Eton college - what type of boys ?

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I asked this in the shrewsbury thread but dont want to derail the main subject.

I just wanted to know what type of things they look for generally in boys, ive read that they like musical boys but does that mean everyone must play an instrument and at what grade assuming you are not applying for a scholarship etc. Do boys all have to be in first teams in sports ? Do boys all have to have been prefects at their previous school ? Thanks.

Admission to Eton is a lottery IMO, but I'm sure Eton don't see it like that!

I've known boys who would have been perfect and a complete package (sport, academic, music) and be turned down for boys who seem to offer very little. Any ideas that it is a true meritocracy are also false. My son was only at the beginner stages on one instrument and terrible at sport. He got in on academic ability but there were boys who got rejected whom I genuinely think we're better candidates. I've also been surprised at the abilities of the music scholars. Some are phenomenal and I am genuinely perplexed about why some other boys were given music places.

Tbh, the most important thing you need to ask is if Eton is right for your son. It's a very hard, pressurised school and really not for the faint hearted or the gentle boy, or those that are too compliant and worry about everything. It's a very daunting place for many F block boys and I know a fair few who are not happy or where it takes over a year for them to eventually find School palatable, and longer before they start enjoying themselves. This can be pretty uncomfortable for parents to witness. It can also be a terrible anti-climax...

What is the F-Block? Sounds ghastly!

1st year boys, it's called F block.

Colleger - from what you've described it sounds ghastly! no positives at all , i had heard they have fantastic pastoral care, cater for all types etc is none of this true then ? Just overhyped perhaps ?

I'm not sure how any school with a house system can have excellent pastoral care as every housemaster is different. My son's housemaster is an excellent man and we are very pleased with the house and feel he couldn't be in a better house, but that does not mean a child will be happy at the school or that it's not extremely pressurised. Boys at Eton have to be bright, go-getters and exceptionally robust.

I think one of the main problems is that the school feels and runs like a university and this may be great from third year onwards but it is a very hard environment for young boys coming from quaint little prep schools in the country. I also dislike the uniform. It's striking how it is very difficult to distinguish a first year and a sixth former, and im talking as a parent, when they wear that uniform and I wouldn't be surprised therefore if the first formers are treated in the same way the sixth formers are - too much responsibility, not enough leeway when they get things wrong etc.

colleger you " dislike" the uniform you'll be stating that you like St Paul's next! X

Colleger, my DS loved it from Day One. He came from a day prep school. He was 3rds (at best) at sport, middle-of-the-road academically and an OK musician. He had (still has) great friends from very varied backgrounds.
I agree it's a bit sink-or-swim to start with but the Housemaster and Dame were watching closely.

I know many who do love it but there seem to be a large minority that really don't. I just feel its a school where many parents want to get their kids into and they don't really question if it's actually the right place for their child. Interestingly though, the housemaster said that boys who have boarded before often struggle the most because they are surrounded by excited boys trying to vie for alpha position but they don't have that excitement of being away from home or need to get involved. In the long run it can leave them quite isolated.

bulletpoint, you don't need to play any instrument. My guess is that most boys don't.

They use the pre-test at 11 to try to establish that a buy has got the all-round ability to benefit from their teaching and not fall behind. This is all done on a computer. They had the test developed by Durham University. They then interview the boy. The interviewers are trained to bring the best out of diffident boys and to spot unfounded bravado. They say they are looking for enthusiasm.

Eton was one of the first schools to introduce this kind of admission process. They felt in the 1980's (as did many schools) that they were getting too many boys who were "too cool for school" and were wasting the opportunities and facilities they offer. So they love musicians, sportsmen, actors, natural historians (they've got their own museum), artists, etc etc

They want a mix of bright boys. This may explain why Colleger thinks it is something of a lottery. In a way it is.

My son also loved it from day one. He isn't musical or a great sportsman but is reasonably intelligent and a joiner in-er.
He made a fantastic and close knit group of friends - friendships that I hope will last forever. (though obviously children will make close and long lasting friends wherever they go).

The joiner in bit is really important,its a school that works best for boys who are willing to give things a go and want to try new experiences,getting in however is as has been said a bit of a lottery,they dont always the obviously academic or sporting or musical,they are looking for a mix,children that are going to add something to the school,that can lead to really good candidates not getting in and other boys that are ho hum at everything getting in,but go and look at the school,forget(if you can) its Eton,and just see if its right for your dc and remember its got to be the right school for your dc not the right school for you.

Do they ever take any boys from state primaries? On their website they only talk about prep schools.....what's the reality surrounding this? Would a boy from a standard state primary have the same chances of getting in?

I think my son would have been happier at Winchester but its done now.

Until about 3 or 4 years ago, a boy from a state primary had at the very best, a 1.5 percent chance (or less) of getting in to Eton. This is via the(ir) Junior Scholarship scheme where 4 places out of the average annual intake of appx. 260 were specifically reserved for boys from state primaries. Successful boys were then taken out of their primaries aged 10 to be put in a prep school of their choice for three years (with Eton?s approval - and they know just about every single prep school in the country; some approved and surprisingly, many not approved including some big names!).

Needless to say, this route to Eton was next to impossible to achieve as boys from the length and breadth of the nation came to compete for the 4 places.The Junior Scholarship scheme is now defunct; replaced with the New Foundation Scholarships.

orangeberries, in principle Eton would be more than happy to take boys from state primaries. The problem is Common Entrance which state primaries don't prepare children for.

You don't sound all that convinced as to the quality of your son's £32,000/year education Colleger?

Did you not consider a nice day school instead?

The Head, Tony Little, was quoted as saying they want boys with 'something extra to bring to the party' and that could be any number of things, so it's very hard to define and very hard to know if your DS has it.

Enthusiasm and joining in are definitely important factors, I agree. They want boys who will use the school, and all that it has to offer.

You don't have to be an elite sportsman, but if you are then you will have fantastic training and facilities. You don't have to be a brilliant musician, but if you are you might find yourself playing for the Queen. If you are an 'ordinary' musician you will still be encouraged to play in an ensemble and perform in your house concert.

You don't have to have been head boy, or the coolest boy in your prep school. My DS was not in the alpha group at his old school because this was really defined by sporting ability, but since being at Eton if anything his confidence has soared. It seems as though they are really good at finding what each boy's strength is and encouraging and supporting him in that, rather than making unfavorable comparisons with other boys.

I think the school would really really like to attract more boys who are not coming from the Home Counties, Eton-boy-factory prep schools, but those schools are good at what they do and, in addition, a lot of potential pupils would never think of applying to Eton, so it takes time.

I'm amazed at what Colleger is saying. He is somewhat of an authority on this thread on all things Eton/Winchester. Seriously though, if you are that unhappy with it all, and I mean totally honestly and not spitefully or anything, is it not time to consider moving your DS? I mean its bad enough if he's not enjoying it...and farnkly, no one should spend the kind of money we are talking about and be in any way dissatisified with the service we're getting in return!

If ds was unhappy at a new school I would not be making any quick decisions. I would be holding on to the courage of my convictions and the reasons for choosing it in the first place and hoping things would settle down by the end of the first term. If ds was still unhappy and it couldn't be resolved then I would look around for alternatives.

I know someone who got a junior scholarship to Eton about 10 years ago. Back then they didn't have enough state boys applying to award all the state places (or maybe the quality wasn't high enough of those who did apply).

It's my son's decision to stay or go and whatever decision he makes I will stick by him but I would not make hasty decisions and neither would he.

Fair enough, if it was me though, I'd have phoned up and given Mr Little an earful to get the problem sorted.

There are a number of points being raised here which are relevant to all choosing independent schools. I think Im correct in thinking that both dapplegrey and grovel DS's have left. I personally think education in the independent sector has and is changing. Many parents sending their DC's to schools like Eton are of course paying for the name but not just that they are ambitious they want results because they've realised that being an old Etonian is not enough. So now they want As and Oxbridge/Ivy League universities, and whereas 6-8 years a high % of a schools leavers getting these kind of results was the preserve of a handful other schools e.g. Radley have upped their game. Also children themselves are increasingly aware in these recessionary times of the importance of Oxbridge/Ivy league/A's so this also creates "a very hard, pressurised school and really not for the faint hearted or the gentle boy is why the environment."
Secondly the point that colleger made "I think one of the main problems is that the school feels and runs like a university"
I think this applies to all of these super selective schools, but this doesn't habe to be a bad thing. That is what we including my DS loved about St Pauls because it so obviously felt just like a university and he too had come from a "quaint little prep schools in the country" but he hated it he couldn't wait to get out of the place. You need to be objective about your DC.
Finally "Boys at Eton have to be bright, go-getters and exceptionally robust the housemaster said that boys who have boarded before often struggle the most because they are surrounded by excited boys trying to vie for alpha position but they don't have that excitement of being away from home or need to get involved. In the long run it can leave them quite isolated." I've heard this said before my DS full boarded at prep from yr 3 he walked into Winchester and took to it like a duck to water so this does not need to necessarily apply.
"I think my son would have been happier at Winchester but its done now."
Colleger as you know I am not 100% convinced your DS would be happier at Winchester the boys who thrive are "go-getters and exceptionally robust" it is IMO a mega pushy academic environment fiercely competitive and I am delighted to report just like a university. The pastoral care is outstanding the teaching staff 110% committed and a just as it should be when your at university a boy is pretty free to be himself and follow his own interests but I do feel that the pressure on the individual boys is immense.

The problem stems from the difficulty in choosing the right school its so easy to be bedazzled by websites, prospectuses (will someone please tell me what the plural for prospectus is) swish guided tours league table facilities and lets not forget reputation. We have to make these decisions about schools often not really ever seeing the true picture, we post on MN read the GSG Tatler and God knows what else but they are only skating over the surface really only telling us something we already know. Parents need more time and space to see the real school sit and talk to the boys/girls keep going back, try to get a true feel for what one parent we know said during our guided tour of Eton "what is the ethos that underpins this place" and most importantly will it work for my DC?

I think you are right about trying to get a proper feel for school and it is difficult to do that on one visit. Ds's only requirement for his senior school is CCF, which doesn't narrow it down at all.

Bisjo this is not helped by the fact that mny schools are pretty similar. This is unsurprising same curriculum because same exams, same games so you can play other schools, most have CCF, or and voluntary service, chapel on Sunday, orchestras regular dram productions etc etc it's hardly surprising parents can't indenting the woods from the trees. We attend open have pupil guided tours and often are opinion is swayed by the child who does it, we talk to teachers, listen to heads, drink wine and eat canopes we peer in classroom and even look at bathrooms and loos all in a desperate attemp to work out if this is the right school for

Cont! Sorry about error posted to early! Right school for our DC. We want them to be happy do well take advantage of all that is offered and lets not forget 5 years of boarding is going to cost at least £170 000!
We we're so lucky we were able to look at Winchester 5 times the HM's were all very welcoming and don't seem to mind and in 5 different circumstances on the 5 th time we ate with the boys in a house. The very articulate but rather sharp young man talking to me was how I suspected my DS would be at that age. This boy loved Winchester his house explained why for him it worked and then at last I could see what it was all about and why it could work for my DS too. Sadly many parents when looking at schools are not as lucky and are making these decisions having attended a guided tour and read a website. The only advise I would give is go as many times as you can to a school you like the look of and go with an open mind try and be objective about your DC what sort of person he is talk to as many existing pupils and remember these super selectives are likely to be pushy/pressurised because of the expectations of the boys teachers parents some however bright find this difficult and therefore may struggle especially in the beginning.