Saturday detention and inflexible school.

[Rainbow]

My DS2 is in Y8 and the school policy is, if they get 5 detentions for not doing homework, they get a Saturday detention. I don't agree with it but it is school policy and I agreed to work with the school for the duration of my child's time with them. DS2 got his 5 detentions and was told on Wednesday(2/10), that he had detention on the Saturday (5/10). As a Cub Scout Leader, I had made arrangements to go to District camp with all the beavers, cubs and scouts from our district. DS1 is a beaver leader DS2 and DS3 are scouts, DS4 is too young but had not choice and my parents and my sis are also leaders with beavers and scouts and so they came too. There was not at home who could look after DS2. I explained to the school that this was the case and after numerous suggestions along the lines of put him on 3 trains and a bus (total journey time 2 hrs 40 mins) it was agreed to postpone the detention to the following week. I got on the coach with all the other leaders and children on the Friday and returned by coach on the Sunday. I then discovered, that DS2's detention had been extended by 1 hour because he could not make the previous Saturday. School seems to be steadfast in their decision and insist on punishing DS2 for my commitment. He did get a couple of Saturday detentions last ear and one was changed as my cousin was getting married but the other 2 we bend over backwards to get him there, even picking up my cubs and taking them to their event before collecting DS2 from camp only to find that the member of staff who was taking the detention had not turned up! Working together is a 2 way street or at least I thought it was!

[Cynderella]

@ivykaty: Yes, if parents ensure child has time to do homework and believe it is done, then they have tried. However, after a few detentions for missed homework, I would be checking the homework diary and asking to see the work.

@morethanpotato: My A' Level classes do some essays in class but few. It's a waste of teaching time, I think. If they don't do an essay, parents are informed and they do a detention with the Head of Year. I always give a week for an essay. Most of our lessons are class discussions, planning answers and making notes from class contributions and my additions. Their exams demand essays and that's what they need to do. I teach them the content and skills. I don't sit and watch them write essays unless we're doing a timed essay in exam conditions. And I mark every essay they write!

[ReallyTired]

"I don't see why the school should offer an alternative sanction because a parent and child want to go on a scout trip. The proverbial floodgates would open and the only children doing detention would be those from families with supportive parents."

"So out of curiosity OP what will the school do if you elect not to send DS for the Saturday detentions?"

Schools with after school or saturday morning detentions rely on the good will of parents and have always had done. A day in internal isolation or temporary exclusion is a far more serious punishment than Saturday morning detention. If nothing nasty happens then it all becomes a big joke.

If there are too many fixed term exclusions then the child is encouraged to seek a transfer to another school. However managed transition or permament exclusion for not doing homework is a little extreme.

[englishteacher78]

@Cynderella - sounds like my A Level lessons too.

[Cynderella]

@ englishteacher78: Perhaps because I teach English too! But I think I would teach Sociology in the same way.

[englishteacher78]

:)

[TSSDNCOP]

So Really what if the OP just didn't do it. The kid doesn't get expelled, the OP doesn't get fined. In reality she could just say "DS is not coming," and there's not really anything anyone can do about it. Right?

NB I'm ignoring the fact that I couldn't do it myself as I'm the epitome of the Parent That Toes The Line.

[SirChenjin]

Kid could be excluded? Falls further and further behind? Doesn't do well in his exams? Relationship between school and parents break down (further)? Kid doesn't grasp the fact that rules of school and later, the workplace, have to be followed?

[AChickenCalledKorma]

Taking a different tack, I think three after-school activities plus Scouts probably means your son really doesn't have enough time to do homework properly.

Would the school accept a reduction in after school clubs, in recognition that your son already does "enrichment" out of school (i.e. Scouts?)

DD1's school uses a "ROPE" (Record of Personal Excellence) for each student. They are expected to demonstrate commitment to out-of-school activities such as volunteers, music lessons, sports etc. But it includes everything they do - not just the things the school organises. In your position, I'd be trying to free up some after-school time, until your son has a more balanced approach to getting the homework done.

But I also agree that Saturday detentions are the pits and the school has been a bit unreasonable in expecting the whole family to re-arrange a major prior commitment at three days' notice. Can't see any reason why postponing an hour's boredom by a week would make any difference to the school.

[Cynderella]

@ TSSDNCOP: What could the school do if parents will not co-operate with them over the Saturday Detention? I'm pretty sure that a school can keep a child in after school without giving parents notice. I would presume that it would have to be in the Behaviour Policy so that parents are aware it could happen. I'm sure most parents would prefer to be given notice.

[morethanpotatoprints]

Cynderella

It sounds very similar tbh except for the homework.
I guess it depends on where you work and what if any policies they have. The college I worked at were more concerned with fire fighting (literally) and making sure students left without an ambulance. Homework was not seen as a priority by any body.
The kids didn't want to be there in the whole, the teachers quite often less.
There were several changes whilst I was there and my dept managed to get some students to A grades there were a few B's a few C's and mostly D. This was a huge improvement from previous years.

[Thants]

Other options to encourage kids to do homework are:
Giving rewards in the next class to those who do it, they get to do something fun!
Giving them interesting and engaging work to do not just monotonous tasks.
Giving kids choices over what they do for their homework will give them more passion for it.
Giving them longer projects that they build on rather than doing a new short task every week. Then when they have completed the project they will have a sense of accomplishment. Then do awards and prizes for those who did particularly well/worked hardest on the project.

[SirChenjin]

And you know that the school doesn't already do this because....?

I would imagine that the school probably has a raft of measures in place (including many/all of your suggestions) but at some point the piss-takers have to be called into line.

[ivykaty44]

englishteacher78, most year 7 and 8 will probably need some guidance in when homework should be done or time set aside and homework suggested - but not all year 7 and 8 will need this guidance. Every single parents evening I have been to teachers have remarked my dd2 (now y10) always does her homework and I have certainly never needed to organise her or set her a time to do homework, possibly unusual but some you can just leave to get on with it.

dd1 was a nightmare over homework I supported the school in detentions but often the home school diary got lost or left at school or a teacher had it, so detentions were dished out and she had to do them and walk home afterwards on her own

same home same rules different children

[adoptmama]

OP I'm really not sure what your complaint is. Your son has deliberately ignored his responsibilities and has been given the expected punishment for it. The school were flexible and changed the date. I see nothing wrong with adding an hour of detention on.

Your son needs to manage his workload, learn not to leave big pieces of homework to the last minute and work to the proper standard. You complain he is 'expected' to sign up for 3 enrichment clubs - well that still leaves the rest of the evening and 4 other nights a week, all day Saturday and Sunday. I very much doubt every child in the school is signing up for 3 anyway, so pull him from them. There is no legallly enforceable after school program so even if the school were to be unhappy, unless they are a private fee paying school, there is no way they can insist he attend. Are you sure he needs to attend? Where would he go after school if he were not there (I assume you are at work so can you be sure if he were not there that he would be more likely to be doing homework)?

I'd imagine that he could get his work done if he were properly organised. You could always cut back on his time with the scouts, which you admit takes a lot of his time. You could take his computer away until he shows he can work properly. You need to take a deep breath and really work out who you are angry with and why on this one. The school have done nothing wrong and you are lashing out at them. Your son has a long track record of not doing homework. He needs a sustained kick up the arse. If you have concerns about his ability to organise or manage his work then arrange a meeting with his form tutor or the senco. The fact that your son has had repeated detentions for failing to do his work does not prove that the school discipline policy is flawed. All it proves is that your son does not do his homework.

[missimperfect]

I have a child in year 8. She has activities after school 3 days per week. This week she was up at 6am one morning to do a piece of homework because she had been unable to complete it the previous evening. It can be done. Lots of children have busy schedules and manage to do their homework. You need to set aside certain times specifically for homework, based around your routine.

I have another child in secondary school who was having homework difficulties and has a "homework card" which means the teacher/assistant has to write the homework into their diary for them so it is clear what the homework is and when it is due. I then check the diary and make sure the homework is done. Does your son know what the homework actually is? Some children have difficulties knowing what it is they have to do and organising themselves and they do need help. You need to get involved, work out what the underlying problem is with regards to homework, and find a solution.

I know another parent for example whose child has severe health issues and misses a lot of school - she has found "buddies" in each class her child is in so that they can email or call or text to her as to what the homework is. If they can do it, there is really no excuse for others not to do it.

[soul2000]

What is the point of detentions if the pupil is just going to sit there and do nothing. Surely try to make the detention of benefit to the pupil not as i said early as some sort of retribution.

If you use detention let there be some benefit to the pupil though learning.

[Cynderella]

Our students do missed or extra work in detentions. Tempting to have them do the filing and sorting but we usually end up teaching them. Last year some of my Y11s used to stay behind on detention night to do their homework because they wanted someone to look at what they were doing. Many children manage homework with no or little parental involvement. Many others would love it if a parent took an interest. One of my Y10s said her mum had agreed to sit at the kitchen table with her every evening and this term, she is flying - after limited progress in year 9, she is developing a work ethic and really wants to do well.

[Fairenuff]

I think you are massively missing the point OP.

How is your son ever going to get qualifications if he doesn't put in the work?

What does he plan to do when he leaves school. How does he want to live his life as an adult?

Does he want to rent or buy his own place, furnish it and heat it? Does he want a TV, maybe a computer (as he likes them so much), a mobile phone.

Does he eventually want to learn to drive and own a car and cover all the expenses involved in running it? Does he want to be able to go out with his friends, go on holiday, buy new clothes and treats for himself and his loved ones?

How is he going to fund his life when he is older, if he cannot get work due to a lack of education?

Talk to him. Make the changes now, before it's too late.

[mercibucket]

homework does not get you a good job

[Thants]

Sirchenjin I went to school they don't...

[Thants]

How long is this detention op?

[eddiemairswife]

Someone said earlier that years 7 and 8 need help in organising their homework. Really? The homework is set, the children know when it is to be handed in. Surely they are now old enough to sort it out for themselves. The OP's son doesn't seem to care whether he does his homework or not; at least she hasn't said so.

[SirChenjin]

You went to this particular school Thants?

[Thants]

Majority of teachers use the same techniques. Teachers who are genuinely interesting and engaging get much more respect and children want to work harder for them.
I think Saturday detention is a joke and would not take my child in.