Music 6th forms London?

[Wiifitmama]

Does such a thing exist? Not private? Something like Kings Maths School which we looked at for ds1 which is state selective and totally specialise in maths. But for talented musicians? I want ds2 to do A levels at a 6th form (including music A level of course) but he is extremely talented some am wondering about something more specialist? My googling has turned up performing arts college but this is not what I am looking for.

YOu could look at a scholarship/bursary to a private school with an excellent music department - Westminster, Highgate, St Paul's? Your son could do music A level along with two or three others and have lots of involvement with orchestras, concerts, tours etc.

Thanks for responding. I did wonder about scholarships to private schools. We are not low income (though could not afford private school) so didn’t really think that was a possibility. He is also unlikely to meet their minimum requirements with GCSEs as he is only doing 6 (he is home educated).

Have a look at Purcell. It is boarding. But amazing. Bursary details below.

www.purcell-school.org/admissions/fees/

A lot of schools will take previous education into account when deciding whether to award a place. At my school, pupils are interviewed in the subjects they're intending to take for A level, although obviously English and Maths would be expected.

If your son is a really talented musician then that might make him an attractive prospect to the school. Also, bursaries for a percentage of the fees are available even for people with reasonably high household incomes.

It's certainly worth investigating, at least.

There are some weekend junior music colleges that offer music a-level and lots of orchestra etc. This is probably not exactly what you are looking for but might be an idea if you struggle to find a perfect sixth form.

Re private school bursaries, these are very rare for 6th form as often talented musicians are picked up via 11 and 13 plus entrance and more than likely stay on til 6th form.

You could ask the people on the Music thread in extra-curricular? They seem to know a lot about this stuff? I don't, I'm afraid- but they are my first port of call when I do need some music knowledge!

Camden School for Girls? Although it sells itself on music I’m not sure if it’s specialised enough for what you want? It does take boys in 6th form but I’m not sure what the admissions criteria are or if they include distance?

You don’t need a specialist music school to succeed at music and there are very few around. Find a good sixth form locally that does music A-Level and also offers other opportunities eg orchestras/choirs etc. If he is thinking of conservatoire, then a high level of skill on his first instrument is more necessary than other A-Levels as they will expect him to auditions d set more store by that. Talk to your local hub, what orchestras, choirs, courses, workshops do they offer? County choirs and orchestras on the whole will be of a higher standard than state schools and most private schools (not all -
depends on size of hub and private school). (Lots in our local county orchestra are in private schools - so are really valued experience.) You need it to be local as if your son is a dedicated musician he’ll need the extra time practising as well as attending any ensembles. Don’t add unnecessary travel time if you can avoid it.

I tihnk it can narrow options a bit too much too. My 3 sons all had music scholarships at free paying boys schools but we specifically (unless they insisted) did not want them to become musicians as the pay is so low and the life so difficult so I tihnk a broader sixth form even if it comes with a lot of music and performance might be a good idea.

I don't know of a London state only music school for A levels. My music teacher at school's daughter got a scholarship to Chethams. She boarded and did well and the local authority paid all her fees - she was very lucky.

Thank you for all your thoughts - very interesting. I had indeed wondered if it pigeon holed him too much considering a music school and I have always wanted a broader more academic education for him. In fact, I tell him regularly that he can't do a music degree at Uni as I won't allow it! However, the reality is that he is super talented and whatever I might want or say, he may well end up as a professional (poor!!) musician.

Loncat - he is already heavily involved in ensembles (I don't want to name his instrument or music type as it is unusual and could be outing). He is in one at a national level which was audition only and he is the youngest in it. Plus another high level more local one (which was also audition) plus a couple of non- audition local ones.

We do have a local state 6th form (completely non-selective) that his brother goes to which does offer Music A level and has quite wide ranging A levels on offer generally. I just want to make sure I don't miss anything that might be on offer for him that could be better, if you see what I mean!

One of mine did music AS and enjoyed it but did 3 others to A2.

perhaps work back from what he wants to do after sixth form eg if he has a particular university or music college in mind see which sixth form is the most likely to help him to that goal and then he can do lots of music at university (as I did although I didn't read music)

(my "free paying" should have been "fee paying" - big typo there...)

Sounds like he in on the right track and a local offer with not much travelling which enables him to keep going with his ensembles and performing will give him a good foundation whether to pursue music after A-Levels or whether it will just be a hobby. BTW I have a music degree (from a good university as I knew I didn’t want to perform) as do lots of my friends and they are in a variety of fields from professional musician, teaching, academia, website design, law, accountancy, marketing. They all tend to perform and do gigs on top of their day job so not all professional musicians are poor!

Thank you both! I am definitely coming round to the idea that if his heart is set on a music degree closer to the time, I would prefer him to do that and excel than do a degree he doesn't want to do, or worse refuse to go to Uni to pursue music in another way.

I did look at the Purcell School someone linked to below. Fees aside, it is definitely not for us. I don't want to send him to a boarding school and I want a wider educational and social experience for him. But the website made very interesting reading!

If you are in West London Twyford C of E School is very good for music and the sixth form is open to all faiths. There is a music and music technology A levels, different styles of choirs, pop and classical concerts. It is a music specialist school.

Brit School?

Some Ark schools have pretty good music departments in my experience and they seem to attract talented musicians. They regularly organise concerts and gala evenings for their students. Is there one local to you? I'm not a fan of academies, but in your case it would be worth a visit.

Looking ahead for a potential musician IME the big decision to be made during sixth form is whether to apply for a university music degree (with academic transferable skills but also musicianship) or a degree at conservatoire which much better prepares for the high standard required to be a professional instrumental musician. Both can qualify for teaching music of course.
Music as a degree at very good universities requires a lot of academic ability (analysing, writing etc) as well as musicianship.
The conservatoires will require focus on preparation of audition material but A level grades are less important.

As your DS is getting a lot of experience outside school and I presume has the right instrumental teachers perhaps look at enxtending that performance experience further (weekend junior conservatoire?) and checking music A level grades obtained at your nearby sixth form options. The grades obtained over several years will reflect on the teaching but also the talent of the cohort they consistently attract.
One of my DCs went to a school which had loads of amazing musicians but insipid music teaching, another DC had both fantastic musicians and teaching. Worth going to some music events at his candidate school or finding out from his music network.

I sagree with sendsummer and I would advise a degree in music at a good university ideally. My children's father is a brilliant musician but rather wishes he had done something better paid and he does teaching (he did thePGCSE etc after his music degree). He did not feel it was that easy to make a living in music although it can be a lot of fun.

If you aren't sure then doing a degree in music at a good university could mean if you wanted to you could become an accountant, lawyer or whatever with the degree and then do an awful lot of music as a hobby after.

I agree with sends at looking at the grades at A lervel people get at the place he might go too as some universities will want As and if most people get Cs that might rule them out.

Also he may be very good at performing but not be that interested in the music theory etc so again that might determine what he does at university stage.

Really interesting food for thought - thank you so much for continuing to respond. I think I would prefer the more academic university route for him. He is a bright student - we will see once he takes GCSEs what his actual grades are but he does study well and do well generally. I would like his options to be kept more open and I think a University degree does that more.

Also really good tip to look at the Music A level grades at potential 6th forms. I had not thought to do that. We are not West London - though Twyford has been mentioned to us before. Brit school is definitely not for him. He is a musician rather than into performing arts overall. I am not sure what was meant by a Junior Conservatoire. He is already part of Centre for Young Musicians. Is that the same? His first instrument (and the one he is most passionate about and gigs on) does not generally fit well with what is on offer. We have been very lucky to find a National, London and local ensemble for him that it does fit. There are no gradings on his instrument but I would guess he plays at the equivalent to grade 7 or 8 maybe on that? His second instrument is piano and he is taking grade 6 in November.

Wiifitmama his instrument sounds intriguing.
I am not an expert in provision but I was thinking of week-end programmes at places like RCM, Guildhall etc. They may not offer his instrument though.
Xenia makes a good point about academic music, you have to be interested in the theoretical side of music and composition rather than simply performing. That is also true to get a good grade at A level I think.

Again I don’t know what other subjects are your DS’s natural strengths but check the A level grades for those as well. He may end up wanting to do a joint degree or to consider a competitive sound engineering degree such as the one at Surrey or physics with music performance at Imperial.

Yes it is a good point about musical theory and composition. He has been composing his own music on both instruments for a couple of years and making your own musical arrangements are a big part of the ensembles he is in. Does he love musical theory? Hmmm, not sure. But he got a distinction on his grade 5 having only spent 3 months preparing for it and never having taken another written exam before (home ed). So I would think he has a talent for it?

Yes, he does have other interests. Politics, philosophy etc. So definitely worth looking at the grades for those too.

Thank you again - so much to think about! Ds1 had such different interests and focus at that age so I feel like I am starting from scratch!

I should add - CYM that he already attends is a division of Guildhall. RCM do not offer his instrument or music style.

He certainly sounds very talented, quite likely to enjoy academic music and with plenty of music opportunities at present. So it is just about finding a sixth form for which the teaching profile and grades fit his present interests and leave his choices open.

He sounds very clever actually so that is going to be a huge help. Sometimes we have people who are brilliant at their instrument but find the other side very hard. I sang at univesrity with two girls who are really good singers and had to drop to ordinary degrees they were so bad at the academic side sadly and failed a lot of the exam. It doesn't sound like your son is anything like that so he should do fine.

So I would concentrate on finding an academic state sixth form college or school in London which gets a good few children every year to the best universities - place like oxbridge, Durham, Bristol, Warwick and just be careful - you want to avoid those who have a lto of peopel doing BTEC, with little experience of applications to hard to get into universities and with a lot of pupils getting low grades.

My son nearly kept his music on to A2 (upper sixth). It was really hard to choose 3 of his 4 A levels. He did economics in the end but it was one of his hardest decisions as he loved the music too and he did continue to play loads at school even in upper sixth so it was all fine in the end. it is quite difficult as a teenager to know what you might want to spend your life doing so as you say a general good degree in music or whatever probably keeps your options open more so you can make a choice at university.I would certainly not have put any of my children off music as a career however if they wanted that.

Good luck with his piano exam next month.

Thanks Xenia. Sadly, what you say confirms my reservations about the college we were planning on sending him too. His older brother is there now finishing A levels. He is applying to top Universities like Cambridge. He is one of only two in his massive year group doing so though. No problem for him as he is so focused that it matters very little what anyone else is doing. Ds2 is more easily led and more distractible. I think he needs to be surrounded by peers who are pushing as hard as I want him to be (both musically and academically). That is MUCH harder to find in a state 6th form I think.