Study A level maths at home to free up time for other subjects at school?

[Star555]

DS is very bright and motivated and studies advanced maths (A level content) at home during GCSE years, does very well in maths olympiad, etc. He is going to a top independent school with a 6th form which offers a plethora of A level subjects that interest him. At his school usually bright students who want to pursue science/engineering at uni will take up to 5 A level subjects, 2 of which will be maths and further maths. DS thinks using up 2 slots for maths/FM will be a waste of time since he already knows most of the material now and can just revise for the exams at home on his own in the coming years, and maths doesn't involve practical work, trips to historic sites, etc that he would be missing out on. (I myself have postgraduate degree in engineering and can guide him in maths if need be.) He is very interested in humanities as well as science so his ideal A level subject choices at school would be Physics, Chemistry, Computer Science, Latin, and History. Does this sound like a feasible idea? Should I let his school know in advance that he will revise for the maths/FM exams at home and just take the exam at the end? Is there a chance the school may look unfavourably upon this and insist he must do maths at school to take the A level exams? In general is it common for students at top schools to take A level exams for subjects they studied at home instead of in school, assuming there was no coursework requirement for the A level? Thank you for any advice.

Is he doing an EPQ? Ask the school if they offer it, as it does show a student's ability to study in a different way from learning and sitting exams.

Could he take the A level maths early so that he then can study FM in years 12 and 13. He could extend his maths study by doing all the modules of FM, so giving him a better chance of a top grade in it.

7 does seem a lot. Not impossible, but, as other PPs have said, it could be at the expense of him growing as a person.

Could he take the A level maths early so that he then can study FM in years 12 and 13

If he is thinking of applying to Oxbridge I don't think that would be a good idea. They like to see all A levels sat at the same time.

7 A-levels? I don't even know where to start with thoughts on that! I'd be amazed if a decent independent school allows him to become bored in maths. Likewise, if he only wants to do latin and history because he likes trips to museums and lectures, you know he can do that outside of the A level classroom, right? I'd start with less time in the classroom, and more time developing himself and his interests as a human being. Nothing requires 7 A-Levels. (My degree in Neurophysiology from a Russell Group uni asked for 3 and becoming an airline pilot required 2 for a funded place, or none at all if you self-funded.)

I would also worry about the arrogance of "knowing it all" already. This might trip him up if it comes across at interviews.

Ginfordinner , I'm sure 3 or 4 sat at the same time would be more than sufficient to cover entry requirements.

I expect you are right JustRichmal

Sounds like maths, further maths and physics are the vital subjects (whether at home or school).

History sounds like a v hard essay subject where you have to get used to the style of argument - not just string together facts. Latin is a lot of rote learning at a level. Some character analysis etc. I did aS level in 2000s and it was fairly similar to gcse but more literature.

Why not try it out and give him a maths a level paper now/in a few months and see. Is there only 1 sitting for a levels now? Otherwise he could do it in jan or June (though I guess wouldn’t want to distract him from gcses)...

There really is no benefit to 4 A levels per se, universities offer on 3 subject grades only

If you're doing more than 3 for some STEM subjects, Cambridge will offer on 4 of them - I believe to ensure that they don't get kids who apply on the basis of doing 4 and then drop one after getting an offer.

DD is doing engineering at Cambridge, 3 A levels (maths, fm, physics of course) plus a comp sci AS, and an EPQ (designed and built a robot). Many of her peers have done 4 A levels and some from top indies did 5. (They were the last year of the old format so not directly comparable - harder now!). Afaik none have done more, but they generally seem to have other interests - sports, 'arts', rocketry, whatever.... not just schoolwork.

a few thoughts to add to the mix...

A high achieving independent school will go far beyond the curriculum requirements in maths/FM, extending your DS and preparing him well for a demanding STEM university course. He might really be missing out by not studying maths at school.

My DS in similar environment really enjoyed maths/FM. He was reluctant to give up his favourite humanities subjects - in his case modern languages - and was able to arrange extra weekly tuition through school in these subjects.

Also - whilst the course load you describe might be manageable in lower sixth, do be aware that if your DS will be applying to Oxbridge, the applications process can take up a lot of time in the autumn of upper sixth form between finalising UCAS, taking any relevant aptitude tests, preparing for interviews (this can be several hours per week + prep + the odd Saturday mock interview day) and then actually attending the interview which at Oxford is a multi-day affair.

You should certainly let the school know what you are thinking - even beyond the maths at home issue, it can be devilishly difficult to timetable 5 A levels.

My son did 6, but he did maths A level in year 11, and he also went to a school that didn't make him do lots of homework. Art was a lot of work, but nothing else seemed to cause him much stress. I think the flexibility and relaxed attitude of the school made it possible. I don't think it would work if the school was pressured and uptight about it, at least it wouldn't have worked for my son.

He did English, History, Art, Economics, Maths and Further maths. He did them because he wanted to, not for any practical reason like getting into university.

To add to previous comments, if he wants to do engineering at Cambridge, then some colleges require STEP as well as the engineering admissions test. The time required to practice for these should not be underestimated.

Bagels - Actually, the Cambridge engineering aptitude test didn't seem to require much prep - just a good grip on year 12 maths and physics plus some ability to think outside the box. There's just one sample paper and I suppose now a couple of past papers available for practice. No idea where those notions about interview prep come from.

If his school does EPQ, he could base that on a history/Latin topic.

I personally cannot see how there are enough hours in a week to study for 7 A levels, as well as covering the other areas of the curriculum involved in 6th form life - sports, UCAS applications, preparation for uni exams/interviews, 6th form duties such as prefects etc, leaving aside any extracurricular (which are important) such as DofE, music, hobbies outside of school.

If the school could timetable 5 A levels, your DS would have no free periods and would need to do all the extra work after school (homework, reading around hte subject, research for essays etc). Goodness knows when he would do the work for his Maths.

It sounds like madness to me.

If he really wants to study history and Latin, do those A levels, and choose a degree/career around something he loves.

To add to previous comments, if he wants to do engineering at Cambridge, then some colleges require STEP as well as the engineering admissions test

Only 2 (Christ's and Peterhouse) it's absolutely not the norm.

www.admissions.eng.cam.ac.uk/guide/requirements

It's an utterly stupid idea, the sort of thing a supremely arrogant and immature 15 year old would come out with - you as his parent should know better.

Frankly if his interest in History and Latin is genuine, the last thing he'd want to do is be restricted by the A level syllabus.

Gin cognitive neuroscience with psychology

That's useful info, thanks Errol :)

I’m afraid I agree with Titchy here. My nephew studied 4 including Maths & FM, and is now at Cambridge. He also had a lot of extra-curricular interests, and a life beyond his books... I just cannot see how studying 7 A levels would ever enable him to do this. Social skills and the ability to mix and integrate, are as, if not more important than the academics. Encourage your son to have a life beyond his studies.

He's seriously reducing his chances of getting into Oxbridge by spreading himself too thin. I think you need to encourage him to take a longer term view. He can pursue his other academic interests for the rest of his life.

He should really be focusing on demonstrating his interest in applied physics/engineering with supra-curricular activities.

but they still will have that memory that I did go out with them

I agree. The students at DD's 6th form who did nothing but study, without any outside interests all failed to get into OXbridge, even though some of them achieved A A A A.

I do think OP's DS need to think about what he really want to learn at University in the end. I can understand that OP's DS might be supper bright, but to be honest, there are lots of supper bright students competing for the Oxbridge places. DC need to demonstrate his passion and ability in the chosen subject. Nearly most of the applicants have all A* predictions.

And to bear in mind, there also times needed for preparing extra entry exam and interviews.

Oops. Ignore the first bit of my last post

would also worry about the arrogance of "knowing it all" already. This might trip him up if it comes across at interviews.

Very little experience ( 1 son , 1 application ) but I do have to agree with this @ginfordinner) DS did a humanities subject & all good but learned a great deal from good teachers in 6th form ( outside syllabus - just talking and untested - but stood in good stead for interview. )

It sounds to me like he needs a serious chat with school to understand what his real options are. I strongly suspect he'll find that 5 A levels are only available where 2 of them are maths and FM, such that not doing them at school means only 4 subjects may be taken. That's certainly the case with the only school round here that I know of that still lets students start 5. My daughter is at a less academic school and pretty much the only students doing 4 A levels are doing FM.

I agree with those suggesting ditching Comp Sci in order to continue a humanities subject. Hopefully discussions at school can help him understand what the choices he needs to make really represent.

(I have every sympathy with him, by the way. In a different school system I continued with Latin alongside maths and sciences; and having had Ancient history as my drop-after-one-year subject I was seriously considering shoe-horning it in to my last year as I enjoyed it so much. When it came to uni choices I nearly decided to go to one that offered a dual BA / BSc …)