Can anyone 'rank' the SW London selective schools

[FlumePlume]

Inspired by the SW London thread, I was wondering if there's a generally agreed 'ranking' for selective schools in SW London? The usual advice is to go for three - a stretch, a should-get and a banker. But what does this actually mean in terms of schools? Coming from a state primary, the whole thing is very opaque.

Which RGS are we talking about?

RGS - Royal Grammar School Guildford.

Oxbridge isn't the only focus for Tiffin though - they produced 19 medics in 2016 (10%) compared to Hampton's 8 (4%). Speaking as a fan of both schools.

I reckon some of that will be the different demographic. More of the RGS cohort want to be rich bankers and lawyers rather than work terrible hours in the increasingly underfunded NHS. I wouldn't encourage my child into medicine unless they had an unswerving passion for it (mind you, I wouldn't encourage banking or the law unless they had a genuine interest in those either.) I am generalising massively and my tongue is slightly in my cheek.

Sorry, I meant the Hampton cohort.

You can be a rich lawyer or banker via Oxbridge of course.

Oh, of course you can be a rich banker or lawyer from plenty of universities. It was more the numbers going into medicine. I think it's decreasingly attractive for the privately educated scions of the City.

Is it a crime to be a "privately educated scion of the City"? A slightly negative way to describe many hardworking children who happen to be born to professional parents! I hope not, on a thread about SW London indies!

I was just being a bit jocular. Lots of my sons' best friends fall into that category. But I was serious that medicine doesn't seem that attractive an option to them.

It's a fair point though - and a real shame.

Tiffin results perhaps skewed by their old VR & NVR exam methods which meant hot house style repetitive learning for several years for parents desperate to get their kids into Tiffins. Especially true of the Asian sector which accounts for the majority at the school and thus suggests the medicine route for those whose lives have been planned for them?

If you are thinking co-ed, have a look at Ibstock. I know a few girls who go there from Wimbledon. It is meant to be big on drama so might also be good for music and dance.
It is lower down academically, but still pretty good, so depends on the relative importance of the different factors I guess.

On the girls school side, I think the most popular schools for Wimbledon girls are WHS and PHS as you would expect, with LEH in the mix for very academic girls and Surbiton a popular back up. I think there is huge benefit in going local so if I lived in Wimbledon and had a bright DD I would choose WHS over LEH, with maybe a move to KCS for 6th form in mind.

In what way are the Tiffin doing a 'poor job' though ?
www.compare-school-performance.service.gov.uk/school/136910

A 125 CAT score only seems to equate to a 5b on the old KS2 scale for English. Is the 125+ CAT score supposed to translate to 50% A* rate for every subject - I've only seen this prediction in relation to maths GCSE?

Having just looked at the list that cakeisalwaystheanswer posted of local boys schools and having also just sat the 11plus for some of these schools with DS1 I would add don't underestimate KGS it's got a lot tougher to get into and has results certainly at GCSE that are very similar to KCS.

Sorry just reading back through thread I would add Trinity was traditionally the more academic compared to Whitgift - this year apparently the exam was harder than W but I've heard that W is really improving academically - they are very different schools so do visit them to get an idea.

Hampton is also now tough and considered one of the academic ones.

Truth is there are no easy rides and of many bright boys who found the exams super tough this year - it's really hard on them.

SET for Sutton Grammars was much tougher too - I really don't know where it's all heading but just feeling worried for dS2 already!

Similar in what way Wimbles?

KCS GCSE results were 76.3% at A, down from the previous year (DS's year is full of slackers), and KGS had a huge increase up to 53.4% A from the previous year. It is hard to compare 6th forms because of the IB and KCS having the best results in the UK but looking at Oxbridge places KCS had 57, KGS about 5.

KGS's GCSE results have actually been pretty similar to Ibstock's over the last couple of years, KGS have a more established 6th from so their A level results are slightly better, but that is a school actually on par with KGS results wise.

I am not a KGS fan mainly because of it's site but I do think you have to credit the school with adding some value. If KCS and KGS were admitting pupils of a similar ability the entire SLT of KCS would be making millions in consultancy charges. To my mind the biggest attraction of KGS is it's size and all the extra opportunities being in such a small year group offers to it's pupils.

If she's very bright I would go for SPGS but I'm biased, and you may need some extra coaching from a state primary.

In second place I'd go for Guildford High - easily accessible from Wimbledon.

Third place LEH is a better school than PHS & WHS - which are still slightly dismal (imo) & the music is much better. I also would choose G&L over either of those two - rather more interesting.

As regards the co-ed request - you could consider Epsom College. And also Sevenoaks - which is doable transport-wise: 17 mins Wimbledon -> Waterloo & then 30 mins Waterloo East -> Sevenoaks.

Any questions about St Paul's please feel free to PM me.

I'm interested in why you feel WHS and PHS are "dismal" -, not something often said about these schools! Do you have actual experience or are you going on hearsay?

I went to the junior department of PHS in the 70s, got into PHS & WHS senior but chose to go elsewhere. There's just a slightly dismal mediocre feeling about them both - compared to Guildford High which propelled itself up the league tables. I don't know why PHS & WHS haven't similarly improved, given the calibre of the girls in the area, & the fact that there's not much to challenge SPGS in W. London. I think they just lack vision. Whereas for boys, WM & KCS offer comparable alternatives to SPS. (KCS is much better now than it was in the 80s, although it was always a nice school).

I have friends with daughters at both & they're not overly impressed.

So your personal experience is from 40 years ago? My personal experience of SPGS is from 30 years ago so it must be even more relevant. I turned down a place there because the girls at open day were so nasty to the others and it was full of anorexics. A friend who went there hated it.

I know plenty of parents at WHS and PHS who rave about it. I am one. I don't know anyone who doesn't like it, and I know loads of parents and girls.
Both schools do very well for their pupils. Above all they are happy schools, which SPGS certainly wasn't 30 years ago (but that counts, right?)

Just providing a link for the tables I was referring to - trouble is they are all different...I think this one is 2016 though - I was referring to A*/A grades:
www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/multimedia/archive/00354/LONDON_354976a.pdf

Just for the record I'm not a league tables fan...but I guess they are a decent gauge of things. As you say, it really depends on the year...

And no I'm not a fan of KGS either, but neither am I fan of KCS. Both are unfortunately due to where they are located smaller than some of the schools further out of London. I guess it depends on what you're looking for...

If its the previous years KGS had 40% A at GCSE compared to 80 at KCS. they are a long way apart because they have a very different intake not because either is doing anything wrong.

I am loving the PHS/WHS are dismal comments! Seriously Manon? Two of the best schools in the country and you are rubbishing them based on an experience from 40 years ago. Only on mumsnet.

In my experience girls, parents and staff at SPGS consider all other schools dismal.

Informal rumblings based on how boys I know fared at the recent 11+/13+ exams are that RGS Guildford is becoming super super selective. Hampton is not far behind. St Johns take a broader look at candidates and offer accordingly. Whitgift keen to encourage state students and have a scholarship process to support that. KGS bar seems to have gone higher than last year. Not many local DC sit for Tiffin anymore, parents are opting out of the stress and high failure rate. Tooting Graveney is becoming the alternative destination.

Goodness me. This thread has really descended since I last read it. Racist stereotypes about bright kids at Tiffin, and now I feel really gloomy about such snooty attitudes from SPGS parents!