Can you get into medicine with "just" 3 A levels?

[silver73]

One of my DC wants to apply for medicine but hates their fourth choice of A level - too late to change and wants to give it up. DC is wants to continue with geography, biology and chemistry. DC has lots of relevant work experience and 12 GCSEs - 10 A/A and 2 B. Got A/A in all the sciences, maths, two languages, both English lit and lang, geog and history...

Am interested in replies to this as my ds wants to take medicine too. He is taking 4 A levels but one is dance! Other three are chemistry biology and psychology. Not sure if the softer option of dance is good enough. Plus his GCSE's were not as good as yours. 2 A* 5 a 3 b and a c.

Well I've been doing some 'interprofessional learning' this week with some medical students and the one I got chatting to did just three. I assume he did four at AS and dropped one. Quality over quantity.

You can get in with 3, but would be better with maths or physics rather than geography.

I don't know how reliable this site is, but this looks like a good table of A level requirements.

I'd say that the number isn't a problem but the Geography may well be.
Surely Bio, Chem and either Maths or Physics for Med?

I know several students who have been accepted at medical schools. Good quality A Levels are essential, The all had 4 A Levels and to say competition was fierce for the places was an understatement.

are you talking about y12 - giving up a fourth AS, in which case def not, or y13 and a fourth A2 in which case no problem.

The top universities actually prefer 3 a-levels, so the student is not spreading themselves too thinly. Dance is a definite no-no, geography should be Ok. Medicine is uber-competitive though, you'll live on your nerves for a while. . . .

It's not that they prefer three, it's that they prefer three top grades to four if the fourth has pulled the grades down overall.

Handling more than three and getting top grades in all indicates the sort of capacity for hard work at a high level which Medicine involves.

There's also the point that universities have to be careful not to discriminate between different types of school, some of which are in a far better position to support students taking four rather than three, so they can't advocate more than three really.

Can he change the fourth A-level to an As level?

I'd have thought the geography would be a problem. Even when my siblings were applying, you had to be seriously outstanding not to do only from a basic choice of sciences and maths, any other than those would be treated as an extra.

Could be worth phoning a couple of admission tutors and ask their opinion? They're usually happy to answer that sort of question?

Most medical schools will make offers based on 3 A-levels however the majority of candidates will be taking 4 or even 5 A-levels, mainly because of the kind of schools and backgrounds these students are applying from. The geography is likely to be more of an issue than just taking 3, as are the Bs at GCSE. It's not the medicine is a particularly difficult degree intellectually, most C grade candidates could probably manage it if they had a decent memory and recall, it's that it is so competitive that they can afford to be choosy and discriminate on things like subject choice and GCSE grades.

I don't think Psychology is an option for medicine. Biology, Chem and Maths as a minimum really with all the competition. Who advise that Bio, Chem, Psych and Dance was suitable to apply for medicine?

OP says that DC wants to apply for medicine, rather than has applied, so sounds like Y12 to me.
Medicine is hard work and requires stickability. How are you going 'sell' this decision in the personal statement - at the moment it reads that DC did not research the subject well enough beforehand and has no staying power in the face of adversity. Sorry, I know that sounds harsh but you are up against an awful lot of competition; I know far too many straight-A 'perfect' students who haven't got into medicine (well, not at first attempt anyway)

DS had a careers interview last week and all universities differ with I think it was either Birmingham or Dublin wanting 480 or 460 UCAS points. Which I think works out as 3 As at A" and one A at AS

We have the edinburgh brochure and they want

GCE A Levels: AAA in Upper Sixth including
Chemistry plus Grade B at AS level in a
fourth subject.
A-Levels must include Chemistry and one
of Biology, Mathematics or Physics. Biology
at AS Level required as minimum.
For both AS and A Level, only one of
Mathematics or Further Mathematics will be
considered. Human Biology may replace Biology
but General Studies will not be considered

Thinking about it some more, OP says that DC has a brilliant track record so far - 12 GCSEs with 10 of them at A/A*. Did they breeze through them without too much trouble? Are they not used to having to apply themselves?

Look on this as a useful exercise where the DC has to 'learn how to learn', where DC realises that work can make up for lack of raw ability, that they can choose flight or fight.
Is this one of those subjects where it takes a while to 'click' and it gets better in the second semester. Would the school agree to not sitting exams in January but leave them all until summer when DC feels more confident. Would a tutor help?

bio, chem, psychology + dance is fine for medicine at many places. I know someone who did this exact combination and is now a first year medic having had two offers. For most med. schools the requirement is bio, chem + any other 2 subjects for AS, only a few places are more specific (I think Cambridge like maths, but even that might only be some colleges). Nothing wrong with geography for medicine either - it can be seen as helpful in understanding social & economic issues with patients.

However, I do think just doing 3 AS levels would look very odd and would make getting an offer much harder (some med schools do specify 4 ASs, but I think others may well assume it). If maths is fairly strong, it might not be too late to switch to that if the dc is prepared to work very hard to catch up and take all the modules in the summer instead of some in Jan.

short answer - yes, but it limits your choice of medical school. Increasingly they are using the 2 admission tests (UKCAT, the more widely used, and BMAT) to decide who to interview. Some require an AS and your DC would be unwise to give up a fourth subject before AS.

The student room is reasonably accurate but it's wise to check requirements with medical schools as they do change. I have posted a link somewhere in the further education section to another site I haven't time to find again.

Neither Biology, Maths or even Chemistry are essential but lacking Chemistry rules out most schools and lacking Biology to at least AS will rule out quite a few. Maths is rarely a requirement at A level, a good GSCE is needed and some schools like it at a higher level.

Many applicants for medicine get no offers, very good candidates often don't get 4 offers. The student room website has excellent guidance on how to choose med schools, those who study the individual school requirements and tailor their applicants to suit will have more chance of interview. There is at least one school that likes a non science A level.

Some great info here. Gelatinous you've made me feel a lot better with my son doing the dance option. Nobody advised him we looked at prospectus' and they said bio Chem as a definite req. He didnt do so well at gcse either physics or maths so didn't want to scupper his chances by making a poor job if he took them.
Personally from what I've heard here and other places my son prob won't make it as it is so competitive. But you have to encourage them to try for it don't you.

Both my DC got in with 3 A2s and the 4th subject stopped at AS. So yes, it is very possible. They talked to many many medical schools (as in actually rang them to check) about their position on 4 vs 3 A levels and every one said 3 was absolutely fine, better to get 3 A/A*s, than 4 not so good ones. I would suggest he emails/rings a few universities he's interested in to ask. However, it is certainly a no-no to dropping the 4th before AS, as they will probably either assume he didn't research the subject enough or couldn't hack it - both not particularly standing him in good stead for medicine.

DD1 did Geography, Biology and Chemistry, and Maths at AS by the way. So Geography is not an issue. She is in her 1st year so very recent.

My DS1 is 1st year medic, among his peers at Oxford, around half he has asked had taken 3A2, the rest 4,5 or even more. The standard offer was AAA even if the person was doing 4 or 5.
Coming from the Scottish system, DS was asked for 5A at Higher and AA at Advanced Higher (there are no * grades here) even tho' he was taking 4 + an additional "crash" Higher. Another DC at his school (not medic) was given an AAA offer at A advanced Higher.

As others have said, UKCAT/BMAT exams are becoming more important and being give more weight in the application process.
Unless a DC is very keen to do more than 3 subjects, they may be as well to do something a bit different and interesting that will make them stand out - ie not just the usual DofEdinburgh etc. For DC who are a couple of years away from applying, Arkwright Scholarships, Space school and Nufield Bursary awards are all competitive and all can be steered towards something medical. I'm sure there are plenty of other good schemes, but those are the ones I know about.

Ellisbell is right - around 60% of medicine applicants GET NO OFFER, and they need to be aware of this, and ready to apply again next cycle, when their application will be stronger with exam results in hand. Of 4 at my DS1 school last cycle 2 got no offers, 1 got a single offer and 1 got an offer an a place on a shortlist (half a offer?). These were 4 of the top 6 at the school. It's tough.

Not that it's happened in this instance but I would find it bizarre if someone applied for medicine but weren't studying A'level Biology.

Many medical schools don't require Biology A level. "Hard" science seems to be favoured.
Chem is essential and Physics desirable (especially if Maths is not taken). Biol fine for the 3rd. A good understanding of Chem and Maths are more relevant to medical students than high school Biology.

Hi everyone

Thanks so much for all your posts - really helpful. DC wanted to give up maths but seeing all the posts I think that it is best for them to carry on with it and they do too. Think we will be paying for a private tutor for a bit as unfortunately a lot of maths was missed in the first few weeks of term due to illness.

The 10 A/A* and 2 Bs were acheived with virtually no work and now I think the main issue is that a lot of work is needed for the first time in their school life.

DC is very committed - teaches, 5 years St J ambulance cadet, hospital work experience and did a trial run of the UKCAT this year (does not count) and got a high mark without any prep.

I have explained that a plan B is needed as there are so many excellent candidates out there but this was the first of many hurdles....