GCSE Choices - Music or Latin?

[sweatybrawearer]

DS1 is about to make his GCSE choices. He's doing the usual maths, English, 3 sciences and so on, and has to choose four options, one of which has to be a modern language.

He wants to do history, geography, French and music. He likes music, plays violin and viola, and sees it as a less academic option which will give him a break from his other studies.

DH, however, wants him to do Latin instead. It's always been one of his best subjects (although he's less keen on it than he was, so is not putting the same amount of effort into it as he used to). DH thinks it will be more useful in the longer-term than music.

Does anyone have any experience/advice about either? Thanks!

I think he has enough with his other core subjects of ENglish lit, lang, maths, 3 sciences, French, history, geog which is already 9 and about all he needs. Any others are probably going to take up a bit too much time so might as well do Music if he has to do a 10th one.

I put myself in for music GCSE in LVI without any lessons (I had grade 8 music theory with distinction already) and it was dead easy but I still enjoyed it.

I am going to disagree and say Latin. If he plays instruments out of school then it's something he can continue with as a relief from academia - taking Music for GCSE risks turning it into drudgery rather than something he really enjoys. Extra-curricular music is no less impressive on a UCAS form than GCSE or A level; Latin, however, is an unusual and impressive subject to have taken; it's also, unlike music, not something you can pursue in your own time or pick up again later.

Turn it on its head which is something that my DS was advised when we were in this position with two other subjects last year... could he do both and drop History, Geography of French? Worked for us

Latin every time . Music not in the bacc. Latin is becoming very in vogue - ds has decided to drop rs in favour of Latin and do French /german together and history

Who care if music isn't in some government dictated mickey mouse bacc. Certainly not the universities seeing as loads of the private schools won;t be doing the ebacc.

Either way he should make the final choice. I didn't think latin was in the ebacc.

LAtin is in it

My dd 2 is doing the ebacc, and she is doing Latin.

The ebacc is maths, english, science, a modern or ancient language, and history or geography (the humanities bit is where a lot of the controversy is)

ebacc is irrelevent in this case as OP's ds is doing French, so will satisfy ebacc whether or not he does Latin.

colleger I disagree that a musician will be bored senseless with GCSE Music - ds and a number at his school are very musical (post grade 8, several instruments) and found it very enjoyable and a nice contrast to other subjects. Composition and performance can be done at whatever level you are at (and yes, several of them did get perfect scores on this) and the listening paper covers quite a lot of musical genres that are new to classically trained musicians. I suppose it does depend a bit on how well the subject is taught at your school, but simply being very musical isn't a reason of itself to discard the subject.

I'd let him do exactly what he likes. Advice re. options is one thing but pressure is quite another. No university is going to care in the slightest whether it's Music or Latin at GCSE, given that the rest of his GCSE profile is very traditional. Latin GCSE is possibly of use if he intends to study History at university but that's pretty much all. Absolutely counter-productive to push him in a direction he doesn't want to go - it's only one option.

My DD does both - they're so different its hard to compare.

No way will a good musician be bored with a music GCSE! My DD is grade 8 on two instruments and its irrelevant, quite frankly (beyond the threshold required). Its a tough option, I think - hard to get top marks in composition and a really good grounding in music style and history.

OP, its unlikely your DS would ever need Latin or Music for a future career, so maybe this is one he can choose just because he likes it?

Totally agree with Snorkie's reply to collager-was going to make ALL those points myself- and also totally agree with thekidsmom-my DD is the same.

I wish people wouldn't say that their children are too musical to enjoy GCSE music.

Just let him choose.

Thank you all very much for your views. luckylavender, thank you for your suggestion of doing both and dropping something else instead. DS is thinking about dropping geography so he can do Latin and music (but will still need to get that past DH!)

When I was at school I chose my GCSE'S not my parents.
He has to study the sujects, it should be his choice with a little guidance.

Agree elph. sweaty your DH sounds very heavy.

Mine (six so far) talked briefly about their options but I'd never have directed them. He's clearly at a good school doing a strong range whether its Music or not. Really, the universities won't care but your DS appears to.

you haven't mentioned whether he has any idea of what career might interest him or what subject(s) he might want to study at university. If you look at the UCAS website you can get an idea of whether any courses would like Latin or music, they are unlikely to be compulsory for anything except Latin/music.

Wouldn't push him into Latin as he has enough academic subjects but he could do music lessons outside school rather than as part of GSCE. If he has any interest in teaching music used to be an advantage (don't know if it still is). That might encourage your husband to allow it or would music lessons outside school be a compromise?

DS says do music! He would be finished with his exams this week if it were not for Latin dragging on. His mates are starting to finish and enjoy the sunshine but he is still indoors revising. So, based purely on the exam timetable, he says do music!

To be slightly more serious: Latin is all-exam, music has cousework - does that make any difference, is your DS spectacularly good/bad at one style or the other?

he has 9 core serious GCSEs. Ther eis no need for quantity over quality. Employers and universities would ratrher he spent any spare time on hobbies, people skills, lying around and all the rest than an extra harder GCSEs so I'd go for the easy to get one music, not latin. If he really wants a 10th academic one then yes do Latin if his other subjects won't suffer. With music if he's done other grade music exams a lot of that counts too or did when I did it so it was an easy extra one to pick up.

The private schools for years have done the equivalent of a bac because they always did the 8 or 9 core subjects this boy is already doing. TThe mystery was why some (not all) the state schools seemed unaware that universities and employers thought candidates didn't look very good if they hadn't done core subjects.

I think you should let DS have the final say. DH may still think he is a boy who needs telling but in two years he will be a youngman who may resent doing something he hates.

I have made that mistake myself!

DS would like to become a psychologist. He loves history and that is by far his best subject.

As far as the rounding out goes, he plays violin (about to take Grade 4). He's also starting DoE next year. So will be juggling his time.

I agree DH is being a bit "heavy". He messed up his own education, and is keen for history not to repeat itself. He thinks Latin would "look better", whatever that means. I did modern languages, and regret not doing any music (in or out of school), as I love listening to it and going to concerts. So we're both projecting a bit if truth be told .

As a Music teacher:

If he plays instruments to a grade 3/4 standard, he'll enjoy the course, find it easy but challenging. There's no reason he couldn't get an A. Music is challenging for any standard, he def won't find it unchallenging, the Compositions are hard. Do find out what exam board the school use though: we use AQA as it's the highest proportion of practical vs. theory, giving our students the best chance of high marks. My highest achieving student this year was a singer who writes truly excellent pop songs, and uses the studio to record, arrange, vocal, guitar, piano parts with harmonies. She will go on to study Music. She doesn't read a note, has severe literacy problems and will still get an A, though not an A*. The only grade she'll get above a D, probably. Judge away, and tell me she doesn't deserve it if you heard her compositions and performances!

But yes Edexcel have put more emphasis on reading music notation this year, with set works to be studied.

Swings and roundabouts really, different courses suit different students - I prefer more practical courses as I teach in a very deprived area where students generally don't play classical instruments (where reading music notation is learnt) and it is impossible to teach reading of notation along with the rest of the course. Music should test musical ability and creativity, not ability to read the dots and the dashes. If it's a test on reading notation, they'd have to cut out so much of the practical side it would be purely academic, and what's the point in that? But if your DS learns an instrument he will be fine with that side of things, whichever exam board it is.

Note that Music can be the most elitist of subjects, particularly if notation is emphasised as the expected standard can only be reached with extra tuition, ie private instrumental lessons. Unless you're lucky enough to be in an area where funding for instrumental hasn't been totally decimated!

bofforpington thank you for posting - it's EdExcel. Perfrming 30%, Composing 30%, Learning and Appraising 40%.

Yep it's Edexcel who have brought in the set works from September. If your son is bright, and can already read music from playing instruments, I think it's a really good (although more difficult than previously) course. My only beef with it is how it excludes students who are starting from scratch with score reading.

AQA is 20% Listening compared to Edexcel's 40%! I would say that the Listening paper is always annoyingly challenging though in every exam board - as a classical musicians myself it's always a bit 'what is the examiner thinking here?' type vague questions!

Def go for Music over Latin, looks much better on the CV and socially really beneficial for your son too.

sweaty - it's 'Listening and Appraising' not 'Learning and Appraising'