Richmond state secondaries (Christ's, Richard Reynolds, RPA, Greycourt) vs west London independents...advice please!!

[QBean]

DD due to start secondary in 2015. We are sitting on fence as to whether to sit exams for independents (possibly Godolphin, LEH, Putney, KGS, Surbiton) or stay in state sector, but currently tutoring for 11+ to keep options open. Among many other factors to consider, I am anxious about stories you hear about impact on mental health of independents' highly pressurised environment, equally anxious about stories of academic kids at local state schools not with motivated peers, but appreciate this is all gossip. Grateful to hear from parents with kids at above state or independent schools, are you pleased? For those who are/were in same quandry- which route did you go down, are you happy with your choice? Any advice hugely appreciated. Thanks all! (See also thread on local Richmond site, good feedback on RPA but tricky for us to get to, so hoping posting on main site will bring responses about other options too)

This is the Richmond Council Planning document on primary expansion from 2008/9, the year the 2015 cohort were entering primary. It is very clear that Richmond was one of the main areas of increased demand and highlights a further form of entry at Vineyard and a class at Holy Trinity to meet demand. www.richmond.gov.uk/consultation_on_school_expansions_strategy_2009-2018.pdf If you look at the Richmond local talk thread on schools you will find a breakdown of the various bulges and expansions, I have dinner to cook! That thread is full of forensic analysis of the patterns of demand, and there is also lots of info on the school place forecasts on the RISC site. I am not sure why straggle was claiming more places at Greycourt either, they expanded to 240 in 2012 but from 2013 on that reduced to 200 because of sixth form expansion.

By the way I have no agenda but to help parents who are about to encounter the realities of Richmond Councils Education Strategy (under whichever political administration). Every year a new crop of parents finds out that it rests on filling up schools to the last place which means not just no choice but sometimes no place, as happened to us 15 years ago, and they all write off to the RTT, MPs, Councillors etc then get accommodated one way or another, often by feeling forced to move or go private, and nothing changes.

The 2014 intake at Grey Court is 240 for 2014 intake according to the Admissions brochure - I don't think their sixth form has opened yet. Christ's is up to 150. Half of the Holy Trinity class year may be applying to Christ's under their church places.

Most local parents will be happy with Grey Court as you say, but I know one or two Ham parents who are interested in Teddington - they have other options too now. A few Fern Hill primary pupils will be interested in the new Kingston school as it's literally next door.

That's odd because it is not what they are saying on their website www.greycourt.richmond.sch.uk/aboutadmissions Nor is it what the Council have in their school place forecasts. Greycourt is part of the post 16 partnership and as such is inviting applications for sixth form this year. I saw Maggie Bailey outline the plans.

Dear Qbean - good luck - I remember your dilemna so well. My lovely DDs are at RPA and flourishing, both academic and sporty, it ticks all the boxes for us. The teachers are amazing, for example, my eldest is currently doing a music project and her lovely music teacher spent an hour and a half with her at school yesterday - Saturday - to help with piano accompaniment. (Thank you Miss F!)

Following Eastpoints comment. Whilst trips to China look great in reality they are just 1 week in 5 years of secondary education for a minority of pupils. Not everyone goes by any stretch of the imagination. The trip therefore cant be part of the curriculum. Just a nice add on for a few. In many ways I would rather see the whole GCSE geography group go somewhere in the UK that is affordable to all. On the face of it schools often seem to offer alot but in reality these things are for a selected group. I frequently see in my childs school newletter year 9's go to talk at Kingston University or whatever. Sounds marvelous but as I said just a few went. So look behond the glossies and try and see what goes on every day.

I guess the reason I mentioned the trips to China & New York was to let QBean know that there are fancy trips on offer at local schools (which take place during the holidays). They aren't part of the curriculum but they are mind broadening. Sometimes you can afford to send one child somewhere while you couldn't afford a family trip or due to family circumstances even leave your house.

I think schools offer a range - my DD is at RPA and, as an example, there is a trip to Berlin for History GCSE which is 5 days (still pretty good value) but then another for Geography which is hill walking in the Lake District, travelling by train and staying in a youth hostel. So a range of budgets are catered for. Both trips look great though.

DD is also at RPA and going on a three day RE trip to Amsterdam. First time abroad with a school and we are all looking forward to it!

Thanks so much for your feedback everyone. I take the point that it's important to have a 'sure bet' in the state secondary applications, although in Kew I am not sure what that would be if you do not go down the church route- as I know from the local authority's website that Christ's catchment for proximity is now quite limited and I fear as RPA increases in popularity we risk being too far for that too...yikes.
Great to hear of all the lovely trips!

qbean bayjay has posted the 2014 latest admissions report on secondary allocations, on the New Schools for Richmond thread in local, which should help with your decision making. Increase in first preferences for RPA finally starting to reflect their improvement, Greycourt up as well, Christs fairly static.

Thanks shootingatpigeons!

I think with the way RPA is going, and their strong recruitment drive locally, their catchment will eventually narrow.

My youngest is in a local primary, and all y4 parents have been invited to a cheese and wine evening at the RPA, two years ahead of applications going in!

Thanks for that, are many at your local primary considering it? Curious what the 'word on the street' in Sheen is!

From what I have seen driving past at home time, there are less police officers on the streets. I see well behaved children, both on the streets and on the bus. I hear stories of happy children and happy families.
Word on the street 1-2 years ago was neighboring gardens treated like rubbish bins, wing mirrors broken off cars, scratched cars, and primary children bullied by older RPA children on the way home, to the point of police being involved. I think this is the sort of thing they are trying to tackle.

Word on the street is also that Putney Ark Academy is one to bear in mind (Formerly Elliot school).

We opted for a local indie for ds1 and he could not be happier. Ds2 is in Y4, so we are keeping our eyes open for him now.

QBean - hi - we may have met on another thread. We have two at a very very local school to RPA and parents seem to be becoming more and more receptive to RPA as a sensible option. One of our neighbour's daughters started there this year and seems to be loving it. We still have 18m before our eldest makes the move but I am pretty certain that she'll end up there. (Private would be a stretch financially and personally I'd prefer my two to have a more normal demographic mix at school).

Thanks for all the useful feedback everyone. Are there any parents out there from Christ's, Richard Reynolds? Grateful to hear first hand what those options are like...just read Christ's recent OFSTED with interest.

Quintz - I think you are talking about 'word on the street' longer back than 1 or 2 years. I have a Y8 DC and was keeping a very close eye for a couple of years before she joined. Your description relates to before it changed to RPA

Yes, I think a bit longer than 1-2 years - more like 3 or 4, and even then it was changing.

There is a 'meet the parents' evening this week, if anyone is interested, at RPA - a few of us from dd's primary are going

ELI I went to the RPA 'meet the parents' and was very impressed. Lots of local people there. Were you there?

Hi Qualitycontrol, I was there last night and was hugely pleased, spoke to head, governors, parents, a few beautifully behaved children who obviously had pride in their school, and a parent/teacher all of whom were very positive. One mentioned (I think I have this right but feel free to correct me!) that RPA was the last school before the change in government to receive a big dose of funding- and that funding was certainly evident. Another mentioned that (and here I may be way off!?) the current government (or perhaps local council?) is keen to make it a flagship school to evidence how rapidly schools can improve. Anyway, what I took from the evening is that there is the leadership and the community and political will to ensure its a success...

I have heard that this year (ie offers now for Sept 2014) RPA was oversubscribed - would be interested to hear if that is the case - if so, the tide has definitely turned.

if you want to know much about state school go and park your car near the entrance just before the end of school day o couple of days

watch for the behaviour of the kids
do they have teachers having to control them at the bus stops and outside of the entrance, and/or police presence
are they getting out of the school and are loud and etc

antimatter completely agree ( and also if you are buying a house or flat similar principle applies )

Also useful to check out the Ofsted dashboard so you can see how the school compares to all and similar schools: dashboard.ofsted.gov.uk/dash.php?urn=136208 and the school Value Add figure: www.foxtons.co.uk/education/richmond-upon-thames/secondary/richmond-park-academy.html. Note that a Value Add score of 1000 is neutral ie the school is not adding value but children are making expected progress, a Value Add score above 1000 is positive ie the children are making better than expected progress and a Value Add score below 1000 means that the children are making less than expected progress.

my kids are 14 and 16
through time of having them in secondary school I realised that you should look at not A-C total, but the break down.
Also - does the school offer separate Physics at GCSE.
How many kids take Art and Music gives understanding of priorities chosen by school re: gcse coverage (both subject not soft at all).

I also second VA stats and understanding of different ways schools manipulate system during application process. I am going to try to find thread on MN from few months ago how it is done in some Academies.