Depressed Year 11 - what if he were to just drop out now

[BrightBlueCast]

My DS / Year 11 / ASD has been struggling with depression since the first lockdown. We're on the waiting list for CAMHS but a long way off seeing anyone yet. Have been trying privately to no avail. He sees the school counsellor which helps a bit.

Everything has been difficult. The first lockdown was 'here's the work, do it in your own time/to own schedule' and that didn't go well. Then there was the autumn term back in school, he hated that and was off sick quite a lot. Last lockdown, just ended, was 'face to face and school timetable' which was also very mixed as he struggled to get up and engage.

Tuesday was first day back and he came home in such a state I thought 'this has to change' too. So I've kept him at home and have asked school if we can look at a reduced timetable and reduced workload. They've suggested this before and they are really helpful. However they want him to pop in to do his next covid test this morning, and then go in for a face to face chat. Even this is too much for him and he's refusing to get out of bed.

I've tried everything. Bribery, incentives, compromises, anger (not proud of that), encouragement etc etc. I feel we've reached the end of the line.

Anyone know what would happen if he just never went back? But didn't engage from home either. ie, if he just dropped out. Would they be obliged to assess work done so far and assess him on that? Would we have to un-enrol him? Or would we ask the GP to sign him off as sick (which he is). His grades have always ranged between 6 and 9 for all his subjects. Even his half-arsed mocks in October brought him good results. All enough to get back into the sixth form (although I'm seriously doubting his ability for that but it largely depends whether we're back to some kind of normality by then).

I'm not trying to let him off the hook but just accepting the fact that he is actually sick, but don't want his entire school career to go down the pan and him to leave school with no qualifications.

Any suggestions / insights welcome.

I know he needs to be in education or training until 18.
This can be an approved apprenticeship.
I've heard of some kids taking part of the year off for illness/ mental health and then repeating the year.
Not sure about Y11 though. Have heard of missing y12 and repeating it.

Personally I'd work with the school to find a solution. It's in his interests to leave school with the grades he deserves. How's your relationship with them?

Far as I can tell with my year 11 they've completed the syllabus for most if not all subjects and are working on evidence to support the centre assessed grades which need to be submitted in mid June.

Explain to the school that his mental health has deteriorated to such an extent that he cannot now leave the house. Ask their advice as to how to proceed. Ask them what solutions could be offered. Don't feel that you have do be the imaginative one to come up with the answers.

They probably won't want to lose someone predicted grades 6-9 at this stage, so even if he remains too anxious to go in again, he should be able to be given some grades, rather than simply drop out. You can then focus on finding an apprenticeship or college course for him next year, which can focus on the things he enjoys and which will be less pressurised than school, if you find the right place for him.

Ex teacher here. I've known several children similar to your son, who have thrived after school on a supportive college course, or doing apprenticeships in small companies, who understand the child's strengths and weaknesses ffrom the outset.

Best of luck

Could he be de registered from school now. Spend the next few months doing something self studying on something he is actually interested in - maybe an online class. Doesn't have to be a qualification/exam class - just something interesting and fun.
Then in September enrol in a local college to do English and Maths GCSEs (the basic requirement for anything) and a few other 'level 2' subjects (so GCSE, Btec - depending on what they offer). This will take a year so then he still has 2 more years of post 16 education he is entitled to so he can decide then what path to head down.

Thanks for your responses. I do, luckily, have a good relationship with the school although the person that is most clued-up and supportive (Deputy Head with good knowledge of SEN) is the busiest. So I'm currently dealing with the Year 11 Head (what a poisoned chalice that job is right now!) who is well-meaning but absolutely doesn't understand autism or depression (or she wouldn't have blithely suggested he pops in for a chat ...). He also doesn't like her. But I don't want to antagonise anyone as I know they've been a lot more accommodation than many schools. And I realise that teachers have a lot on right now and no clear guidance. I realise my son probably isn't the only one in this situation.

The school is a selective state school. They push the kids hard and are used to getting great results. I can see they won't want to let him off the hook too easily.

I have thought about a less-pressured sixth form choice (ie college or a less pressured school) but I'm worried that he would be bored and then more depressed. Until lockdown / depression he had always been a high-achiever and had more or less sailed through academic stuff (more difficulty with the social things). He was expected to get 8/9s for everything (taking 11 subjects) and was in the top 5% of his cohort. Expected to excel and sixth form, and possibly apply for Oxford/Cambridge. It must be very hard for him to see himself crashing to the extent he has.

I know that lots of people that have taken unconventional routes through education, and I completely support that, but I'm worried it would just make his depression worse. What he needs is for things to be back to normal when he goes back in September (which we can't guarantee). He says he's looking forward to a clean slate in September in sixth form, doing the subjects he's interested in.

He's always seen himself at University studying the subject he loves. I think he would be more depressed if he thought that wouldn't happen. But obviously life is turning out differently.

He has no practical skills or interests so difficult to see him outside of academia just yet!

My dd dropped out of school in Yr 10 because of severe depression and anxiety. We paid several arms and legs for private tutors and she sat 5 GCSEs through our local 6th form college and got good grades. She didn't want to go on to college. She managed to get on to a 1 year training course with a large national charity, which meant moving out from home (more arms and legs). Since then she's had ups and downs but she's now 23, living in the big city, with a good job - not that well-paid but good prospects - and self supporting. Her mental health is still up and down sometimes, but she's basically doing fine.

GCSE's are important, but the school may be able to help you find a way for him to do the necessary assessments or whatever without having to attend. Exam boards have provisions for making special arrangements for students with mental health issues - he's not the first and he won't be the last - so you should be confident in asking for help for your son. It's in no one's interests to have him leave school with no qualifications.

Also, ring your GP and push for an urgent referral to CAMHS. If his mental health has worsened to such an extent that you're looking at him dropping out of school, they really should be pushing him up the queue. I know none of us likes being 'that parent', but if you don't tell them what's going on, they can't know how bad it is - I was told off (gently) for not getting help for my DD sooner.

You have all my sympathy. It's a really tough situation and I felt utterly desperate most of the time. All you can do is keep trying, keep asking for help, and don't despair.

I have a bright year 9 boy with ASD/SN register.

If he is saying he wants to do 6th form where he is I would go with that as I've found change of school unsettles mine for 6 months plus you have issues with different teachers and them adapting. Doing well academically is very important to mine and ed pscych said its been found its more important to ASD kids.

I would speak to school and try and find a solution to this year. If he absolutely cannot manage it I would get a GP to sign him off and then they will presumably use what evidence they have to assess him though this might be lower than if he continued. If there's anyway he can manage school I would get him to go in as I know signed off mine would be doing nothing as he would see no point in studying and has no hobbies (outside our pets). Avoiding fear tends to increase it and its likely to worsen his mental health.

I would try and find out if you can get anything out of him what is bothering him about school now - is it the testing? Mine has been going mute and running like crazy any time its mentioned so see if that is the issue. It could be first day back they were talking about it, that sends mine into a frenzy. If that is the case school can make adaptions or you can opt out. We were offered a home test or opt out and once I did that DS was fine about return to school. With lockdown I have to read and write everything for him but he has really struggled this lockdown and has probably fallen behind whereas last 2 I could keep him up to date by doing this. Socially he's regressed massively. I wish he could repeat a year but wouldn't be possible and probably best to save that for a later year incase its needed then.

Hope you can find a solution.

The things bothering him: utterly bored of most of his subjects (even the ones he likes are now boring). I think this would have been the case anyway as school is such an exams factory. He is overwhelmed on a sensory level. He gets on ok with most people but finds a lot of his peers just really irritating. He can't concentrate or focus (same at home and at school). He is fed up of his teachers (they're trying their best but I can see some of them are irritating).

He used to get through the school day by knowing that he would have a good time at the extra-curricular stuff. Now that's all gone. The out-of-school hobby stuff is now almost entirely online which he is fed up of. School is all the bad bits and none of the good bits. His best friends are from outside school and he doesn't get to see them because their shared hobbies aren't happening right now (although he's in touch online and goes out for walks with them). He realises how much he needed the promise of the good stuff to help him through school life. This is the root not only of his aversion to school but his deep depression. And it's largely out of our hands.

Get him to GP for a blood test. He might be anaemic, folate deficient or Most likely of all Vitamin D deficient . At this time of year his vitamin D levels will be at their lowest.
Failing blood test, give him a good supplement daily...1000iu a day for a week is better than nothing.
My son was very depressed in Year 12 Feb, and it was this. Vit D deficient. Dr prescribed big loading dose. I've heard others whose kids were B12 deficient and needed an injection.

I think it is desperately important that there is a proper communication between you and the school and you ask all the questions you have asked here. Could you do it via Zoom with your son?

He is on track for some good GCSEs - qualifications that will enable him to go down the route he wants to in September. You should concentrate on “preserving” those grades as far as possible within the realms of what he can actually physically and mentally cope with right now. If the school has expectations that are unrealistic then you could deregister but you would need to then home educate and it raises the question of whether or not the school can actually enter him for his GCSEs and submit grades.

Sorry, pressed post too soon.

Ideally it needs to be a joint effort between school, CAHMS, doctors, parents and himself to come up with a solution that he is able to cope with. You are on his side, and you can see his mental health is far more important to you than anything else. So many children have been severely affected by this. But if he doesn’t get a few GCSEs then he won’t be able to do what he wants to do in September so there is scope for the situation to impact him further.

There’s no exams this year to worry about so that’s a blessing. The teachers know his abilities. Can he work on a reduced timetable focussing on key subjects only or those needed for his plans in September? Can he have work sent home (would he even do it?). Does school already have enough to assess him?

It’s just so close to crunch time that you don’t have all the information you need to be able to decide and help him.

I think clubs are supposed to be coming back - my DS won't do any as he likes to get out of school first chance possible - I think schools are overwhelmed with the testing programmes at the moment but it maybe once the first three tests are over you hear about the clubs. Sports things generally (outside) are back March 29th and more things April 12th hopefully. Maybe ask school about clubs coming back, may give him something to look forward to / motivate him to go in.

Mine also does the its boring / peers and teachers are irritating (especially irritating seem to be the teachers who insist you work though he likes that these ones can keep classes quiet). He goes to a comp where the teachers sometimes try and make lessons fun and he also gets very grumpy about that esp if it involves dancing or singing. He's like trying to teach Muttley the dog.

I would be very wary of deregistering and check with school - I wouldn't but if you are tempted to check it doesn't take him out of GCSE entries.

School deputy head has just emailed to say she's called CAMHS to see if they can move him up the list (she made the original referral and has all our details and permission to go ahead).

Suggested a meeting / phone call / Zoom with us to discuss.

Said that dropping out now would have an affect on his grades and she worries it would affect sixth form transition (I agree). Son isn't actually saying he won't go back at all but, given his lack of application, our realistic expectations of him are decreasing by the day.

Crying grateful tears though that there are some fab people in that school. I know this is not always the case.

Thanks for the latest responses. I see I am not alone.

There is a bit of light at the end of the tunnel as some out-of-school activities are coming back in person (as opposed to online). And we're hoping for some good stuff in the summer (although I'm cautious about what we should allow ourselves to count on). I don't think school clubs will start again any time soon as they've got enough with all the testing, bubbles, one-way systems etc. His activities are indoors, sadly, and he doesn't really do any sport (which by being outside is so much easier). So school has just become a really unlikeable place with bad associations and there's nothing to be done about that, even with everyone's willingness.

There's also a bit of low-level bullying/cliqueyness which he can normally deal with but it's another thing on the long list of things to be pissed off about. He doesn't want anyone to get involved as he says it's pointless and it's more about the atmosphere a group of kids creates rather than anything he can report them for. That really grinds my gears as you'd like to think kids could damn well be kind now, after all this, and aged 16, wouldn't you? This group is still acting like a bunch of silly unpleasant little kids. The more I think about it, the more I understand why he doesn't want to be there.

@Silkies - that comment about Muttley the Dog makes me laugh - thank you. Yes, absolutely my son too! He loathes fun activities - would rather do past exam papers. God forbid someone asks him to do a revision poster. He got very upset last week that one of the teachers (of his best subject) set them an escape room to do online. He spent most of the time re-entering the answers onto a badly-designed Google form, trying to guess what formatting it needed, rathe than actual question-solving. Poor teacher was just trying to lighten things up a bit. He was fuming.

@Nettleskeins - we' started giving him multivitamins at Xmas, and that includes Vitamin D. Also trying to get him to eat as healthily as possible.

He had blood tests for various things back in Oct and again in November as I was worried he might have glandular fever as he had been struggling with sore throats (I remember being v depressed and had GF at his age). But it was negative. However, he also suffers from really bad constipation (possibly a sensory issue, linked to ASD I reckon) and the GP made the connection between that and his slightly high bilirubin count when they did a liver function blood test. They think he might have Gilbert's Syndrome. He's been referred to gastroenterology - came up with an appointment for May, which has now been delayed until July. Was also referred to ENT for recurring voice/throat problems - telephone appointment in May! For that we actually went private and saw an ENT consultant in December - nothing wrong as far as he could see, possibly stress/reflux. So, we have tried to look into underlying health conditions but it's very hard with all the restrictions and delays in appointments. He's often very out of touch with how he feels in his body - when he was little he often didn't complain about feeling unwell until things (like throat / ear infections etc) were really far progressed. I'm sure it's an ASD thing. Poor lad - he's complicated!

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/secondary/4187986-Y11-DD-struggling-to-finish-school
Hopefully this link to my post earlier this week might work as it’s a similar situation
To add we have had a long conversation with Head of Pastoral on the phone today and have a meeting to include DD on Monday which will be around how we can get her to at least finish with her GCSEs done.
It sounds like your DS is less cooperative than DD which is hard, we CAN make her go to school but it’s heartbreaking to watch. I really feel for your family OP

I would try as hard as you can to work with school to get him his grades at least. If you de-register now it's unlikely they will award him any grades at all and you would face starting all over again if he wants to take GCSEs in future.
If you have a supportive school, use that to your son's advantage.

I would offer him a bribe to get back to school on Monday as surely lack of routine and focus will make depression worse. I think the return to school this week will have polarised yr 11 into two camps, those relieved to be back and those with anxiety over going straight back in to mask wearing, other Covid rules and assessments. Many will have come back anxious after day 1 but found each day since slightly easier. Is there any way you could afford a couple of private cbt sessions now?

I would also ask the school if they could run one lunchtime club that would incentivise your DS to go back

@Hoppinggreen - thanks for your post - yes I saw yours. Glad you have a plan!

I'm happy to report back that we have had a very productive couple of days sorting things out with school, while my son stays at home. They have been brilliant - I'm so grateful to the Asst Head who is my main source of support.

We've arranged that from next week, DS will go in at the normal time each day (although he go in later if he is having a particularly bad morning), and will stay until lunchtime. Then he will come home and do the rest of the lessons at home. This means he can avoid the difficult social interactions at lunchtime and come home before he is overwhelmed.

He's struggling with the environment of a couple of subjects (where the emphasis is on pair work and speaking) and so it's agreed that those lessons can be done remotely from one of the SEN support rooms.

Teachers have been instructed to make all the work accessible online (which they're mostly doing anyway) but to reduce the workload for him so that it's only the essentials that he has to do. We've agreed he'll focus mainly on the subject he wants to do in Sixth Form.

He also has an exit card so that he can leave a class at anytime and go to the SEN dept, or reception. They've just asked that he emails a teacher to say where he is so that they don't worry about him missing (he's on self-harm/suicide watch).

We've agreed to meet online next Friday to review how the week has gone.

He'll continue with the counselling. I'm not sure how many sessions he has left from the school's allocation but I'm going to see if we can book to see the same counsellor privately when the school sessions end. If that isn't possible, we'll find someone else.

Bribing and incentives just don't work. I've been making that mistake for months. He's 16 and almost suicidal - there's really nothing I can offer him which makes a difference. It's heartbreaking.

I’m glad you have a plan too and have had a productive few days
I think heartbreaking is the word, even though they are 16 you just want to be able to give them a cuddle and a lollipop and make it all better!
My heart breaks at the thought of DD alone at lunchtime when i know she is such a genuinely kind person and a loyal friend while the more “sparky” kids are surrounded by friends.
Let’s hope all of the anxious Y11s find their tribes at college or wherever they go and flourish there.

Sounds like you’ve got a fairly positive plan for next week and I really hope that it works for you all.

@BrightBlueCast So glad to read that the school have been helpful and you have a plan for next week. Hope all goes well.

Honestly, every child I see, I wonder what's going on in their developing brains right now. Especially hard for those in the middle of hormonal turmoil. And hard for those whose brains are differently wired anyway. As we know, mental health support in this country is woefully inadequate anyway ... puts more strain on the school who have to step and fill the gap.