Cost of private education

[kmid]

Hi, I am considering private secondary education and would like to hear from anyone who has taken this decision who is in a similar situation myself. Financially, for me, it will be a big commitment and I shall have to work almost full time. I will have to juggle sickness/school holidays and it will stretch us. I wonder if anyone is in this situation and whether they feel it has been worth it. I am very keen to do it and have the prospect of a lovely job, but just need to take the plunge! I am also keen to know about hidden costs of private education.

So you are looking at 7 years costs. Factor in about 5% rise a year, above any increases in the fee as you go through the school (eg there may be a different fee for Y7/8 to higher up the school). Some schools charge for lunches and books extra. All will charge for music, drama etc lessons. Uniform will be quite expensive but there will usually be a second hand shop and this is in no way looked down on within the school! Also consider the eye wateringly expensive trips that will be on offer, some connected to GCSE or A level courses which brings with it a certain pressure to sign up.

Is your job secure for the future - will it give you the raises you will need to cover increases in fees? Will you have extra for trips etc. Can you cope with a massive growth spurt requiring new uniform? These are the kinds of questions you need to consider realistically. It is a HUGE amount of money and personally I would not enter into it if I couldn't see a way to pay all the way through.

One hidden cost is transport - private schools take kids from far and wide and your child will want to socialise with their friends who will almost certainly not be terribly local. I spend my weekends as a taxi service and it is a pain!

I've got one in private and one in state. I think you have to look at the school and specifically what it could offer. Around here private school= 12K a year, so 84K to A'levels. My oldest started at a private and did to Y9 before moving to state in Y10. Its perfect for him. What are your state school options like? Some state schools are as good as some private so its not worth paying then. My youngest has just got in to a fabulous private (that the my eldest didn't get into) so he will be going there. Yes there are always extra charges.

That said why not take the job for you! Any extra money you could put by for family holidays/uni etc.

My friends oldest is just about to go to uni. He has been at a private school and my friend says he will get hardly anything despite her being a single parent (widow so no money coming from elsewhere). It will mean she will continue to have to pay out approximately what she is doing now for private school fees.

I would kill for annual fees of £12K!! We are close to £8k per term (£24k pa) for one and £6k (£18k) for another - senior education costing a total of £168k and £126k BASIC ie nothing else on top and not taking into account inevitable fee raises

Check the extras like music tutition and if any clubs or societies are charged e.g. CCF. Is lunch included and will you have to pay for transport? e.g. I am looking at one senior school for DS1 where lunch is included but the school coach (best option for us) is 1500 p.a.

A lot of schools will have second hand uniform sales and unless your school has a very distinctive uniform people will probably pick up high street options where cheaper. However, you may find that more specialised kit is needed for sport as this is the case even at prep school.

You will probably find that more children don't go on the expensive optional trips like the ski trip than do so your DC wouldn't be the only one not going.

School fees tend to increase faster than the rate of inflation.

You will also have to pay for all public exams nearly £400 has been added onto our termly bill for the up coming IGCSE's we pay for literally every piece of paper/pen etc and of course text books.
You can use the second hand shop we did in the early years when they grow so fast but do it less now when uniform lasts at least a yr but you usually have to pay for more sports kit at independent school e,g. two pairs of trainers which are often worn out in a couple of terms because so much more sport is done and two/three rugby shirts etc which even 2 nd hand can get expensive.
The 64million$ question is is it worth the money? We live in an area with excellent state schools so the vast majority of independent schools in my region I wouldn't waste my money on frankly but that's only me opinion plenty would disagree.
We wanted something completely different, something we personally can't define but like, not all want this, and we wanted boarding so yes for us it's worth it. But don't assume because you pay it's always going to be better for you and your DC.

Thank you. This has all been very helpful. The annual flat fees including school lunches are 11,860. The secondary schools in our area are all rated good'. We have 3 grammar schools which our primaries feed into but we are out of the catchment area and bottom of the criteria list. My main concern is moving from a fantastic village school of 96 children to large state schools of 1300 upwards. My eldest flourishes in small groups and is taking the 11+ but could possibly be lost' in a sea of children. I am also concerned about what he could be exposed to in terms of different standards (ie internet etc) but I imagine that is a concern most primary school parents have!

Don't believe for a moment he won't be exposed to 'different standards (ie internet etc)' in the private sector. Drugs, bullying, watching porn happens in private schools too and don't think for a moment that it doesn't.

Children in the independent sector will have the internet! Paying doesn't mean they're better behaved or have lived insular lives in fact the complete opposite. Many parents who can effortlessly afford 34k have different standards to mine. Your DD will have to learn that we all come from different homes and that all have different values this is life. It doesn't make her any better or worse or the other children better or worse they're just different.
Many children successfully make the transition from even less than 96 to more than 1300 children if we allow then too children are very adaptable, even children in the private sector do Eton is that size many preps are tiny. All children flourish in small groups but they can also flourish as part of a large school. We did not choose to channel our resources into independent ed because of this. If you like your local state school, feel comfortable with its ethos, that's you feeling comfortable not the other mums at the school gate and most important you are seriously going to struggle with fees for the next 7 yrs I stick with the state sector. Or at least give it ago. Even at the most over subscribed independent a vacancy will often come up.

I would look at class sizes, rather than worrying about the overall school size. Large schools may look scary, but chances are they'll have better facilities than small ones, and the DCs soon learn to find their way around. IF the private offers considerably smaller class sizes that could be worth paying for.

My DSC are all at private, and DD is about to start there. They do offer some very expensive trips but I don't think they're generally the sort of thing that everyone goes on. It's more just lots of options, or tied to specific clubs, interests. So your DC wouldn't be the only one not going (though they might try and claim they were...) In school music lessons in the private school are about 50% more than I've been paying at the state primary my DD is about to leave. Same with school dinners. And there may be extra holiday care costs - depending what you do with them in the holidays - as the terms are a bit shorter.

My DS is at a state secondary. The only difference in what he's exposed to (compared to DSC's private school) I would say is rougher language and more swearing, but I think there's I've heard of similar stories of drugs, internet porn, drink, getting into trouble at the private school my DSC attend. That's just part and parcel of secondary really.

Yes sometimes the drugs and drinking are worse in private schools because the children have more access to the money to buy them.

My personal feeling is that in most cases (and of course there are better and worse private and state schools) private is a bit better, but not to the extent of the fees. However, the fees are whatever they are.....so it might not be great value for money, but is what you have to pay for that bit better.

I have said before, the true cost, is how much difference the fees make to your families life, not the numerical fee. If you can pay for that 'bit better' without batting an eyelid, the 'true' cost is pretty low. If paying for that 'bit better' means you can never have a holiday, are terrified that you might need to buy a new car and have no back up in case of some kind of financial crisis, then the 'true' cost becomes very high and might not justify 'bit better'

Only you know what an acceptable standard of living is for you and your family. Private will probably cost more than you imagine and if things are so tight at the start that you can barely do it, it's probably best not to start. For myself, I'd want to still be able to have holidays (not expensive ones), to be able to socialise with friends sometimes, and have money in the bank for the future/new boiler/car etc. would also want to have enough to enable child to join in some of the wider activities/trips, even if only the cheaper ones. I am a bit risk averse, so I couldn't do it if the margi s were too tight.

Chocolate sums it up very well

Depends what your options are. You said your local state schools are judged to be good - have you looked at the performance tables for GCSE and A Level results? Then compare with the independent school(s) you are considering.

Do you have to consider the education of another child?

I think it is a v personal decision, lots of parents that would not consider independent fee-paying schools think nothing of buying expensive cars, having v expensive holidays, smoking etc. etc. (of course lots of parents with children at fee paying schools do all these things too!).

Most of all visit all the schools you are considering and talk to the heads, chat to the pupils, especially the upper sixth. Then decide.

Come and look at this thread

Money saved from private fees could pay for an awful lot of tutoring if needed ....

Consider what you think it will cost and add at least 10%. The extras build up! If your child is in an independent school and you're struggling financially, the school may be able to help you? A friend had 4 children at an indie school and didn't pay fees for a year! Not sure if any school would allow that now but we had a problem when we couldn't afford to pay for a 5 day 'getting to know you' trip. We had decided it was a luxury and DS wasn't worried if he missed out. When we told DS's housemaster, he said that there was no way our boy was going to miss out and arranged for the cost of the trip to come out of house funds.

Thank you. It is interesting to note that no one so far has mentioned any real benefits of private education

Chocolate makes sense (comments rather than the actual benefits of yummy chocolate!)

The benefits? The difference between £34k per child PA and what state schools average 4.5k per child PA is enormous. At the right independent school; a significantly broader education, no government interference, an enormous range of opportunities, from music to cultural to trivial, drama sport, choice, a ethos that's chimes with my own. I have DS's in both the staff at the state school drove me nuts frankly, there were always looking for excuses, passing the buck, when the push came to the shove they couldn't care less about the children IMO and the opinion of many others I know, (this was the counties top performing school). In contrast the teachers I meet at DS's school are genuinely committed to the children they really care no buck passing, no excuses.
I actually don't believe the quality of actual teaching is necessarily better in either sector, there are good, bad and ok in both sectors, or that children are necessarily any better behaved but I personally know the opportunities my DS at his independent school are not replicated anywhere in the state sector and I just feel more comfortable there..

Kmid- I think most people have wanted to point out the realistic costs because in your OP you emphasised the potential financial issues it might cause you.

There are huge benefits: smaller classes, happier better paid staff, more specialised staff, better facilities for sport and other extra curricular activities, a can do attitude, no low level disruption in class tolerated, a sense of loyalty to the school is encouraged above all else, encouragement to do your very best and if you are the best you are pushed (no focus in the C graders that you hear about in some state schools)....I could go on

This has been our experience anyway and the costs for us are manageable so these marginal benefits are worth it for us. As others have said though if the cost to you is not realistic then there are other ways for you to provide marginal benefits to your child without paying for an independent school

The benefit of private education?

Choice!

One of my friends had a child in state school and spent a lot of time worrying about her son and the school. She felt they did not give enough information about how he was doing, did not want to stretch him and refused to celebrate success in case it upset those who were not doing so well. He was doing well and was top of the class, but after much agonising (Iknow, I listened to the many circular arguments) she moved him to a private school.
She says it is worth it for peace of mind. She can see the children there are successful and go onto the schools she would like her boy to go to, so it is worth it, to stop worrying. She felt the state school would probably turn out to be good enough, but lacked confidence that it certainly would. Now she has that confidence.

Many of the benefits are difficult to pin down, is what Im saying here. It doesn't all come down to how many A grades are achieved at the end, but the experience of the journey too, which lets face it, is over a decade. It is a luxury to buy peace of mind and many will say that it comes at too expensive a price, but again, that depends on how much money you have to start with and the value you place on different things.

The benefits isn't just the academic side of things although my children do benefit from the smaller classes as both are summer born and dyslexic. Its everything else, the choir, orchestra, clubs, sport, facilities, attitude and atmosphere, the expectation of respect and courtesy to each other etc.

Private schools have their faults, you will find bullying in every school (state and private) its how the school deals with it that matters.
www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationopinion/10187920/Bullying-do-mention-the-B--word.html
Beware the school that says they don't have an issue with bullying: its either populated by angels or the school doesn't have a handle on it.

Some private schools can be very competative I would assume like a grammar school. Averagely bright children can feel less able than they really are if they have a very able peer group.

A piece of key advice given by the HM of one senior school we looked at (a 400+ year old boys school) was along the lines of - we might not be the right school for your son, visit a number of schools, work out their ethos and pick the school that suits your child best. The right private school can be fabulous for your child; the wrong one less so. The right state school will be better for your child than the wrong private school.

Thank you everyone - some really interesting comments there. Summer born and slightly above average rings with me. 'A good experience' is also important to me, respect and courtesy and genuinely turning out `nice children' is more important than top grades too.

OP
Happygardening is to my knowledge your oracle on the "benefits" of private as she has two very high achieving boys one at state superselective and one at the second most famous school in the country

my input is :
I was at private all the way through, as were friends and siblings
my kids are at a comp
admittely a Hampshire comp, but still a comp (ok, not my catchment one, but the next along)

If I had worked full time, DH and I could have afforded to put both of our kids through the local selective private school
we have looked at it long and hard, several times over the years
but
chose to stick with comp
and
have had extra curricular tennis, riding, dancing, swimming, rugby, orchestra, instruments
have also been able to send each child on the trip of their choice each year
and any and all day trips
and family holidays a couple of times a year

so
go for private if you can give the breadth
and stick to state if that will allow you to provide the breadth
because later in life, the breadth is what makes the difference

TalkinPeace I am really I always thought you were vehemently anti-private school!