Preconceptions are there to many Russians and Chinese in private school?

[Kenlee]

Whilst reading through the threads. I find that there is a preconception amongst some. That the demographics of private school are now made up entirely of Russians and Chinese.

I however disagree. My daughter is the only ethnic Chinese in her year group and her best friend is the only Russian. The rest are local English girls.

I really don't think having one or two foreign students in your class will affect the outcome of your childs education.

Rant over....

'We could be seeing a very different Cabinet in the 2040s, if Eton’s Sixth Form Awards are anything to go by
Sir, It is announced in School Notices (Register, Mar 14) that Eton’s Sixth Form Awards go to Messrs Rishi Agrawal, Oliver Feng, Xiao Lin, Tanveer Sondh, Jacob Weir and Denis Zaboronsky. This could alter the complexion of the 2040s Cabinet.'

We are living in a globalised world. The letter above was published in The Times a couple of years ago. It doesn't look as though choosing largely monocultural schools is the way forward. Maybe it's better to concentrate on those forward thinking schools which work to integrate all ethnicities.

...or do we think Eton are importing international,students in order to raise their league table position?

Eton is a global brand in a globalised world, the most famous school in the world, the ultimate destination for the the wealthy Chinese, Russian, Indian, Singaporean or even Martian to send there DS if they want an English education.
Many others are also of course attracting children from all over the world I personally think it's great my DS2 has friends who are HK Chinese, Singaporeans, Iranians, Americans and Russians although sadly currently no Martians at Win Coll yet! In contrast DS1 at his highly regarded 6 th form college mixes with other white middle class who make up the vast majority of the intake.

Of course Happy. So while proper integration is vital for a productive school, I am not sure what problem people have with overseas students. After all, it is to be hoped our children are going to be studying at university and working with people from all over the World.

If you choose a school which takes integration of all pupils seriously (and why would you not?). What is the issue? A school popular with informed, successful and intelligent international parents is likely to be a school with a great deal to offer, surely ?

I suppose parents worry that if the vast majority of boarders come from abroad in particular the same country China Mars or Russia (it doesn't really matter) then their DC will be accidentally or sadly even deliberately excluded from the group. If I was at school in Mongolia and there were 20 other UK children there I suspect I would naturally drift towards them as they speak my language, share my culture etc, especially in the beginning, of course it doesn't have to be like this, if I make an effort Im likely to quickly discover that the Mongolians are really nice, and vice versa, the school would needs to encourage friendships across all nationalities.
A friends DD is at a local girls school with over 20 nationalities in the 6 form, no one nationality dominate and all get on really.

As you say, it is entirely natural that if we were posted to Mongolia we would occasionally want to invite friends of our own nationality for a roast dinner. Or a British film. Or to turn to them as a comfort blanket sometimes. Proper Integration doesn't mean that nationalities never have their own time together. It means sometimes they do. And sometimes they share that culture with the community.

Understanding of what nationality and culture is and what it means to us is part of what it means to be globalised. It isn't simple or easy and takes some effort and understanding but I think it is an essential component of an education which will make our children fit for the World they will inhabit.

Slipshod, I think you say it yourself:

"So while proper integration is vital for a productive school, I am not sure what problem people have with overseas students."

Not all overseas parents, or their children, want integration. Some want results and a pathway through to tertiary education in an Anglophone country. When I worked in SE Asia many Chinese parents were worried about political instability and saw an overseas education an important investment not just as a passport to a better job but potentially a passport away from SE Asia. Many of these children would have been on "family scholarships". The extended family would find the money, then once the child graduated they too would be expected to help the next member of the family study abroad.

People seemed fairly divided on whether it was better to aim for a country like Canada which was seen as promoting multiculturalism and hence meant a child could retain their own culture, or somewhere like Australia which was perceived as promoting integration, which might mean better long term acceptance but some loss of cultural identity.

The pressure on the child to study hard and do well was huge. Some within this cohort, like in any other cohort, will be open and want to mix. Others may feel more comfortable mixing with others who understand both where they come from and the reasons behind their work ethic. This avoids conflict between family expectations, and expectations of peers and/or school in terms of spending time on non academic activities.

I would be very surprised if many in modern Britain have a general problem with overseas students. However if a child is going to board it is worth considering what they want from boarding and if others within that year group are likely to have the same expectations.

The group I have described are only one demographic. I hear that some schools are seeing a very different group of very rich young mainland Chinese who are sent over to the UK as a form of finishing school and to learn English, and who do not conform to any standard stereotype about Chinese being hard working.

My own children have benefited from having access to really international education on their doorstep, and have friends from all sorts of backgrounds. However there are potential downsides, and to work well schools may need to actively manage the process of ensuring integration. It is something a potential boarding parent should consider.

Thanks Needmoresleep. That's interesting. Choose your school wisely seems to be the message.

In central/zone 2 London day this is not the case. There are a large percentage of English children of South Asian and Asian origin and a reasonable percentage of expats who are south Asian and Asian but there is not a huge percentage of specifically Chinese students. The very academic schools and the boarding schools do have more Chinese and Russian students but not in a majority at all. If you are boarding, as many say, there will be a higher percentage of non nationals and this is because the parents are from overseas and are investing in a British Education. Many of these students may be Russian or Chinese. This may increase for A Level / IB and people have already suggested a reason for this. But London no. However, you won't find many day or boarding schools with a majority of WASPS if that is what you are looking for. The registrar may be able to help you with the %'s of UK national students. I think some schools may take more Russian students than others (perhaps Stowe) but I don't think at any school they are a significant minority. Its all good. Embrace it.

In boarding schools some overseas groups are better than integrating than others when joining at sixth form. I agree with needmoresleep that some groups may actually regard WAS(Protestant or Catholic ??) partying behaviour as a negative influence when pursuing singleminded academic excellence.

So many groups, so much stereotyping...

I don't believe that people necessarily think that these schools are dominated by too many Russian and Chinese children. Where I have seen concerns expressed about this, it is mainly from expat British parents who are worried about what happens at weekends.

Most boarding schools seem to be all but empty at weekends these days, and there have been some (I think very few) cases of expat British children feeling a bit lonely and isolated while staying in at school at weekends when they are the only non-Chinese pupil there.

Talking about stereotyping, when I think of groups of Chinese sticking and walking around together in boarding schools I always visualise girls rather than boys. I don't get the impression it happens with boys.

Have you sons and daughters Summer, or sons only? I ask because I think it is easier to stereotype one sex if we don't have any of the other and easier to stereotype groups when we have partial knowledge. I have an eldest daughter, two of whose closest friends are HK Chinese. They party harder than she but have remained close at their (uk) university. They fit the stereotype in that it is very selective I suppose.

My knowledge of girls' boarding schools is definitely secondhand and observation only . I just happen to notice large groups of Chinese girls together around such schools but not the equivalent with boys.
Slipshod in this day and age I would find it more bizarre if our DC did n't have several very good friends from the international community (which mine do).

Its funny but my daughter being the only year 7 Chinese has no option but to be friends with her very close Russian BFF and her local English bestie too. Both are full boarders. When one needs to leave the school for the weekend all three leave together.

Did I send my daughter to get an academic English education. Yes as there is less hot housing in the UK. However, I also sent her to learn independence. To be confident. To understand and appreciate other peoples and cultures.

I have to admit my DD finds the day girls clique hard to break into at first. Although she is friendly to all of them. As you may gather being Chinese sports isn't really her thing. Apart from swimming. She has found that going to clubs help.

It has to be said though our class rep has always involved my daughter in outside class activity. Which has helped my daughter immensely.

We were lucky that her school as so many nice people. I wrote this because I want everyone to know it can be daunting for a child if the locals aren't friendly. This could also be a reason to form protective cliques within nationalities.

I think it is quite common for day and boarding pupils to have different social groups. It happened even when I was at a school. They lead quite different lives.

Children like adults are drawn to different social groups it's normal, we are generally drawn to those we feel we have something in common with this could be a similar sense of humour, similar taste in music, a shared culture anything.
There are quite a significant number of HK Chinese at my DS's school, all seem to integrate very well, as Sandie said they do swim but fence, run, do karate badminton squash etc and a wide variety of other extra curricular activities.

I am sure my daughter will also learn to get into sports. The thing is HK Chinese kids maybe capable of doing it They just prefer not too.My nephew being the captain of his school rugby team. Then getting signed to play football in the Sunday leagues. Would be the first to say that HK chinese would prefer to do other things than competitive sports.

He kept away from the cliques as he wanted to stay with his English friends he made in the lower school. Although establishing and maintaining friendships with his compatriots.

Although a generalization it is a trend amongst HK Chinese. That they prefer not to do competitive sports. The plain fact is if the child was sport orientated they would most likely not be schooling in the UK.

They would be in the sports academies in China.

Kenlee that's really interesting. I wonder if that is one of the fundamental differences with the British psyche in schools where there is the perception that one can enjoy and want to do well at something whether sports, music, drama or academics but not to the extent of letting it be completely dominant in one's life to the exclusion of other things (including socialising!). Being single minded from early childhood and devoting most of one's time to something augments the possibility of excellence but most parents would feel their children are missing out on other parts of life.

Looking at this the other way round, nationality mix is just not a topic in international schools in Asia and the Middle East. This topic crops up invariably from parents during get-togethers or when school/house photos are distributed, kids don't really comment on this. It is always puzzling that whenever such topic comes up, there is no recognition of those who are British but born outside of the UK when their parents are working abroad or those from mixed marriages - both categories, grew up and initially educated outside of the UK are just so common. Russian father English mother, Indian mother, Chinese father - where do these fall? From observation, "foreign" raised British children often hang out with kids from familiar culture. Hong Kong born and raised kid with both English parents hang out mostly with Hong Kong Chinese kids at school is a good example. This is nothing new though. It was the same thirty years ago. Example: Belgian kid born in Kenya, grew up in Nigeria best friends with kid from Uganda. Son of UK bank director being good friends with Hong Kong boy and went out eventually with his sister. I can go on. If UK public schools are sensitive to their future (and parents too), they should spend some time looking at international schools in other countries where may Brits have their kids educated. There is a huge community of UK parents overseas, many refuse to let the kids go to a UK public school for reasons brought up by this thread. Kids really don't care and we should do our best to not make them aware of these differences and divides.

Summer it is really because if you look at children that integrate into the populace they tend to be the ones that will have a go at anything. They usually are successful at it. This is irrespective of race. It is when parental pressure is applied. To do well in their examination first. That is when extra curriculum activities suffer. Chinese parents expect their children to study hard and do well. Hence Chinese do not do well in sports. They may enjoy it but will drop it like a stone if it affects their results.

I understand Xpat why kids go to international schools and I agree that most Expats will send their children to these schools. Some don't as we felt continuity was better for DD.

Kenlee it did strike me from what you said in your previous post that a child who was sports orientated (of which there are quite few in British schools at a younger age) would end up being directed to focus on sport in a sports academy in Hong Kong / China rather than just continue in mainstream schooling. That does seem to pigeonhole children with the ethos that it is not worth doing something that takes time away from your academic studies unless you specialise in it and do it to the highest level.

As you say the counterargument would be that the break from studies by doing sport or music or drama or whatever actually helps an academic child study better as well as developing other facets to their personality such as friendships, teamwork and mental flexibility.

Summer as long as it doesn't affect their results academically. I would agree. You see in the UK there is an ethos of giving it a bash. Thats why I like the English system. You can be completely dire at somethings but will still be encouraged. In the East if you have no ability in it. Then don't pursue it find something you can achieve at. It all boils down to the mentality if Im good at it I can make money out of it.