Any success with ADHD and 'highly selective' schools?

[Clippedwings]

My DS was diagnosed with ADHD 2 years ago (not a shock). He is quite academic: sits comfortably in the top half of top sets for Maths and English in a very academic school. He is in Year 5.
We had a parents' evening recently where our Head basically implied that we should "manage our expectations" because no matter how well he does in the entrance exams to 'very good' schools, many "are not supportive of SEN children". My husband heard the conversation differently, but I read it as: "don't bother with the very selective schools".
I must stress that the school has been nothing but supportive of his needs and his teacher is particularly optimistic about his opportunities.
Has anyone with an ADHD boy had any success with getting into super-selectives at 11+? If so, and appropriate, can you name the school. Thank you.

Pm'd you.

Where do you live?

Which schools are you looking at? You have to declare SEN on application forms and almost always send assessments from the last three years. This was really tough as the CAHMS diagnosis we'd had was several years ago, prior to medication and painted a pretty bleak picture of our son which isn't a true reflection of him now - indeed he is currently Head Boy at his Prep which you wouldn't believe reading the diagnosis. One school was amazing and the SENCO called me during the application process to understand all about our son now. I was on the phone to her for over half an hour. I was super impressed. The others didn't. There are definitely super-selectives that I believe are less welcoming of a child with a diagnosis although it's so hush hush I'll never know if it was a factor.

My pal had to send her 2nd child to a different posh school to his older sibling as they wouldn't entertain her dyslexic dc. He's better for going somewhere that supported him properly.

What I would say is that environment & atmosphere are the most important factors for me with an adhd dx. In a comfortable environment, I thrive. I did not achieve my potential at school because I wasn't happy.

Thank you for the replies.
We are London-ish based, so looking at City, Kings, and similar. I think he has the academic ability to make the grade, but am worried now about bias. He has just started on meds. He has never needed extra time or assistance, but was always a bit fidgety, distracted and unfocussed and this is starting to spill over into areas where focus and time is required (composition writing, etc) hence the move to meds.

We were told City would not suit a boy I'd describe in near-identical terms. We havent gone down the meds route though.

OP, you need to listen to your prep head and read the SW London boys 11plus thread on here. Whilst the top schools take a range of personalities - sporty, arty, musical etc they take the same ability level - top in maths and English and able to engage in a fast moving curriculum with constant homework, testing, deadlines etc - you have to be able to concentrate and organise yourself to keep up.

Latymer Upper seemed to me to be the most welcoming to neurodiverse kids. Unfortunately some schools do have rather regressive attitudes to SEN. You should probably phone the admissions team at all the schools you are interested in and feel it out.

Also, there is no reason why a child with ADHD would not have the same ability level as a child without.

I was fine up to GCSE, it went Pete Tong at A Level. Having spent a bit of time on support groups, etc., this is quite common. It doesn't stop you achieving, it just gets more difficult as the depth, organisation and focus required at higher exams isn't always suited to an adhd brain.

Really find somewhere that understands this, as struggling on is no fun for anyone.

I would be concerned that some schools 'manage out' children so this might be something to consider.

Hi @Clippedwings,

See this discussion which I found very helpful.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/secondary/4042707-Stigma-of-SEN-during-11-in-London?msgid=100596023#100596023

We just completed the 11+ process in London and my ADHD son did very well with numerous offers, including to very highly selective schools. We were very open with all schools and found only one to be inexcusably archaic (Ibstock).

The way the Ed Psych report is written is an important factor and must highlight strengths on balance with the weaknesses. This is something I would recommend you talk thoroughly through with your clinicians. Plan enough time to update your reports as needed before they are due to schools in autumn; as you are starting meds now you'll want to reassess before applying to schools. Our Ed Psych report clearly highlighted that my son repeatedly tested in the gifted ranges for intelligence.

There is definitely bias and discrimination for ADHD that is different from other learning differences like dyslexia. Obviously the only way to conquer that is for parents and schools to be open about it and welcome neurodiversity and the benefits it brings. On the other hand it is difficult as a parent potentially watching opportunities pass by if schools don't accept your child. Although we were an open book with admissions staff, I still ponder if a child is well managed on meds, is there a strong argument to keep this info private? The 11+ is so competitive in London, especially for boys that your options are very limited as it is, never mind with learning differences add in.

Thanks for all the great advice. I especially learned a lot from the thread orcadive posted. All of your suggestions are very much appreciated.

DS has ADHD. He sat the 11+ plus entrance exams to 2 private schools this year.
He was not awarded any extra time (even though it stipulates it on his consultant report) for any of the exams, though he was allowed movement breaks between 11+ papers. He failed that one as he ran out of time and didn't finish a single paper.
He got offers from the two private schools. again, he didn't get any extra time, but they put him in his own private room so there were less distractions. I'm guessing he scrapped in...or did a good interview.
He's very bright, but highly distractable so in hindsight, the 11+ school would not have been a good fit overall.
We've accepted the offer from the small private school where he will have tiny class sizes and teachers that will know him and his issues.

twitter.com/ankithharathi/status/1369093587003203587

Just in case you wanted some inspiration regarding success and ADHD

He may do really well wherever he goes!

My son has ADHD, is on meds, is in a top academic prep school and we're preparing for 11+ for the super competitive top North London / London schools. He is bright but consistently underperforms on tests. I am an academic so started researching the evidence of value of support that (by law) some schools do provide (like extra time). I am going to add some links below but in a nutshell there is no evidence, none whatsoever, that is proven via clinical studies, that extra time or other exam support provided to ADHD children improves their performance. The bottom line: no matter how bright or how high their IQ they are statistically speaking likely to have lower / worse performance on entry tests. This is of course convenient for schools that want to weed out ADHD children--watch how many schools say they "welcome neurodiversity" but that is usually dyslexia or dyspraxia. This is really astonishing that in the modern world we have between 5-10 percent of children diagnosed with ADHD legitimately excluded from opportunities to flourish. So the big hoax in the admissions process to top selectives is that they claim they welcome diversity but as long as the child performs in the top range on the exam. But ADHD and top exam range just does not go together bar very exceptional cases. In my case, as a mother I am going to send the academic papers I found on ADHD and exam performance to the schools we're applying for. The more us parents with ADHD children challenge these practices the more awareness there will be about these issues. I also teach at a top London university and we provide a lot of support to students with ADHD and I know they can and do well. And here are some academic links to studies I mention: journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/1087054712449183
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5424262/#:~:text=Common%20testing%20accommodations%2C%20as%20presently,of%20co%2Doccurring%20learning%20difficulties.

Sofya - excellent post highlighting the discrimination which takes place. I think it is absolutely shocking and often think SENCO's act as gatekeeper to weed out "difficulties" under the guise of saying that they do not think your child would thrive in a particular environment.

HereComeTheHolidays, Thank you for your reply. At least some of us (probably at least on this thread) are at least fortunate to be able to afford a private consultation and diagnosis via a private ADHD doctor. Our experience with getting DS diagnosed via the NHS/GP has been a failure. So persistence really helps, and also not taking "no" for answer. Once we got him diagnosed via the private consultant, he now gets meds on the NHS. And that really helps. Hope the paperwork will help with the schools too, but as you say the schools may try to use it to weed out "difficult" children.

Dd was undiagnosed when she did the exams but nonetheless got equal top scores in the English part of the exams for v academic school in the SW. so I think part of my strategy would be to make sure the exams are easy for him, then the schools will want him regardless.

Also, by the time you get to a v v selective school, there are huge numbers of non neurotypical children - friend was told that they are in the majority at one Berkshire super selective.

But despite all that , I think the school is right; make sure that you go for a secondary which wants him as he is rather than squashing him into a conventional box

My son got offers from all schools we applied to, including three schools in the top five in London. I disagree that kids with ADHD can’t do well in exams. I did a research (mostly anecdotal) and decided not to disclose his condition to school. It was noticed after a few terms and he was offered support. However, I am still not sure if such a pressured environment is completely right for him. It is very high-pressured and competitive and his ADHD got worse and I am worried about him keeping up. He is still doing well academically but I am not sure what will happen in the next few years and how he is going to cope. The school is amazing and we are very happy with the support and his friends are great too. I still would not choose another school for him, he loves it and I think he should be surrounded by academic peers despite his diagnosis.

We were lucky because he is not on meds and we did not inform his primary about his (private) assesmet. I think it’s trickier to keep his condition a secret if he is taking medication and his primary is aware of his diagnosis. We did not go the NHS route because we thought it will hinder his chances at 11+.

Yes DS got offer to a highly selective school and has an ADHD diagnosis which we disclosed when applying. He had offers to other slective schools too (again diagnosis disclosed). The only thing I noticed was that he may have been given more rigorous interviews. He was interviewed by a senior member of staff and interviews lasted a bit longer than the others I noticed. This may have been because he talks a lot though or it could have been a way to give him more of a chance if his written exam performance wasnt stellar. Whatever it was he got the offers. I ‘ ll pm you with more details and also my thoughts on ones where he wasn’t successful!

@Summerishere12 I would be really grateful if you could name the school where you are happy with the support or pm me.

@MGMidget please would you mind sending me a pm too, I strongly suspect we're going to be in a similar position with my DS.

Hi
Please can you PM me too.I find this very useful.This will help inform our choices of school.My son is not yet diagnosed but has some of the symyoms mentioned .

Latymer Upper and Emanuel seem rather welcoming and modern, I would try City / St Paul's as well. The one I heard is less supportive is KCS. I would still speak to all schools directly and see how knowledgable and accommodating they seem. It will give you a good feel.