Is this a poor combination of A levels

[Comefromaway]

English Lit
Drama
Film Studies

Child thinks she would like to be a drama teacher in the future. Doesn't like maths & science. Is very hard working but has no confidence in her abilities. GCSE predictions 4/5 in sciences 6/7 in maths & language 7/8 in English & essay subjects. Doing history GCSE but doesn't enjoy it. Gets very anxious about not being good enough.

It's not. I don't think that's right, but it is a fact that people will treat it differently to e.g. French or Maths

Yes, if you want to do French or Maths at uni!

Film Studies is a valid discipline that exists for decades; there are degrees in Film Studies in many universities, including at top ten universities in the UK - i.e. Warwick.

Media and Communications studies is another example. There is a Media and Communications department at London School of Economics.

It is not only snobbery to fob off media and film studies, it is tory twattery.

Film Studies and Media/Communication Studies are not useful subjects or degrees. The mass media are a batch of liars and deep state dopes pushing liberal ideologies on young people with skulls full of mush.

Moreover, succeeding in either field is unlikely. Better she study something that pays. Has she considered Accountancy?

That combination of subjects is not going to be a problem for English Literature or Drama courses at almost any university in the country. There’s a lot of nonsense out there about universities being really picky about subject choice but that just isn’t what I see from the offers students get. Everything else bring equal does history look more impressive than Film Studies? Yes. Will a C in history beat an A in Film Studies? No.
Students do best when they are in the right courses. Ones they like and are good at.

As a head of Sixth Form I could cry at the number of times I see artsy kids take a Maths A Level that they have no interest in and have just scraped the entry criteria for because they think they need it for architecture. Some of them swap after a few weeks but occasionally they plough on and come out with grade profiles like A A E or ABU and end up with no architecture offers. We’ve had kids get into architecture with Art, Photography and BTEC Graphics A A D or Art, Graphics and History A D* A. No good ever comes from kids studying subjects they aren’t interested in. She should do what she thinks she will get the best grades in and enjoy, she has to live with the choice for two years.

@Ericaequites no one needs to spend years studying accountancy in order to be an accountant. You can enter accountancy with any degree, or without a degree as long as you have decent A Levels (subjects don’t matter). I did a History degree which I really enjoyed but a good Film Studies degree would do fine. The best graduate I ever worked with (in a top 4 accountancy firm) had a Sport Science degree from a ‘new’ university.

A drama teacher is a fine job. My best friend was one, and went on to a masters in her 30s and now teaches at a uni on a great salary. Why would someone with a passion for drama and teaching want to become an accountant? Weird.

Why would she want to be an accountant? She should aim for a job where her talents lie.

Many architecture degrees do require maths A level so I guess that’s why dc take it!

The least competitive courses don’t care about A levels and some architecture courses are not competitive and the employment levels are not great either. Just getting in is just the first rung on the ladder. Schools rarely know what happens to dc after they go to university. Architects are over supplied by universities. Employers can be picky.

My DD has advised on careers at her old school. She knows what it takes to do what she does. Teachers, quite simply, don’t. They have no experience in it and reading minimum entry requirements is never the same as what actually happens in real life when the competition for jobs is fierce.

I talked my daughter out of doing Media as a GCSE, in part due to comments rubbishing the course on here. I regret interfering, the GCSE she replaced it was a source of lots of stress, and she has dropped it now. She still says how interesting the work looks on the media course. She would have enjoyed it and had one more GCSE.
Really, just let your daughter make her own choices, she's far more likely to get good grades in the subjects she enjoys. Mumsnet has an 'attitude' to certain subjects. And whilst some subjects may be more desirable, failing a subject is even less desirable.

@MadameMinimes
Fabulous post. I try to stay away from education on Mumsnet, but this post made my day.
Although unfortunately, my child might be one of the arty kids going into sciences, her school doesn't look like it will run Art A' level next year☹️ But I have made it clear she's to go with her own choices.

The mumsnet attitude to A levels is so wrong headed I don't know where to begin. Thank goodness there are more and more posters that can see through it.

@MrsMiaWallis

It's not. I don't think that's right, but it is a fact that people will treat it differently to e.g. French or Maths

Yes, if you want to do French or Maths at uni!

Not only that. A more diverse range of subjects can be better where people wish to keep broader options open as things/ideas can change between 16 and 18.

Where people are certain, that is fine.

I had a child who picked four sciences, we had the same conversation in reverse about potentially picking something with greater written content. In the end they thought it through themselves and made the right choice for them.

Assuming all A-Levels are viewed equally by any future employer is not helpful.

Many people do niche things. They just need to think that through.

But this child doesn't want to do French and Maths. She is doing English Literature and Drama, both of which are well regarded A levels. Film Studies might not be regarded as well as History if you are applying to a top law firm, but that isn't what she wants to do!

Niche? Chemistry is probably more niche than Film studies tbh!

@MrsMiaWallis

But this child doesn't want to do French and Maths. She is doing English Literature and Drama, both of which are well regarded A levels. Film Studies might not be regarded as well as History if you are applying to a top law firm, but that isn't what she wants to do!

She could potentially go on to read English Lit at a RG uni and then go on to do any job that requires a very good degree. Why are people so adamant that they know best?!

Of course posters think they know best! That’s why they post. They are not held to account for their posts. Anyone that posts that the DD should do accountancy is just weird. She isn’t going to do Maths or French either! So what’s the point of that post?!

She’s made choices based on what she does wish to do and presumably what she’s good at. She might look for an alternative to Film Studies but for a drama degree - who really cares? Some high brow employers might not like this A level but for her career (and Dad already teaches Drama) what’s the great issue? She could look to doing English and Drama at university which, in my opinion, makes her more likely to be employed by a school because she’s offering two subjects. If she’s intent on drama only, there are less opportunities in mainstream schools. None will worry too much what the drama teachers did at A level.

It's always posters whose kids did 4 sciences, or 4 "hard" A levels that come on as well. not so Stealth boasting

@MrsMiaWallis

But this child doesn't want to do French and Maths. She is doing English Literature and Drama, both of which are well regarded A levels. Film Studies might not be regarded as well as History if you are applying to a top law firm, but that isn't what she wants to do!

I never suggested this individual child did want to do French or Maths, I simply said that French or Maths might be more highly regarded by many people than Film Studies. I also said I would never try to persuade someone to do a subject they don't want to do.

I'm not sure that we disagree about what this child should do.

My view, which isn't very controversial, is that a range of subjects keeps more options open later, which is worth doing, unless a) you need a particular set of subjects for a particular route or b) you really know you only want to do a clump of subjects.

@MrsMiaWallis

It's always posters whose kids did 4 sciences, or 4 "hard" A levels that come on as well. not so Stealth boasting

You sound like you have a chip on your shoulder with that comment.

@PresentingPercy

Of course posters think they know best! That’s why they post. They are not held to account for their posts. Anyone that posts that the DD should do accountancy is just weird. She isn’t going to do Maths or French either! So what’s the point of that post?!

She’s made choices based on what she does wish to do and presumably what she’s good at. She might look for an alternative to Film Studies but for a drama degree - who really cares? Some high brow employers might not like this A level but for her career (and Dad already teaches Drama) what’s the great issue? She could look to doing English and Drama at university which, in my opinion, makes her more likely to be employed by a school because she’s offering two subjects. If she’s intent on drama only, there are less opportunities in mainstream schools. None will worry too much what the drama teachers did at A level.

Not that it makes any difference but she’s not our dd. She’s a friend of our family & she looks to us for advice sometimes. (& dh teaches another vocational subject to drama school students, not actually drama)

You sound like you have a chip on your shoulder with that comment do I? I just can't bear it when posters come on and read a post about A levels and immediately jump on them as " not facilitating" (doesn't exist), "why doesn't she do 4" (majority of schools don't offer this any more except further maths) and shadowy "industry" who will drop you like a hot potato despite your English Lit degree from a great uni because you've got Film Studies rather than History (this may happen in a handful of top flight graduate schemes but not to any great extent). Fwiw I have one who did three non facilitating subjects and went to a russell group uni tondo a degree that would make plenty of mumsnetters spontaneously combust, and another dd who.did subjects much approved of by mumsnet and has offers from 3 top unis so far, so I don't think I'm chippy- just aggravated by the irrelevance and out of date crap that gets spouted on any mumsnet A level thread

"Facilitating" subjects, essentially do exist. They are now called "A levels that keep options open". Cambridge university helpfully list them. However, when you know what you want to do, they have little relevance if the course does not require one or more of them. It is that simple. Drama is good for Drama. Photography is good for Photography. Music is essential for Music. None are facilitating! English Lit goes perfectly with Drama. So there simply is no problem. I think the bigger poroblem is plotting a career path! The degree is a vehicle, not a guarantee of a job.

English Lit is on the Cambridge list. There are loads of subjects the DD involved could do with her choices. However they won't stretch as far as they might have done if she had made alternative A level choices. But it doesn't matter, does it? And apologies to OP for misinterpreting her DH's job.

It is not correct to say to ALL young people that subjects do not matter. At very competitive universities (and not all RG are by any means) they will take not all sorts of A levels on every course. It is as simple as that. On lots of courses at RG universities they will. Eg sociology, law, philosophy, film and photography, international relations, American studies, marketing, education, journalism, communication and media (and plenty more), are all possible with non-facilitating A levels. Any course where none in particular are specified you have a decent shot without facilitating subjects, but not if it is wildly competitive, in many instances, and the university considers some subjecs are better prep than others. It really depends what DC want to do and what the course info suggests is a useful subject.

It is not correct to say the old list of facilitating subjects is useless. It is not. However, for lots of DC, one of these subjects will do. For other DC they simply don't need any of them for RG courses. Always check first. If you do not have any idea about university, course or career, include at least one!

I just want to be clear that I don’t think subject choices are completely irrelevant for all students. There are plenty of instances where subject choice does matter and the formerly “facilitating” subjects certainly keep more options open. I teach a facilitating subject myself.

Studying a subject that you have no interest in or particular aptitude for is never a good choice though. Kids with great grades in three “facilitating” subjects have more options than those with the same grades in non-facilitating subjects. What all of this misses is the fact that those with poor-mediocre grades have fewer choices than those with good grades. Students on courses that they don’t enjoy and aren’t interested in get worse grades. In the nicest possible way, if you’re not especially good at GCSE maths and aren’t very interested in it, then any degree that requires A Level Maths is probably not for you anyway, so leaving it theoretically open as an option is pointless. A degree or career that involves a huge amount of Maths is not right for you.

Young people are unique individuals with different talents and interests and there are a whole range of careers and degrees out there. A subject profile like the one in the OP is perfectly fine for a degree in English or Drama or American Studies or any one of a number of other Arts and Humanities subjects. Yes, it will rule out engineering or history or psychology degrees at most or all unis, but that’s fine if the young person is clear about that and has no interest in pursuing those subjects. If you want to be a drama teacher it’s a good combination.

If a student had real interest in both History and Sociology, or both French and Film Studies and was struggling to choose between them then my advice would be to take the History or the French but I’d never direct a student towards a subject they don’t have any interest in.

MFL are very hard to get top grades in, so I'd definitely recommend Film Studies over French if the student was likely to get a good grade in it!

Our MFL department get excellent grades and students don’t get lower grades than in other subjects. I think that’s probably a combination of excellent teachers and small class sizes, so that is never really a concern for me.