Do private schools always over offer?

[worriedandstressedAAA]

Awaiting results from 2 schools which are due out this week for DS who is starting year 7 this September. These two are our buffer schools as DS didn't get offers at our other 2 preference schools. One school apparently had 200 applications for 70 places; the other had 300 for 80 places. Sitting here biting my nails and wondering how likely it is that DS will get an offer from either. He is slightly above average academically and thinks he did ok in the assessments and interview but who knows. Neither school is a hothouse and in previous years I am pretty sure he would have got an offer but this year seems ridiculously competitive with hardly any kids at DS's primary getting offers. Worried we will end up with no offers.

Apologies. I have re-read my post and can see that I sounded smug. That had not been my intention, obviously. We are not in London, and my girls are now 19 and 21 so no doubt not a comparable situation.

It does sound to me, as someone has suggested, that there are not enough places available for average children, or average to bright. The brightest will be fine and will end up with multiple offers. I wonder how many places there are altogether, and how that compares with the number of children who want them, especially once some of them have accepted grammar school places. I'm in Surrey and I suspect we have a better balance between very selective, fairly selective and not at all selective (other than by ability to afford the fees).

I understand why parents apply to so many schools, but if all of them stopped at 4 or 5, and if all of those holding multiple offers gave them up promptly, I suspect there would be much less heartache all round. I completely understand why they don't, of course, if they're also waiting to hear about wait lists at other schools or about grammar places. A UCAS type clearing system could help with that, I think.

At this time of year, there always seem to be lots of people agonising about where their child will end up. I don't remember any threads about children who end with no place in September.

It seems to me that the only beneficiaries of the current system are the schools, who end up with huge numbers of application fees from children who will never get in, with lost deposits from children who never attend because they eventually get a place at a school they prefer, and with the kudos of being able to say that their. school is 10 times over subscribed.

I do wonder how much profit the schools make from the current system.

A couple of things to give everyone hope. Although places seem limited everyone will find a place for sept and we’ll before then most people are really happy with the school their child is going to and like it once they start. If you can pay there will be a place.

Some children will go to schools which are less selective and have a wider ability range. Remember a great state comprehensive with the full ability range can do well by all pupils, getting some to Oxbridge, lots to Russell group unis and almost all to the appeopeaiate next stage. Lots of less selective independents do the same or better - their resources and supportive parents bring success. Success is there for all these children - they really aren’t doomed by a lack of an offer from a highly selective school.

Thanks Fifttimelucky, if you're not familiar with the London school scene, I can’t really blame you for thinking that anyone who applies to 8 schools must be crackers. If you’d asked me a few years ago I would never have imagined I would be in this situation but such is the central London school scenario.

I’m not so sure the perceived average schools are actually taking average kids anymore. Some such as Emanuel have increased enormously in popularity. FWIW, my DD’s data is above average, her behavior is impeccable (excellent school reports etc) and yet she didn’t get a place in schools that should have been a no brainer. Something went very wrong in the whole process. I’m still reeling. But mostly I’m sad because she is so upset. If she was excited about the offer she got and even if it wasn’t MY ideal school for her, it would still be completely fine. She is going to go back to school and hear about some girls who’s behavior is questionable who will have been offered a place (possibly only because they got 1% more in the exam). There are also kids who will be offered a place and will leave 6 months later or who plan to go boarding in two years. We were in it for the long haul and happy to contribute to the school in any way we can. There’s no lesson in this to be learned for DD, if only that there are no prizes for being a good girl and that you can’t believe what people say (not even teachers). :(

Really do feel for you mumstheword, the whole process seems so unfair. From what I’ve heard from mums of girls who sat the consortium it also makes no sense at all. It’s all the same exam yet I know of a girl who has an offer at one very highly ranked consortium school who got rejected by a much lower ranked consortium school - so seems like some very inconsistent stuff is going on this year.

Thanks Taminini. It will be interesting to see if there is a backlash to the new consortium system. I was happy when they announced it. The idea was to give power back to the primary schools and give more weight to references / interview. If that were true then DD would have got in. Sadly in practice due to the number of applications the schools most likely don't have the resources to properly examine references etc. It's most likely a 'first past the post in the exam' system.

@Taminini I don't know how the consortium works, but the situation you describe sounds to me like an example of sensible offering by the schools.

Wouldn't the 'lower ranked ' school in this case know that they wouldn't be picked by a child who received an offer at a 'higher ranked' school, so they might as well offer that place to someone without an offer from a 'higher ranked' who was more likely to take it?

@fifthtimelucky - you would think so but from what I can see amongst children I know it is inconsistent - some have been offered all the consortium schools they sat for, others have random offers for some not others with it not seeming to matter how bright they are or how well they did in the exam. Maybe you have a point though in that they are speaking to each other and dividing up the more borderline kids amongst the schools so that they fill all their places.

I doubt they are that organised!

To be honest, I don't think the school so need it much for the madness either. Yes they get lots of application fees, but they have to run loads and loads of open mornings, run huge exam days and mark the bloody things and know that a large percentage of those they are courting and sucking up to don't havevthebschoolmas first choice, plus then have the difficulty of knowing how many places to offer to fill - too few and there are empty seats and a need to go to wait list, which after the acceptance deadline is like the Wild West for schools themselves - you'd be amazed how far down even prestigious schools sometimes have to go to get a 'yes' after acceptance deadlines when people have emotionally and financially committed to somewhere else....and forbthebless prestigious they can go to the end of their wait list and still not fill (so it might feel there are no places for some kids, but actually some schools aren't full) but if they over offer, there can be all kinds of logistical nightmares, especially in London schools with no scope to expand on tight sites - it's why City went to exploding offers.

So actually I think the schools would rather it were all simpler and they could go back to when people applied to 2 schools. But they have to respond to the current climate and that involves running multiple open days, emphasising how popular they are and fuelling the hysteria. That hysteria has been fed by schools but also by parents and their anxiety and applications to so many schools. It does seem a bit out of control and doesn't really benefit anyone. But it will work out and all the kids will have school places and the vast majority of these independent schools will offer a great education.

You'd think the consortium would be able to put a UCAS system in place if they want to cut back on some of the madness.

I think in the current climate patents would just find others to target.

Wombatchocolate : am really touched by your words of wisdom . Thank you . You just made my day . X

I think you'll find that most of the SW London day schools do.

It's less common with boarding schools - INSWE.