Do you think private schools give your children a advantage in life ?

[mistybear]

I am thinking of going back to work full time so I can send my dd to a private secondary school. My husband and I keep going around in circles of whether or not there is any advantage to a private education. We are not rich hence having to work full time to afford it and this is one of the questions, will having parents that are not that well off be a massive problem being at private school, we are not in London and the area we live in is not massively affluent. One of the reasons I keep thinking about it is that the people I have as friends and some of my family that have been privately educated are doing well and more importantly doing a job they wanted to do. My dd is hardworking and has already achieved her leaving school targets even though she is in year five, the state secondary schools around us are not the best but a couple are not too bad educational wise but all of them do not have clubs and sports that the private school has. She loves her violin, science and space also her ponies and she loves her warhammer !! she is also a only child x

Even our rich friends with inherited wealth are moving near decent state schools and balking at cost of private. Have been quite surprised by this actually.

Gently - it's simply not true that private schools are the 'province of those with inherited wealth'. Yes the children of aristocrats will be at private schools but they are the minority. Most kids at private schools are there because their parents work bloody hard to pay for it.

"Most kids at private schools are there because their parents work bloody hard to pay for it."

The problem is that most people, however "bloody hard they work" could never afford private school fees.

And being outraged by injustice is not the same as being "bitter". Or "jealous" as someone will no doubt come on to say in a minute......

Word, yes indeed small classes per se are not all they are cracked up to be. My DDs went to a very highly regarded pre-prep and one of the oddest things about it was the very high proportion of children who had no brothers and sisters - and no plans for any siblings. It's obviously much easier to fund a private education with just one child, and I'm not suggesting that all these parents had just one child in order to fund private education, but the combination of very small classes, no siblings at home and masses of teacher attention made for an odd sort of classroom experience. Yes, my First DD "advanced" remarkably quickly - as did they all - but I am not convinced that it was the best environment in which to learn, say, resilience, or sharing for that matter. And when friendships broke down, there simply weren't that many alternative friendship groups to turn to.

But where is the injustice Hakluyt?

My parents were 'working class'. I went to a state comp, worked hard, went to Uni (first in my family to do so) and then spent my twenties working crazily long hours to build a successful career.

That is what pays for my kids' school fees. I didn't have any innate advantage.

My DC go to private school, I have inherited diddly squat, I don't think the figures being quoted upthread are that accurate (not based on our school's fees in any case).

Of the parents I know well at the school, none come from wealthy backgrounds. Sure, they may exist at the school and there may be some whose grandparents pay the fees. But most people just have good well paid jobs.

The injustice is that a disproportionate amount of the "power and privilege" in this country is held by those who went to private schools. And that has not changed significantly for generations. And so that power and privilege is out of the reach of most of the population of the country.

He enjoyed being with a load of people who were as clever or even more clever than him rather than being always thought of as a "boffin". And he enjoyed the fact that the teaching moved at a speed that suited him.
Lilymaid indeed, this is why we are very happy with out DC selective indie school. Doesn't matter what they decide to do career-wise etc - it has been money completely well spent - I teach in the state sector and they simply would not have had that in state.
My father left school at 14, I went to a bog standard comp, we love learning, but no inherited wealth - all earned. I am happy that my DC are in a place they can enjoy learning.

"power and privilege" in this country is held by those who went to private schools. And that has not changed significantly for generations.

Not strictly true. Between the departure of Macmillan in 1969 and Blair's arrival in 1997, every UK Prime Minister was state educated. I know that there are other areas of power in the UK apart from the PM, but I suspect that quite a few other establishment figures were grammar school product as well.

"He enjoyed being with a load of people who were as clever or even more clever than him rather than being always thought of as a "boffin". And he enjoyed the fact that the teaching moved at a speed that suited him."

Because of course there are no clever children in state schools. And if by some freak chance one does turn up there, they are mercilessly bullied and thought of as a "boffin" and forced to read Janet and John throught out their secondary school career. Pah.

But you are missing my point.

Nothing is out of reach. The only advantages you really need to become rich/powerful/succesful are biological. Yes, a good education can make it easier but ultimately as long as you are smart and willing to work hard you can build a good enough career to pay school fees should you choose to do so.

To be honest, I think the argument that power and privilege in the UK are only accessible to those with the right school tie does our children a huge disservice.

For example, I did some outreach work for my university trying to encourage more state school kids to apply and the number of teachers who believed only private school kids had a hope was very depressing. They pass these views on to the kids who then don't bother to apply.

It's self-perpetuating.

It is a very lazy assumption that cause = indie education and effect is power /privilege. Just as likely that ambitious and hardworking people choose indie education for their DC because it is the best available, and also pass on their their ambitious and hardworking genes to their DC...

Oh,yes, sorry, I forgot. Anyone can afford private school fees. It's just a matter of wanting it enough.

I do hope you don't take that attitude into your "outreach" work...........

Same old, same old.

1. 'Private' (sic) schools confer unfair privilege
2. 'State schools are just as good.

Which is it? Some posters seem to be tying themselves up in knots trying to argue both points simultaneously

Why sic after Private?

You're not expecting me to use the utterly ghastly "indie", are you?

Hak - you could just say posh?

I could- but what about the posh state schools.......

If the shoe fits...

Hakluyt - do you genuinely believe then that only privately educated children can become powerful/wealthy? Really?

As Don'tGotoRoehampton has said that is a 'lazy assumption' or maybe a handy excuse?

What motivation would your children have to try if you have told them only the 'posh school' kids can succeed?

Very depressing mentality and just as much to blame for a lack of social mobility in this country than any old school tie advantage.

No of course I don't.

But I think that the majority the people who hold power and influence in this country went to the same schools and universities. And that if you didn't it is very much harder to become one of those people.

Plenty of opportunities for hard work in life, only a tiny number of them result in incomes big enough to pay school fees. Incomes do NOT increase in proportion with the amount of work required and it's pretty offensive to imply that they always do, imo.

Rabbit, someone was talking about an average income of 150k earlier today. If you're that out of touch, you probably do genuinely think that if they worked a bit harder, anyone could afford private school fees..........

I'm not saying work longer hours now and bingo you'll have piles of cash.

But if you work hard at school, get good results, go to university etc... you can then get a well paid job (should you choose to). Work hard at that too and you get promoted to even better paid positions.

I'm not saying that a big salary is the be all and end all of life. However, if you are both clever and determined (which are biological rather than bought qualities) then it is certainly open to you.

"But if you work hard at school, get good results, go to university etc... you can then get a well paid job (should you choose to). Work hard at that too and you get promoted to even better paid positions."

Are you saying everyone could do this?

"Private schools are mainly the province of people with inherited wealth."
I don't agree with that.