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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

Petition against grammar school expansion

107 replies

JaneJefferson · 09/09/2016 23:50

Sign the petition if you disagree with the roll out of new grammar schools and the poorer education that will be forced onto the majority who do not pass to get into them.

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/164270

OP posts:
LadyConstanceDeCoverlet · 24/10/2016 13:10

I strongly suspect that the policy is popular with voters because they assume their children will go to grammar schools. There really needs to be a poll that asks whether people would be in favour of grammar schools if it were a virtual certainty that their children would end up in secondary moderns.

BertrandRussell · 24/10/2016 14:16

The demographic of mumsnet, particularly on the education threads, suggests that their children are likely to pass the 11+. Very depressingly, this also means that they are likely to support selective education because they think it will be better for their child and don't actually care very much about what happens to other kids. Forgetting that what is bad for society generally is also bad for us as individuals.

Blu · 24/10/2016 15:41

I want a system that offers every child what they need to achieve their potential and their ambitions. An education that offers them that without a gamble as to how they do on a particular day, or that they have the right balance of maths and literacy in equal measures, or that they are mature educationally (despite summer birth date) by a certain date.

I want comps that can push and challenge the most able, while offering different learning speeds and subject lists to others.

I want an evaluation and league table system that measures A*s against high attainers as well as the basic A-C pass rate, A league table that takes into account how many kids take and pass Grade Music exams, take part in extra curricular sport, and arts, and how many do DoE. (for example)

A comp isn't a one-size fits all institution, with every child following a middle of the road curriculum at an average pace. A comp is a school that has many different learning styles and paces for different groups.

And some of the BEST teachers are those who can help a dyslexic child to read, or engage a reluctant or unconfident learner. Some of the BEST teachers get huge satisfaction from that. Some of the best teachers are those who can get classroom control over reluctant learners. I went to a selective school and saw an article written years after I had left by a former teacher. She was a GREAT teacher, and she wrote about how her years in my school were the deadest and most boring of her career because we were so conformist and easy to teach, and she got more original ideas and fun and job satisfaction out of her rough-comp pupils once she moved on.

I have a child who would be a grammar child if I lived in a grammar area - and I am not in favour of a return to a segregated education system. I don't think it serves anyone that well. Mine didn't serve me especially well - no better than a top set in a good comp would have done.

I have no beef with parents who choose the existing grammars - they are available and we all choose, as far as we can. what suits us best from what's available. But as a policy I don't support extending the grammar system. The current super-selective grammars have little effect on surrounding schools because their intake is a small minority. But I would not want to see a Kent style situation spread or replicated.

Theresa M's ideas seem to make much of kids moving schools if and when needs be - but WHY? What's the effing pint when it could all be cone in one school? I was listening to a teacher at a sixth form open day recently saying that if students moved for sixth, the first term was lost in many ways, as friendships and familiarity were being established. Why build that into a system for a child to move to grammar at multiple entry points rather than just keep them in one school and they move sets?

I think that responding to the consultation paper will be more effective than petitions, though, as that is the official consultation being undertaken.

guardian123 · 24/10/2016 15:54

To be fair to poor people, please also create a petition to close down all private schools, Russell Group universities and all luxurious car brands.

I simply find this idea ridiculous. Simply because we can't afford private schools or our kids can't enter into top institution, we ask everyone to stop grammar school to expand.

I dare to ask you this question? How many of you ever worked in schools before? I'd suggest you observe lessons in mainstream for at least a week. You will find out why parents prefer grammar and indie schools. Yes, it is true that some (many) pay for tuition to prep their kids, but it doesn't mean there is no exception. We are poor, we work in school, our joint salary is less than 20K. We deem education is important for our kids, so we buy books to teach them when we have time. Guess what? My son has just passed grammar entrance test. If everyone is selfish as you are, then poor people like my kids would have no chance to enter top institution.

Therefore, I strongly suggest you create petitions to close down everything that make poor people jealous, that includes mansions, private jets, aeroplane first class seats, luxurious cars, michellin restaurants, apple products, diamond sellers, banks, stock market, etc etc.... please also ban good looking girls/men with big boobs and muscels walking on the street. it make me extremely jealous. Thank you.

BertrandRussell · 24/10/2016 16:04

Oh, the old "you're just jealous" response.

So much easier to say that than actually read and try to understand people's arguments, isn't it? And it's useful if you have any little niggles at the back of your mind about the system being unfair and bad for society. You can just block them out by thinking that everyone else is "just jealous"......

guardian123 · 24/10/2016 16:05

i missed one important point. those things i mentioned above will also divide the society too.

HPFA · 24/10/2016 16:11

For those asking about polling evidence:

This is the link to the statistic about people of parental age not wanting new grammars:
d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/018joah9t6/TimesResults_160914_GrammarSchools_EnglandOnly_Website.pdf

The first table shows 26% of people of parental age (18-50 year olds) wanting new grammars to be built -the rest are either wanting selection ended altogether, wanting to retain existing grammars but not have new ones or don't knows.

There's also this rather stunning statistic:
Around six in ten who want more grammar schools think that less able children would be better off in comprehensive areas.
So when people tell you that children will be no worse off in secondary moderns there's a 60% chance they don't believe that themselves.

Lots more interesting stats here:
yougov.co.uk/news/2016/09/15/grammar-school-fans-know-theyre-worse-for-less-abl/

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