Winchester College - Best School

[Angelscakes42]

Hope this helps! My son has done his first term at Winchester College. Academically, we are so impressed with WC and the housemaster approach, support for settling my DS . I am hoping WC will take my youngest son in 2014!. Winchester College is not for the light hearted, many very intellectual and naturally bright boys, which come from abroad. Music is excellent. There is roughly about 2 and half hours off Toy Time (Prep), every night. We,think IGCSE is the way forward and Cambridge Pre U. Over all my son is very happy and hopefully he will go onto Harvard from here. Winchester Scholarship, majority off these papers are written by the master of WC and these boarder line beyond AS papers, preparation is a minimum of 2/3 years. My youngest son personnel tutor (old Etonian - Scholar) mentioned that you should reach 90% on common entrance by the time your son is eleven,(2/3 years before entrance) before even preparing for scholarship.

Can anyone tell me why my message was deleted can't even remember what I wrote!

Who knows HG, you're the least offensive poster on here, when you're not criticising Eton! :p

Just some additional info for those who might find it useful, there will be a new Master in College starting this September. The current one is becoming deputy head at Harrow. Both are well respected and well liked by pretty much all the boys.

Election (scholarship) exams took place last week and the list is out - a slightly shorter list this year.

They pretty much confirmed that they are not looking for knowledge from scholarship candidates, just curiosity, thinking, questioning and reasoning ability. Having seen King's Scholars papers (Eton) for the first time, and comparing them to Winchester Election papers, there is no question that they are similar (not surprising given their roots) except that KS maths and science paper are far less challenging. Election maths require deep understanding and a lot of thinking, but KS maths papers take you through the thinking step by step and break down the thinking for the candidate. For science and maths, boys can be tutored and coached with sufficient knowledge to do well in KS exams but this would be unlikely for Election exams. For languages, Election require very extensive vocabulary (unsure about KS).

Other than that, it is a myth about scholarship at these schools are GCSE standard or higher - complete fiction. However, since GCSE and A-Levels are testing for knowledge and they do not require much thinking, there is room to suggest that they are harder. Just remember that these exams are not looking for knowledge. So, there is no point subjecting young boys to hours of studying and tutoring - mostly futile and painful/boring for the kids. In many ways, it would be far more productive to have a good long break relaxing and having fun in the weeks immediately leading up to these exams.

All interviews and exams for Election take place in three days. Except for the first day when you have to show up at the Porter's Lodge by 8:45am, you only need to arrive just before your first paper in the next two days. Parents can turn up for tea with the candidates at 3:30pm for the first two days but not the last day. Nothing happens on the fourth day. On the fifth, the results are out at 6pm and those "elected" receive phone calls at the same time, but it is probably worth showing up for the excitement at the Porter's Lodge.

Hope no one finds this message provocative or unfriendly. If so, please forgive me - trying to be helpful to those with boys considering scholarship.

Also useful maybe to know that Election candidates can choose to put in for up to 15 things (ie, 4 compulsory papers + 7 elective papers (of which min. is 3, school recommends not more than 4) + singing + instrumental music + art portfolio + design/tech portfolio) - and that some candidates will be doing all 11 papers, and most of the others showing at least some art or music ...

But that, even given all that, a candidate just doing the 4 compulsory papers + 4 elective (three of which he only got two-thirds done), no music and no art, can still get through.

Interesting comments on the maths papers. The general consensus from the prep school heads we spoke to is that the KS is far harder than the Election. Maybe that is because a boy only has a 1 in 10 chance at Eton whereas at WC it's a 1 in 2/3 chance. My son also scores consistently higher in the maths and French Election papers than the KS, which he finds much harder. But at the end of the day, I doubt there really is much between them. I admire WC's approach though as they look beyond the exam result and factor in school prep, parental background and the interview to seek out the truly gifted boys. I don't think Eton do this as each child is given a number and only the number is put on the papers and not a child's name. One year, if I remember correctly, they had four scholars from Westminster and four from Summerfields. I'm sure that is mainly down to the teaching and understanding of the exams, as well as access to the London tutoring agencies which advertise coaching in the KS. Boys coming from less pushy country preps, where parents leave everything to the school and let their boys have long, relaxing holidays don't really stand a chance.

WC has separate music scholarship auditions which I think takes place in February. For academic scholarship, there are four compulsory papers (General 1, English, Maths and Science), electives (min of 3 and "4 seems reasonable") are Latin, Greek, Spanish, French, German, General 2, Maths 2, History and Geography. They also offer music auditions, art and DT portfolios for the academic scholarship.

Colleger, I would not disagree with consensus opinion since KS is far more knowledge intensive than WC Election. The latter is really not about knowledge at all. As I mentioned before, more 9-10 yo kids can do the calculations in a typical WC maths Election paper but the thinking and reasoning part can be tough. Without having covered the full curriculum, I doubt if a younger child could cope with KS maths questions.

I think you can coach a child to ace Election, but it take several years of brain training, a little at a time from a very young age (looking at things differently, stirring up curiosity and questioning mind), whereas you can get tutor a child to ace KS more efficiently and in a more intensive fashion.

Interestingly, KS is willing to question the basics of religion in its papers, while WC stays well clear of religion. There are two years of KS past papers online inside Eton's website. Interesting read... None from WC I am afraid.

interesting, my nephew pushy ++ London prep was in the scholarship stream (not doing the KS or election) all were taught as if they were sitting the election including those going for the KS as the head considered it the hardest scholarship paper!? The maths in particular was considered very difficult. This was six years ago and they had a long history of a good success rate with both Win Coll and Eton. Ultimately I suspect all were doing is comparing is comparing apples with oranges.

The above doesn't quite read how I wanted it too he was not either the KS or election but three boys were and all got it.

I think the Election used to be more difficult than the KS and entry to WC was more difficult than Eton but it seems the latter at least is not the case anymore. Anyway, it's the school that's right for the child that matters and I'd be happy with both and still unsure what one would be best at times!

"Interestingly, KS is willing to question the basics of religion in its papers, while WC stays well clear of religion."

Why is it "interestingly" if I may kindly ask?

A boy can skip the divinity question(s) if he so wishes in this tripartite paper. My son simply loves divinity - his prep school Head of Divinity offered to swap places with him, jokingly, of course. He's since advanced to bag an A* at A2 Level.

From my observation, the serious contenders for the KS opt to take all 10 papers.

I question the fairness in including Greek in the scholarships when many schools do not teach Greek.

Greek is optional a friends son did it for the KS because she was told it gave you lots of brownie points.

Well that rules our school out when in comes to sending serious contenders!

Peteneras, I should have chosen my words more carefully. What I meant was Eton seemed willing to debate the basics of religion and allow candidates to doubt stories in the Bible. Given WC's roots however, divinity/ RS is neither in its regular entrance exams nor in the Election papers even as an option. Just take a look at Eton's past paper questions. WC encourages boys to question (except that I am not sure if it really wants boys to challenge religion). I find this apparent paradox (if true) interesting.

I agree with Colleger that it is about which school suits the child best. Despite the overlaps in their origins, Eton and WC are very different schools today. Their pre-selection methods are also radically different from each other's; one is very mechanical while the other is very personal. I suppose after all, they are looking for very different candidates. As for KS and Election, they are both difficult but in different ways. It was never my attempt to suggest which exam or school is better; I tried to highlight their differences in case anyone here wanted to know more.

Sorry to come in a few months late, but entrance is an annual issue, and this might help those who are thinking about it now. You don't necessarily need 2-3 years of preparation and pay for an Eton tutor. We managed it ourselves, starting only 1 week before Election (we skived off school), with successful results. They are very good at spotting the coached boy, as they don't want a student who will subsequently not cut the mustard. So if your child is bright, calm down, don't cram him too much, and he may even find it rather fun. If he doesn't, not only should you not contemplate trying for a Scholar's place, but you may even thinnk about another school.

"focus on the maths and physics olympiads and dumbing down of sport", sounds perfect. I hope to send to my kids there in the distant future.

The guy whining about being let down by his public school is hilarious. If you can't achieve at one, you can't achieve anywhere.

I forgot to mention that WC no long has any fee reduction for scholars, but KSs still get reduced fees.

DS just got his firm offer for WC in his top House, he's over the moon as it was his top choice, seemed just best fit for his own quirky, maths/physics, creative and analytical personality - he's been talking about the orbitals, DT quadro-copter, science library, kind housemaster, and table of elements on wall since the first tour. His current school normally sends boys to Eton not WC, but they say he could try for elections to college, he's entering in 2019 so... shouldn't we start preparing already? Are there good tutors who can brief us?

ZOMBIE THREAD FROM 5 YEARS AGO

As you keep reviving old zombie threads may I suggest it would be better to start a new thread asking for what you want rather than people reading through a whole load of posts before getting to yours?

My DS has been offered a place at Charterhouse school and although we are very pleased they have given us a deadline of a month to pay a hefty deposit. The problem is we are still waiting to see if he made it through to Wincol where he will be invited to sit their tests at a later stage. We only find out in May whether he has made it through to the next stage at Wincol. Also he was invited by Harrow School in September to sit their exams . My question is what do people do in such a situation pay the deposit for Charterhouse and if he succeeds in getting Wincol be prepared to lose it ? Why isn't Charterhouse mentioned in some of these league tables ? is there a considerable difference between.Charterhoise , Harrow and Wincol? Charterhouse seems like a very established school yet it's forward thinking, and Wincol is more academic . Any advice would be greatly appreciated especially if you have been or know if anyone who has faced a similar predicament.