Teacher speaks about lack of classroom support and abuse in schools

[HettyMeg]

Teacher from Inverurie talking about lack of support assistants. She's visibly upset and talks about the violence and abuse she's experienced. This is not acceptable!

Is this becoming more widespread? My child is nursery age at the moment so I am not personally knowledgeable about primaries but I have heard a few stories like this, very concerning.

www.facebook.com/share/r/1GMgQEDnpG/

Unfortunately yes - this is happening in most schools. And 20 is a small class! Some have up to 33! P1 is capped at 25 but that's still a huge number of children. There are just too many medical, physical, social and emotional needs not to mention learning difficulties and one teacher is supposed to be able to manage all that! Even if there is an assistant - they are poorly paid and not the trained professionals that many of these children need. We need more social workers, psychologists, speech and language therapists, physical therapists to work with these children long term.
Support has been cut to the bone and everyone is suffering as a result. GIRFEC (getting it right for every child) is an absolute joke and the government should be ashamed of themselves.

“Even if there is an assistant - they are poorly paid and not the trained professionals that many of these children need.“

Correct.

The pipeline for “teaching assistant” is generally “mum of child at school” the role was originally for hearing extra reading, helping with room admin, having soft chats and organising playground games. Now they are standing in as a warm body where vital services are not reaching children in need.

They can’t be effective in their roles as they have changed massively. Many rise to meet the challenges because they are often very caring and giving people, but it doesn’t make up for things like SALT, EdPsychs, PTs, OTs…

But it’s a broader societal problem of front line services being cut and schools becoming the front line rather than places to learn and also an issue with teacher training tbh.

Even 20 seems a lot of 4/5 year olds. What would ideal number be?

25 pupils in the class is a typical number in primary 1 in Scotland. Children who swear, kick, hit, shout at, try to hurt others (strangle them etc) is absolutely considered the norm now in schools. Add in the fact that they can’t play, have no focus, can’t sit & listen for 2 minutes, are wearing nappies & it’s a shit show! This only gets worse as they move up the school. Autism used as an excuse for many ‘normal’ children acting like this. Parents are too busy (on their own screens) to actually parent anymore! No one likes saying “no” anymore either.

It all sounds really unsustainable. A family friend was saying they were considering removing their child from school because of violence, this is in a small town, not in a school or area known for having problems in the past.

It seems there needs to be some major policy changes and an increase in funding for things to improve.

This is a difficult question to answer as you could have a class of 30 where most children are working at the expected level and few require individual support, or a class of 20 with several children requiring support due to ASN, trauma, language difficulties etc. The SNP promised classes of 18 many years ago but never delivered. This could at least make it more manageable with regards to giving pupils more individual attention and reducing paperwork and general workload.
Special needs schools have smaller class sizes for a reason but so many children who would previously have attended these schools are now in large mainstream classes with no additional support. This is all done under the guise of inclusion but everyone knows it's really just a cost cutting exercise.

I also worry about violence being 'normalised' essentially. What message does it send out to kids if this behaviour is going on in school with little real consequence ie they can't be excluded? Other children see no accountability, which sends the message that you can behave as badly as you like? Or are there still consequences?

When I was at school (high school, this sort of thing was non existent in my primary!!), you'd be excluded well before this stage!

Absolutely. And instead of inclusion being a positive change I fear that this lip service, cost cutting attempt is creating an environment where kids (and parents) demonise children who act out as a result of their needs not being met. An autistic child or a child who has suffered trauma lashing out in class is not something that others should just have to tolerate Everyone is being failed in that scenario.

Yes, very little is done to support teachers or pupils who have additional needs.

There are so many cases of pupils being violent towards one another without any real intervention to get to the bottom of the issue. The main "intervention" I've seen just trying to keep certain pupils apart. What else can teachers and assistants fo, realistically? There's also often little to zero adult supervision at playtime.

There needs to be more recognition that the school environment is a stressful one for many children and it comes out in their behaviour. Teachers shouldn't have to manage all this alone.

I’m always surprised the unions have not taken drastic action on this. Teaching is a heavily unionised workforce and the 1st role of a union is surely to keep their members safe in the workplace. What other workplace do we accept being assaulted as part of the daily job? Maybe the police and the army but I can’t think of many others where we would say yeah, expect to be assaulted on a weekly basis if you’ve got that class.
Surely there should be specific instances where unions step in and refuse to allow any teachers in as risk to them is too great? Or take legal action to safeguard teachers. That would help to focus the Gov minds a bit more on how well the inclusion policy is working?

Very difficult to exclude a child as they have a right to an education. If they are excluded where do they go?

We need to make places for them to go. Pupil referral units. The only people getting an education these days in Scotland are those in private schools. In state schools ill discipline, violence and disruption make it impossible for children to learn and feel safe.

One hundred percent.

Children now can violently attack others and remain in the classroom.

Yes the teacher has been attacked but I can guarantee children have been attacked also in her classroom and school.

Unfortunately a whole generation is being traumatised under the current government's focus on no exclusions.
It is criminal and I would homeschool my child if I could.

Parents have no idea how bad it is as it was never ever anywhere near where we are now in our time at school. It just wouldn't be allowed as there was safety in a classroom. Now, the focus has changed to keeping all pupils in a building.

you know when you want road safety improvements made around the school, and the council say no and then a child is injured by a car and finally action is taken, it’s like that with schools. The Scottish government will do nothing until a child or teacher is murdered by a pupil, there’ll be a public inquiry the conclusion of which will be ‘what the hell do you think you were doing by ignoring an increasingly violent child in the classroom’?

Agree with @Chinkirk
I've said for ages that it’s only a matter of time before a teacher or pupil is seriously injured at the secondary school where I work.

Parents have no idea how bad it is as it was never ever anywhere near where we are now in our time at school.

This is the most frustrating part. The amount of parents who say it would never in my child's school. Trust me, the teachers would tell a very different story. Parents have no idea how widespread and normalised the problems are.

This teacher was almost murdered and has life changing injuries.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ckgq0jw0eqzo

And I've heard plenty members of the public make sneering comments about how can you not control a P1 or how can a grown adult be hurt by a child. If the aggression is unmanageable at 4/5 years old then just imagine what these children will be like as teenagers and adults!
There needs to be proper interventions ASAP. This poor woman was obviously doing a great job but it shouldn't be down to a teacher to do the job of a psychologist/social worker/therapist/parent all in one.

I agree. No child should have to witness violence that goes unpunished and just have to tolerate it.

Exactly.

Only lick meant she wasn't murdered.

Nothing has changed re safety procedures on school for teachers or pupils. This person should not have been around other pupils. It's only luck that he didn't kill another pupil.

That was my original point really, the government needs to create spaces elsewhere for those children who are being violent (which involves spending money).

That is absolutely horrific.

Good point. Maybe it will come to that in time if nothing else is being done.

No. In fact teachers have been told they can be in contempt of contract if they don't teach a pupil who has assaulted them.

I was not told this in so many words but it was just about the worst day of my life when I was being attacked by a P1, luckily had a TA to take the rest outside. The child had previous and I couldn’t leave them alone in the room. My poor TA was trying to get help while with the rest of the class. When management finally turned up I got 10 minutes to collect myself before going back into teaching the class, including the child who had been pelting me with scissors and wooden blocks.

But talk of a “right to education” irks me because what about the rest of the class? That particular incident ceased their learning for at least an hour. I hate to add up how much time that child had taken from them.