Why do people still think the SNP are doing a good job?

[cdtaylornats]

They aren't even doing a competent job

Enjoy this thread OP🥳

It's all in the slick presentation I reckon. People genuinely believe that Scotland has much lower COVID death than the rest of the UK (generally taken to mean England). After all, we have our first minister up there every day giving out 'clear messaging' (supposedly), and we pursued Devi Sridhar's zero COVID strategy all summer and got rates so so low which really helped later (again, supposedly). Couple this brilliant leadership with our naturally sparser population and we should have miles fewer deaths than England right?

Except, not really. Sure, we have lower positive case numbers most of the time, and lower numbers of deaths within 28 days of a positive test, but we also generally do less testing so this isn't a reliable measure (plus it doesn't account for damage done by harsher lockdown). In fact, considering excess deaths, the only measure that takes into account the harms from COVID AND everything else (including extended lockdown), we have 1315/million compared to England's 1443/million. So that's 9% less and we're not even out of this wave yet, so no, not miles better.

Yet, Nicola stands up there and implies we are better off and loads of people just accept it as fact.

I can't understand it myself.

Any other country who's leader stood at a podium every day and told their citizens they can't see their families and friends for 10 months would be called a dictator and would be screaming about human rights.

But obviously people see things i don't because she has a lot of followers

@cdtaylornats

They aren't even doing a competent job

"Scotland had given the first dose of the vaccine to about 90% of care home residents. In England 63% of care home residents have been vaccinated, according to health secretary Matt Hancock"

"Both the UK and Scottish governments have pledged to have offered a first dose of the vaccine to all the first four JCVI groups by mid-February.

That is:

1. residents in a care home for older adults and their carers"

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-55675796

I think it's a triumph of presentation.

Here's one of the many reasons why-

SCOTLAND’S coronavirus vaccine roll-out “makes absolute sense”, according to a World Health Organisation special envoy on Covid-19.

Dr David Nabarro told the BBC’s Good Morning Scotland programme that he is “glad” to see people in care homes, who are among the most at risk from the virus, being prioritised.

The Scottish Conservatives have been attacking the Holyrood Government in recent days, claiming Scotland is lagging behind the rest of the UK in its roll-out.

Speaking in the Parliament, the party’s group leader Ruth Davidson claimed vials of the vaccine are sitting unused.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said there was a big difference in what had been allocated and what had been supplied, insisting the programme is not lagging and there has been a deliberate focus on elderly residents in care homes.

“Why did we do that? Because these are the people according to the [Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation], who are most vulnerable to becoming ill, and dying from Covid,” the First Minister told MSPs.

She explained that more than 90% of elderly care home residents have now had their first dose of the vaccine.

Sturgeon added: “The reason why the overall numbers, therefore are lower at this stage is because of that focus in care homes, because it takes longer and is more labour intensive to vaccinate in care homes than it is in the community.”

Yesterday Patrick Harvie also accused Scottish Tory leader Douglas Ross of trying to “twist the picture” of Scotland’s vaccine programme.
Dr Nabarro was asked if Scotland is 'getting it right' regarding vaccinations

“In Scotland I’ve noticed that there have been concerns about high levels of sickness and unfortunately deaths in residential care facilities,” he told listeners.

“It makes absolute sense to me to see the residential care sector as needing to be a priority for the residents and for the staff who work there as well.

“I’m glad that that’s the prioritisation that’s being done and I hope we continue to focus on the people who we know will be most at risk.”
Last year Dr Nabarro, who has previously worked with the UN and the WHO director-general, also praised Scotland’s approach to the pandemic.

He praised Sturgeon’s decision not to ease lockdown restrictions at the same time as England and said the country was “doing good” in its response.

Speaking to the BBC in May he said: "Comparing Scotland with other parts of Europe, other parts of the world, I'd say you're doing good because you are tackling it carefully and logically.

“You are thinking through how do we make sure people are safe and how do we make sure the economy can restart? And you are layering these two together.

They have a loyal army of on line minions too!

It's impressive.

frasersmummy

Exactly.

I think much of it is communication style. The approaches between the nations haven't differed all that much, but England's endless U-turns when anyone could see they were making the wrong decision have made them seem worse in comparison.

Public health communications lesson number one is: get a stable and familiar face to lead all comms. NS does that, like her or not.

Johnson, on the other hand, appeared so rarely for weeks at a time that there were regular rumours that he had sneaked away for a holiday abroad. The ever-changing faces at the briefings weren't helping anyone to feel consistently armed with correct information.

I think the Scottish government comms plan is excellent. That has helped them a lot.

Deaths and cases look lower per capita to me though? Eg

Overall vaccination isn’t as different as on the OP either.

@ThePricklySheep that's what I mean though - those deaths are within 28 days of a positive test, so if you don't test as much... It also misses out on deaths from other reasons that may actually be increasing because of policy decisions (suicide and missed diagnoses get a lot of press, but there will probably be other things like poorer general health if people can't get outside). That's why excess deaths are generally considered the better measure.

That is shockingly poor. If she’s kept us locked down without seeing family indoors for 5 months, (September!) still shut schools and can’t get the vaccine out on time or in-line with other nations it’s unforgivable. We are really not in any better position for having been under such harsh restrictions.

Because no competent opposition exists. There’s no-one else who has the credibility or evidence to show what they can do better. It’s a terrible state of affairs.

And there’s too many people who are for independence above all, at the expense of all else, enabling this to continue.

I certainly DON'T think they are doing a great job.

Wish the conservatives were in charge, at least we would get the truth about many of the things the SNP are failing on.

[quote Y0uCann0tBeSer10us]@ThePricklySheep that's what I mean though - those deaths are within 28 days of a positive test, so if you don't test as much... It also misses out on deaths from other reasons that may actually be increasing because of policy decisions (suicide and missed diagnoses get a lot of press, but there will probably be other things like poorer general health if people can't get outside). That's why excess deaths are generally considered the better measure.[/quote]
How do you mean we don’t test as much? I’ve not seen that.

Conservatives and truth - how's that working out in England?

By coincidence this just appeared in my Twitter feed. There's not that much in it in terms of percentage really - and certainly this week vaccines in Scotland have been something like 9/10k more per day than last week. So the picture is improving.

Because St Nicola is better at presentation and there is no credible opposition to challenge her narrative. Got to admire her stamina though. She certainly loves hogging the limelight. It masks the fact that the rest of her team are utterly hopeless.

@iquitelikenormalityafterall

That is shockingly poor. If she’s kept us locked down without seeing family indoors for 5 months, (September!) still shut schools and can’t get the vaccine out on time or in-line with other nations it’s unforgivable. We are really not in any better position for having been under such harsh restrictions.

I think we are - what's the daily average case number now, something like 1500? Versus what in England, high end of 30,000s?

Maybe because we didn't insist schools were going back safely when my bloody cat could see that was a barefaced lie.

@Y0uCann0tBeSer10us

Isn’t it still a bit better, taking testing into account?

I’ve been happily feeling we were doing slightly less awfully than England

@ThePricklySheep I'm just going by the UK dashboard. For instance, yesterday Scotland did around 26k tests, while England did 610k (about 2.3x as many per million).

I am no cheerleader for sturgeon ok, I can't actually stand her but 90% of care home residents vaccinated, albeit with first dose only, seems like a pretty decent achievement to me.

Speaking in the Parliament, the party’s group leader Ruth Davidson claimed vials of the vaccine are sitting unused.

Maybe she should take her seat in the Lords at Westminster which is a perfect platform for lecturing elected governments from.

@ThePricklySheep I'm not sure what exactly that is, but if it's total tests conducted, perhaps it doesn't take into account that England seemed to massively ramp up in recent months whereas we, well, didn't.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think England has anything to shout about, or even that they're doing better than us. I just think that the excess death measure is the most reliable, and that this doesn't really show much of a difference. Which makes it annoying that lots of people seem to believe that we're doing 5x better (or whatever dodgy statistic NS used) when we really aren't.

[quote Y0uCann0tBeSer10us]@ThePricklySheep I'm just going by the UK dashboard. For instance, yesterday Scotland did around 26k tests, while England did 610k (about 2.3x as many per million).[/quote]
I wonder if it's a bit chicken and egg? England is testing more and so shows more cases, but England is testing more because they have more cases.

I don't think it's as simple as if they both test, say, 5% of the population every day then the % of positives would be equal too.