Appealing against Permanent Exclusion

[McTemp]

Would love to pick some brains out there! A friend of mine has a daughter in Year 8 who has just been permanently excluded, and this exclusion has been upheld by the Governing body. Parents want to appeal this decision.

The reason given for the exclusion was "persistent distruptive behaviour", and they outlined a number of examples of this.

While parent doesn't dispute most of these took place, it is clear that this is a very high achieving school, and her daughter struggles academically (School Action Plus for dyslexia), and I think the school are keen to get rid of the child, as her grades affect their results.

The child in question is also deaf in one ear, and parents would like to appeal because they don't believe their daughters disabilities have been taken into account. The decision letter states:

"staff received training how to deal with deafness on an annual basis, but accepted that perhaps not all teachers were aware of X's hearing loss."

Parents believe that the child's misbehaviour in class arose because of her disability as it was likely that she couldn?t hear instructions given to her and was placed in the back of the class when she should have been at the front.

Has anyone got advice about what the exclusion appeal process is like, and what sort of things parents might need to prove?

Many Thanks for all of your help.

It seems this school is due to become an academy in September, and so has permanently excluded FOUR children in the last month! They only had two exclusions for the whole of the last academic year, so four in a month is very extreme! It appears that once the school is an academy, they will have to "buy back" services from the LEA such as the Pupil Referral Unit etc, so IMO the school is excluding anyone they perceive may be a future problem, so they won't have to 'pay out' for a PRU place for them in the future.

Unfortunately I can't attend the appeal with the parents - I work in a partnership service with the school (think CAHMS etc), and I feel it would hugely detrimental to my role if the school knew I was helping; I have the Head's trust and confidence in my current role, and if I turned up at the appeal to present the case, I think she would put in a complaint to my manager. I have a lot of access to the previous exclusions from the school and the steps the school have taken in the past before excluding, and I worry I will be accused of disclosing information to parents about other cases(I haven't) or having a conflict of interest.

The parents are generally averse to outside help, so I have written a submission for them to take to the appeal, but they won't contact ACE themselves, although I have had a look at all the relevant things I think they should know and have tried to inform them.

Also, the school have her ethnicity as "White Irish" not "Irish Traveller" on their system (again, I know this from my current role, it has not been disclosed to me by the school)- is it possible they could deny they are aware she is a settled traveller?

Very easily, because the family themselves may well not be advertising the fact that they are of the Traveller community. So it will rather depend on whether the family can show that they have told the school that they are Travellers or that their attendance record speaks for itself in showing they are travelling.
It is actually not unknown for there to be an upturn of permanent exclusions at this time of year for "persistent disruptive behaviour". The official version is that schools try to keep the pupils in school but there is a point where it just gets to much and something is the final straw. Of course there is the other version which is as you suggest attempting to remove pupils who they would rather not have in the school the next year. I have no doubt that both scenarios exist.

Lies lies and more lies first the school were picking on here because she is deaf in one ear then its because shes a traveller now she was a angle at primary I d don't believe a word of it or you post would of simply read this child was really good at her old school now shes done a 180 and I am not sure why

But you pushed off with their picking on her because shes deaf in one ear the long and short is shes not behaving so I say get her put if its got so far the teachers won't have her and the governors are agreed then I bet my house she is as they say, and to say well its because their becoming a academy they have expelled four other students you are not privy to what they have done or how long the school have been working to them and their families unless they are all deaf and travellers to

As a parent I don't want disruptive children in my chikds lass and I don't care the reason

I hope she dosent win the apeal for the sake of other chidren like my son that have to put up with disruptive children on a daily basis

This "she's/he's no angel" line seems to be trotted out regularly as a smokescreen for unacceptable behaviour and total disregard for others.

Perhaps her parents might be better off concluding this high-achieving school is not the right place for a very disruptive girl that struggles with the standards expected. She's clearly not in the right place for her abilities and she's pushed the limits of acceptable behaviour to the point where the school don't want her - not to mention disrupted her classmates' education - so what on earth is the point of pursuing this?

Butterbur that's very reassuring. DD3 has been deaf in one ear from birth. Stupidly, I managed not to pick up on the problem until she was twelve (the Health Visitor having waved her through the test she had as a baby). She adapted without any outside intervention, has never asked for special consideration at any stage and has achieved very highly. The school were made aware of her situation when she was properly diagnosed but felt no support was needed because she'd adapted so well as a child.

She never disrupted a class or abused teachers or punched another child in the face, either before or after diagnosis. She refuses to be labelled 'disabled'.

OP aren't you crossing boundaries getting involved, albeit behind the scenes?

Crystal - the point of pursuing this is because (IMO) the school has acted wrongly. Regardless of her behaviour, the school has made a category of errors and not followed their own policy; inlcuding

1. Leaving a struggling deaf child at the back of a class, and not adapting the teaching to meet her needs
2. Not putting in place a PSP when problems started to arise
3. Making agreements with the LEA to put support in place to support the girl, then excluding her before they put these supports in place.
4. Jumping from one 2day fixed term exclusion to a permanent one
5. Changing the initial exclusion from fixed term to permanent without informing parents why, and doing it by letter.
6. Telling the child's class she has been permanently excluded before they even wrote to the parents to notify them of it - the girl really thought she was coming back, and found out by her friends writing on facebook that it was permanent.

Its a category of errors on the part of the school, and its very clear to me that they thought they could get away with these errors because the parents are uneducated and can't fight the system. The LEA's legal team is clerking the appeal - all of them have said to me they hope she is successful and the school is not allowed to get away with such shocking treatment. Regardless of what the girl did, she is being treated differently because she is a traveller, and that is discrimination.

Yellowstone Yes, I worry I'm crossing boundaries by getting involved. But I can't stand by and watch such blatant discrimation against a friend.

I would agree with Crystal and Yellowstone that such behaviour is unacceptable and all schools would be better off with out it.

However the simple fact is that the school has to abide by the guidance relating to exclusions and as McTemp has pointed out there is a litancy of issues that the school have failed on. If any school carries out through on the guidance correctly or even makes a few mistakes no pupils who had been permanently excluded would be returned to the school.

So could it be they did give her many chance but THEY didn't understand personally I think your over stepping the Mark.

And as you seem to be so involved makes me wonder why you didn't read them the kittens they were sent

Any who like the other poster have said seems she cannot meet the schools high standards they only reason for this girl staying in the school is to disrupt others

The only thing to try as you put it is the parents teaching heir child right form wrong

Well I work in a school, in my experience once a child has got a bad name and does not quite fit they do their best to get them out. How come some schools exclude loads of pupils where other schools only exclude about four a year.

I think mctemp you are really good to support this family so many people ignore it. Well done you I wish I had spoken up in the past but I find school staff stick together.

Maypole do not get too smug it could be your child one day.

Unfortunately I'm the mother of a child who has self harmed as a result of becoming fearful about going to school because of the behaviour of a small minority towards the other children in Y7 and Y8 - little things like flicking a lighter at hair, following home and taunting. She has also got upset because of the constant disruption to lessons and rudeness to teachers who try hard but nothing they do works so they give up. She goes to a lovely high achieving school which is heavily oversubscribed. There is a small minority who intimidate, disrupt and are utterly dysfunctional. One such child disrupts the other 29 and tends to ring lead a little gang. I cannot believe this thread and the level of support for those intent on destroying the educational experiences of others. Why should schools have to jump through a thousand hoops to exclude a little brat who is rude, breaks noses and attempts to damage property (so what no one was in the garden and no one got hurt, they may have been and it may have your child hit in the head with a stone). Disgraceful and antisocial behaviour which is a discredit to any school. For the sake of the education of the other children I hope the exclusion is upheld. Why does a child have the right to exert violence because she's deaf in one ear or a traveller. Should Travelling children not behave and be allowed to operate to a diffent set of rules within a school than all the other children. That's rather like saying the wealthy child should be able to get away with a bit more because mum and dad donate so much to the PYA. In the same way I think the three/four brats and their ring leader at my daughter's school should have been out within a term. They have a super opportunity, they cannot behave, they disregard and disrespect all those around them and have lost the right to remain in a fantastic little school with a brilliant reputation which they can only tarnish. They have no right to scare other children or disrupt their education. Two years is a long lead in to ruin the experiences of others.

hang on, not smug at all if this ever happen to me I would never dare try to appeal I would slink off with my head hung in shame because I hadn't done my job properly.

Like marriedinwhite said she should of been out a lot sooner count your lucky stars they kept her for two years, she you or her parents don't have the right to drag down others
I am sure many in your area would of killed to get into that school and would of bothered to teach their children boundaries

And quite frankly I am shocked you work with in schools its people like you who make my boys life a misery bullied for a year but the so called professionals determined to keep these wild things in the school.

Shame on you so selfish which is why no doubt the little girl is like she is you willing to sacrifice 29 other students education just to keep a disruptive in her class never mine in others actually want to lean which she clearly dose not

Next time explain to the parents if they want their child to be kept in a school she is to do as she is told simples

marriedinwhite very sorry indeed to hear that your DD has self harmed. Hopefully she'll be happy at the new school.

Whatever difficulties the girl has (and neither partial hearing loss nor being a traveller are a show stopper), breaking the nose of another pupil is sickening, really bad. Surely a PRU is the right environment for a Y8 girl with habits like that?

yellowstone, would you hit someone who was sexually molesting you?

I would suspect that most would say the answer is yes and from the description offered by OP we were not that far from that when this girl broke the lad's nose. It would be very interesting to know whether the lad was a traveller also.

As none of us were present then, have no idea what else has gone on or how bad her behaviour has been, we really cannot apportion blame and should really concentrate on supposed facts rather than belief. Facts that should be easy to substantiate by an independant appeal panel are whether appropriate training was given to teachers over deaf children, whether they instigated appropriate procedures in the class over this, whether the school did agree actions relating to the SEN of this pupil immediately prior to their exclusion but never instigated, whether the school did carry out the required paperwork to permanently exclude the pupil correctly and whether the school in general and the class specifically were told that the pupil had been permanently excluded before the pupil and parents had been informed.

That is what the IAP will make the decision on, not whether the level of disruption and bad behaviour warranted permanent exclusion.

I may be too late down the thread for this but what the heck.

All the stuff I saw when I was working with Deaf/deaf people showed that late diagnosis of deafness was very much linked to disruptive behaviour.

Child gets told to do something - child doesnt do it because they didnt hear instruction - child gets told off for being naughty - lots of negative attention leads to more negative behaviour.

Child isnt hearing much of what is going on in classroom etc - child gets bored and misbehaves and/or child is embarressed and misbehaves to cover up lack of understanding.

admission I understand that procedures need to be followed, nevertheless the fact of a Y8 girl landing a punch with sufficient force to break another pupil's nose I find shocking, that's all.

MrsDeVere DD was diagnosed aged 12 and her school would never find her condition or its late diagnosis a reasonable excuse for landing that kind of a punch. There are pupils with full hearing loss at the school too and I can't imagine them being treated differentl on the behaviour front either. I'm not sure if this child was diagnosed late like my DD was anyhow, perhaps her mum wasn't as slack.

i feel sorry for this child , she may be disruptive but she is just a child , if the system just gives up on her now what hope has she got. people may not want a disruptive child in there childs class , i wouldent. but the education system can not just give up on her . if anything it will cost the taxpayer more if these issuess spill over into adult hood. i should know , i have asd , not diagnosed till i was nearly 30 . not having help earler has affected my whole life. my dd has issues at school and im fighting for her , but not all children have parents who can / know how to do that . civilized socitey has to accept she is everyones problem

My husband works in a PRU. His Headteacher's end of year thank you letter to staff referred to their 'precious charges' , or words to that effect.

Being directed to a PRU if that's appropriate doesn't mean that the system is giving up on a child, far from it.

She should not be the problem of 29 other children whom she may well prevent from learning. She needs a great deal of help but if she cannot behave well enough to prevent disruption it needs to take place in a specialised environment with sufficient resources to support her to achieve and to moderate her behaviour. Teachers in mainstream schools do not necessary have the skills or the time (student/teacher ratios) to deal with this. I agree she needs support and it is more costly to support children like this than it is those who are able to behave properly and I support that too. It is counterproductive and isn't cost effective to keep her where she is where she is having a negative impact on other students.

i agree that this girl shouldent be allowed to disrupt the learning of the other children ( this has been a problem for my dd , she used to get put with disruptive kids becase she has sn , and she is quiet and wants to learn).I dont know what the answer is

hopefully the pru can help her modify her behavior with a veiw to return to mainstream

She should not disrupt ther learning of 29 others but I doubt if the others are all angels. Lots of children self harm for different reasons it is very complicated. I have met happy confident children that self harm.

What are the parents doing to sort out their child?

Hangon you re talking utter shit

Children who self harm are nither happy of confident and I am agog you would either say such a thing self harming just for the fun of it is even more of a worry than someone who dose it because they actually have issues

cookcleanerchaufferetc. Complaining to the school, getting the op to wine of their behalf trying to use the fact their travellers and their Childs deaf in one year as a excuse for her behaviour, so basically nothing

If the parents cant deal with it themselves why is the op getting so involved? It is the parents job to sort out their children. Op, you could end up getting disciplined or worse for getting so involved. I suspect this kid is a disruptive PITA with lots of problems which of course aren't her fault! Sorry but she should be excluded forever. What about the rights of the good kids? What about the rights of the kids who also have problems but don't act like troublemakers? Hate this human rights crap but let's start giving human rights to the people who work, behave, and contribute.

In my experience and self harming is a lot more commen than most people think. Children that self harm are not all bullied and quiet children with problems.