though to make a reasonable argument for or against.

I would hope that students who are not 'academic' have an equal opportunity to get education that is suited to their needs, taught at demonstrably high standards, that can be used as an entry either to HE or to the jobs/professions that they aspire to. If BTECs do that then there is no need to reform them, if they do not do that then it is never a bad idea to see if things can be made better. I don't know either way and my reading has been brief.

Yes, it would be lovely if non-academically minded pupils had high quality education suited to their needs... but the FE sector has been decimated, even more so in Scotland than England if that is possible, and now BTECs are being de-funded, illustrating just how committed the government are to supporting and improving the life chances of citizens not aiming at university (so 50% of the population then )

Coupled with attempts to defund arts degrees, or indeed anything that doesn't bring cold hard cash into the economy, it's really quite an unsatisfactory outcome for most young people nowadays.

Son had 4/ 5 in English and maths. 6 and 7 in history and geography. Got 3 Bs at a level in classical history ,geography and business. Local Higher flying Sixth form turned him down . He went to the less prestigious one . I'm glad he did. He got amazing support during covid. On line lessons and alot of feedback assessment. His BF went to the other one. Little to no support during covid better GCSE'S in English maths and similar GCSE'S in history /geography but at a levels 3 C in the same subjects. Mine worked his backside off and was helped to do it. It's not impossible.

@Ljmumun well done to your son. But I don't think many people are saying ALL GCSEs need to be 6 or 7, just the ones chosen fir A level. Most 6th forms I know (well, all actually) would accept a student with 4/5 eng and maths and 6/7 in geography and history to do those A levels.