11plus

[oneboy3girls]

Cat Score Verbal=120.Non Verbal =105 Quantitative== 124 Spatial= 108 Average =114 .Son =yr 7

Would my son have passed the 11plus with these scores .I presume it may vary depending on the Grammar.Thanks.

It’s not an exact science. Depends on preparation, coping with stress, speed and exam technique etc Grammar exams are also often about things you’ve learnt and not just ability. And yes, some grammars are much more selective than others.
I think he would have had a chance at some.

Thankyou.Any other experience from anyone? Thankyou.

CAT scores are measures of potential; more for determining suitability for grammar, as opposed to whether they might pass. Sadly the chances of passing the 11plus, are often very much skewed by over eager tuition and preparation, which for a borderline child, can lead to a great sense of pressure and under-achievement at grammar. Purely because grammar schools don’t have any magic formula of success or extra great teaching to offer, they simply want the exam machines. The kids who learn it quickly and churn out good grades.
As for my experience; eldest had VR scores of mid 120s, lower NVR, averaged 122. We didn’t tutor, and she missed 11plus by one mark. However..she did very well in secondary, and is now at a good RG uni, having had the right measure of skills required to be organised and motivated towards doing well. My youngest has scored very very highly in 11plus, and had mostly maximum score CATS that reflected that.
My nephew was borderline CATS, average 116. Passed 11plus with tuition..did very averagely at grammar. Flunked A levels pretty badly too. So it was the wrong choice for him. Every case is different of course. Only you and the school, really know your child’s capabilities.

My daughter passed the Bucks 11+ this year with no tuition other than doing Bond books at home.

Her scores were consistently in the mid to high 120s before we started practicing. Your son’s spatial and non verbal scores look low and IMO these are the areas that are hardest to practice - you either get it or you don’t.

Thanks .Helpful comments .Any more ?

@oneboy3girls What is it that you’re hoping to hear?

My son passed the 11+ following a review, all his scores were 120+ and he was borderline. Very minimal tutoring just to get to grips with the exam format. This was the beginning of year 6 for Trafford.

JoJo. We may be moving long distance and catchment area has Grammar Schools. That is why I am asking. Currently at Comprehensive. Thanks for replies.

Not a grammar area but my daughter is in a selective grammar.

We did no tutoring or practise papers but reasoning was standard in her primary curriculum.

Your son’s score wouldn’t have been enough to pass for her school/the boys’ school the year DD entered.

So this is not for the 11+, but for an in-year application for a grammar school after a move?

That changes the goalposts a lot - you need to look very closely at the in-year application procedures for the schools in the area that you are moving to.

The test may well not be the standard 11+, or even of a similar type or format.

My experience is with South London grammars and places for in-year applicants are very rare so 99% of children moving over during secodary go to one of the comps. If a place does arise, candidates sit a test and the best one gets in provided they’re good enough.

JoJo - that's similar to those i am aware of - those moving into the area cannot even sit a test unless and until a place arises. If there is no place, then the child is kept on a list to be summoned to a test should a place arise in the future.

While in-year applications may be different elsewhere, it's probably worth planning for a move to a location where the 'non-grammar' alternative is acceptable in the short to medium term in case no place is available - and in the longer term if the child fails to be of high enough standard to join the grammar. The standard for in-year applicants may well be higher than for standard Y7 applicants.

My DD went to a London grammar, not sure of CATS results but almost every child there had 3 x 120 at SATS. Very few places come up after September of year 7, one a year maybe and lots after it.

Some grammar schools are more selective than others. The very selective ones normally have very few children leaving. There's an 11 plus forum website which has details of individual schools.

Places at DD’s grammar are even more competitive for an in-year place. Places rarely come up and when they do there are a significant number sitting a test for the one place and the highest scoring gets the place. You are competing with those who’ve been in independents, expats returning home, other grammars etc.

OP, are the non-selective schools in the area you’re looking at not good? Have you spoken to the Local Authority there?

His Sats were 120x2 115x1.Local Authority not helpful.Non-Selective schools are ok/good enough.I don't want to bring subject up with him if there is not much hope .This has all been useful.Thanks.Hopefully we will not be moving.

So is he is a comp now and you were hoping to move and for him to get a place in a grammar rather than a comp?

It's very much not an exact science, but I would say that most of those who pass comfortably around here without major cramming score 120+ in CATs. But there are always some who score lower and pass, and some who score higher and don't. As others have said, the issue for you may be more likely to be the lack of an available space, plus the competition with other applicants on score for any space that comes up (if that's how it works in your local grammars), than whether or not your DC would have passed first time round.

So is he is a comp now and you were hoping to move and for him to get a place in a grammar rather than a comp?

Probably better written as:
"So he is at a true comprehensive now, and you were hoping to move and for him to get a place in the grammar rather than the secondary modern"

Just making the obvious point that comprehensives in non-grammar areas are different from the 'other school in a grammar system', which by definition will lack its proper proportion of higher attainers....

The 'ability peers' of a bright child in a comprehensive in a fully comprehensive area WILL often be in the grammar school in a grammar area.

JOJO .Well ,yes to your question ,but we will live just over the border so we are in a true 'Comprehensive 'area .Don't want to stress him out ,if there is only a slim chance, so won't look into the Grammar option.Thanks.

@cantkeepawayforever

You don’t know where the OP is moving. I’m in a grammar area (5 grammars and 9 non-grammars in my LA) and there are plenty of high attainers to go round. The non-grammars have GCSE pass rates mostly considerably above the national average.

JoJo,

So are you saying that the % of HA coming up from primary is identical in the grammars and non-grammars in your area?

Are you sure?

Don’t really get the ‘true comprehensive area’ argument if you’re saying the non-grammars in the new area are good enough.

@cantkeepawayforever I never said that. I said there are plenty of high achievers in the non-selective schools.

In our old area (a London grammar) the grammar's intake was from around 400 schools with the girls and boys schools taking in 360 a year between them so less than 1 child per primary school. Plenty of bright children going to the comprehensives. The grammar DD went to was also around 90% Asian (7 white kids out of 180) with lots of parents of white bright kids not entering their kids - we did but were very much in the minority and we got many comments of why were we sending DD to an Asian school. The comprehensives there were nothing like secondary moderns. In an area of lots of grammars its different but we are currently in a fully comprehensive area and intake is very similar to a comprehensive in old area. I suspect private intake is higher here.