Exams cancelled 2

[Orangeblossom1977]

Started a new thread as last one is full.

MrsHamlet I totally realise that teachers are never informed anything earlier than anyone else (ridiculously). It was a genuine question and not in the slightest meant as a criticism.
Both ‘priorities’ have their pros and cons and I don’t think either way is better for everyone. I was just curious.

I'm another one who thinks that exams should have gone ahead, amended and with special considerations applied. This situation of individual schools having to come up with their own grades because Ofqual basically couldn't figure out a solution themselves but weren't allowed to say 'exams are back on' is outrageous.

@noblegiraffe my DD suffers with anxiety and definitely performs better on coursework than exams but even she has stated that they should have just left it with exams this year instead of constantly changing things. I was surprised to say the least! However, as she didn't perform to her best in the December mocks I'm hoping the coursework element and teacher assessment will help her grades...although I'm nervous about the second set of mocks due when they go back.

We got an email from DS1’s school today. It says very very clearly that they will not be doing mock exams or any sort of exams set by the Government. They will use end of unit tests and school based tests to determine their grading. Not sure what to think about that...I think it’s good news as he could really do without the stress (it’s his 16th birthday today as well) but I expected some sort of exam.

Our school is opting into the mini-assessments because they can still select which ones they want to use and which topics. They will set a mark scheme and they have decided that in the event of any queries these will be the easiest methods for the exam boards to quality assess their grades against other schools.

when I say they will set a mark scheme I mean the exam board rather than the school.

The mini assessments can't be accurately graded though surely. I'm thinking of maths and you can't grade by question or by marks if the papers aren't all the same.

iheart I think there's a bit of a fallacy that the government mini tests will be more like an exam than anything schools do. They will all feel the same. Schools will want as much evidence as possible, if a previous 7 kid gets a 6, they'll do more assessment to show a 7. The devil will be in the detail, but who knows when that's coming. Hopefully before Easter so I can spend the holiday digesting and go to students with a plan!

I was more concerned that they were going to be made to full mocks as they hadn’t done them yet.

Am I right in thinking that a dc who has completed the whole syllabus for a subject could potentially get the same grade as a dc who has only done half the course?

"katieloves* yes.

iheart The schools internal assessment will probably include full (or nearly full) mocks.

@HercwasanEnemyofEducation

That’s what I thought but the letter we got today says very clearly in bold italics, please tell your children that they will not be sitting any form of mocks or formal assessments/exams this year. The teachers will undertake classroom assessments to inform them of their final grade along with the work completed this year. And then repeats again, this means no mocks as planned and no exams.

Not sure what that means to be honest.

I think it means no mocks in the hall. The internal teacher assessments will be pretty much the same content they would have done in a mock. I can't see how else they can grade them. Possibly some subjects can do unit tests or essay questions on a single topic. Maths can't!

Of course the mini assessments can be accurately graded even if different. For example, different schools use different history papers because they do different topics. Going rate boundaries can be set at different points. So for example, of one maths assessment is deemed harder than another the grade boundaries will be set differently. The reason our school is opting to use them is because there can be no dispute from the exam.board that the material used to assess the grades was inadequate.

I very much suspect that if only half the course is covered the head of centre may not be able to complete the required declaration thay sufficient amount of the course has been covered but that level of detail will presumably be in the details die to be sent by the end of this term

The mini assessments for some subjects will be fine to accurately grade, see history, English and humanities generally.

Maths is an outlier really when it comes to assessment. Our whole focus is a terminal exam that assesses 'everything' with students walking in in normal years knowing they haven't been taught 'everything'. Grades come from a huge statistical process that is worked out once all the scores are in (for every subject). This won't happen this year obviously but if you start cutting bits off past papers etc you then can't grade accurately. I doubt the exam board stuff will come with grades attached.....

Mark schemes don't normally come with grades - it's quite hard to award a grade to a mark scheme with 4 bands and 8 marks!

So for example, of one maths assessment is deemed harder than another the grade boundaries will be set differently.

This isn’t how grade boundaries are sat at all. Grade boundaries are set after the exams have been sat, once the results are in and to fit a desired grade profile. If the grade boundaries end up lower it’s assumed it was a more difficult paper but that’s not necessarily true. The first set of papers for any new syllabus always has weird low grade boundaries, not because the paper was more difficult but because the first cohort is worse prepared for the exam than subsequent cohorts (sawtooth effect) but still needs to get the same grade profile.

Any grade boundaries set on mini assessments or whatever are just people making stuff up.

@noblegiraffe

So does that mean that they will have to do some kind of formal assessment then as opposed to just “tests” in class which is what DS1’s school are implying?

Schools can do whatever they like. They can decide to use work completed at home or not if they like so they can probably use in class assessments.

What teachers are being asked to do (apply a grade as if it measures a standard of work) is impossible as that’s not how grades have been assigned up to now. They’ve been assigned to data points on a graph.

It means each school will have its own approach and there will be inconsistencies.

@noblegiraffe

Thank you. I’m actually really pleased if that’s the case.

What teachers are being asked to do (apply a grade as if it measures a standard of work) is impossible as that’s not how grades have been assigned up to now.
I’m finding this really hard to get my head around. Whilst I appreciate grades are given post exams and follow a bell curve, they must still be of a standard(ish). All through Yr10/11 they get grades (1-9) alongside their term test percentages and median percentages. So teachers are applying a grade to the percentage test scores every term. They also (usually) start predicting outcomes every half term starting from autumn of yr11. Same applies to yr12/13 students. I think the majority of teachers are quite skilled at applying a grade to a student’s ability at their subject.

All through Yr10/11 they get grades (1-9) alongside their term test percentages and median percentages. So teachers are applying a grade to the percentage test scores every term.

Not in every school; we don't report like that.

What no one tells you is that grade report data from schools is pretty much BS. It's worse this year as teachers have so little data to look at.

No, I appreciate that not all schools will grade. But I am finding it difficult to comprehend how its’s BS. I respect both you & noble. You’re both saying the same thing. I’m still finding it difficult to understand.

A lot of what's marked in school in my dept is based on a feeling rather than a mark scheme.

There are 4 lit mark schemes and 6 Lang ones with some being used more than once with different mark ranges. None have 9 bands.
I use mark schemes for every exam question I do from year 10 because I believe that students need to know where they are. So if you have missed an assessment objective, your mark reflects that - just as it would in the exam.
I'm lucky because I examine one lit paper and one Lang paper so I know that I am accurate. My colleague who also marks uses mark schemes with his class.
But when we convert raw marks from assessments to grades, we don't use the real grade boundaries for the year (we could), we make them fit the bell curve we want. So 26/30 might have been an 8 for the specific paper but that's our highest mark so we make it 9. Of course that is how real grade boundaries are determined, but with 500,000 candidates rather than 200.
We report expected grades termly and are expected to use those internal assessments to do so. We're using the same system we used when grades and mark schemes were linked... but that's a long time ago.
And maths have an even bigger problem of course because maths does not work like that.

CIE are saying that their grading will need to have at least 3 susbstantive pieces of work lasting at least one hour included in the work required to asess grades. This would go someway of being able to set an entire past paper with genuine grade boundaries then.

But when we convert raw marks from assessments to grades, we don't use the real grade boundaries for the year (we could), we make them fit the bell curve we want. So 26/30 might have been an 8 for the specific paper but that's our highest mark so we make it 9. Of course that is how real grade boundaries are determined, but with 500,000 candidates rather than 200.

But if you are manipulating your curve when there is a genuine grade boundary already set as in this example surely you are doing your students a disservice to award them a higher grade as they then have an unrealistic expectation as to where they are genuinely performing. I understand how it would work if you want to grade harshly to encourage them to continue working well rather than becoming complacent.