Scottish schools opening

[chocciechocface]

I was ready for schools opening, but this new research has given me pause for thought. I think this came out after Sturgeon's decision. What do you all think?

www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/07/31/georgia-children-covid-outbreak/#click=t.co/Y9gSG9zENz

Quote from the article:

"A new report suggests that children of all ages are susceptible to coronavirus infection and may also spread it to others — a finding likely to intensify an already fraught discussion about the risks of sending children back to school this fall.

The analysis, released Friday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, details an outbreak at a sleep-away camp in Georgia last month in which 260 children and staffers — more than three-quarters of the 344 tested — contracted the virus less than a week after spending time together in close quarters. The children had a median age of 12. The camp had required all 597 campers and staff members to provide documentation that they had tested negative for the virus before coming. Staff were required to wear masks, but children were not."

Then the SG (Assuming such a thing exists...) should state it clearly instead of trying to bamboozle the public, which is one of the things that annoy me the most.

Sometimes it suits governments to bamboozle the public. No government's priority is to be open, honest and clear with the public at all times. In fact, there are lots of government papers saying the opposite citing national security, economic stability, role on the international stage, etc as good reasons to withhold information.

Both WM and Holyrood have made it clear their priories are to open schools, enforce attendance and hope it kickstarts the economy.

Ironically, business leaders are saying both governments are ignoring their advice about what businesses feel is needed to kickstart the economy. Just as teachers have been saying the governments are ignoring their advice about what schools need. Just as the NHS has said their advice and needs were ignored. Just as scientists have been... ad infinitum.

I would almost guarantee neither government have conducted research on the percentage of businesses who have already switched to WFH and therefore who won't be rushing back into the office and city centres now schools are back. Meaning footfall won't increase and there won't be a corresponding rise in the local economy.

No difference in the traffic in the last few weeks anyway so doesn't seem that the schools re opening have meant more are back in a physical workplace.

From the past few days, it seems that the Scottish Govt approach is going to be to blame socialising outwith schools for spikes or clusters

And given the transmissions were before schools opened that would not seem unreasonable, would it?

How on earth can it be a “rush” to open schools when they’ve been shut nearly half a year?! It’s been glacial!

I think you've missed that at least two of the cases had been in school last week @RaspberryRuff . It is difficult to keep track.
Schools were providing online education from Easter till June. They didn't spend six months doing nothing. They didn't spend six months working on providing infrastructure for ongoing online learning because they weren't asked to and no additional funding was made available to support it. They weren't asked for feedback on other solutions.
The pace that you consider glacial is much faster than most corporates, third sector and legal companies.

No I didn’t miss that at all, actually. Given the incubation period it doesn’t follow that they got it there in the first place and it is much more likely that they got it socialising and took it into school. Obviously there’s a risk it’s spread in school which needs to be watched closely. But surely everyone knew there were going to be cases and outbreaks when schools went back. Not a good enough reason to keep them shut at the moment IMO.

My dd got fuck all online education from school and ds had it very sporadically during the time they were off. Of course there will be outbreaks every so often. I don't think its a reason to close all schools

The pace that you consider glacial is much faster than most corporates, third sector and legal companies.

I don’t actually agree with you on this either having spent my career in a number of these types of organisation.

Also provision by schools was patchy to say the least, fair enough as they were thrown into a nightmare situation, and a lot of kids didn’t even log on at all. Great idea to have them left even further behind by a half arsed or non existent return to school.

I would actually have preferred mine in part time at least to see how it went but it is what it is. They are back now, we are being careful and following all the rules to keep our contacts low outside of school and they are happy. I don’t see the point of endless moaning that schools shouldn’t be open and it’s doomed to fail.

Why on earth shouldn't teenagers feel it's safe to go into each other's houses to socialise? They know they were/are to be returned to school with no social distancing.
That's safe, so why isn't the house party safe?
That is what many of them will be thinking.

More hugging and closer physical contact in indoor social situations I imagine. I've seen a few on my fb

Ok tell them not to hug then.
I heard someone on Radio Scotland saying they didn't need masks in schools as they distanced - in a very bad mood having heard such tosh
It will seem unreasonable to most teenagers to say you can sit in a room with 30 people all day, but you cannot go into a house with more than 3 of them.
Teenagers hate anything that seems hypocritical.

I think they’re going to need to implement face coverings in high school.

Why on earth shouldn't teenagers feel it's safe to go into each other's houses to socialise? They know they were/are to be returned to school with no social distancing.
That's safe, so why isn't the house party safe?
That is what many of them will be thinking.

I can't help thinking that and I'm a grown adult.

People are losing their shit over the cases in schools so far. How many were there before lockdown? The schools were more than likely rife and no one was bothered then. Ignorance is bliss as they say.

We weren't testing then. Not unless you had a contact in China/Italy.
How is ignorance bliss, if you have it and don't feel ill how many of your school could you pass it to? How many of your teachers will be off sick and not teaching you?

Primary school pupil testing positive for COVID in Paisley.

news.stv.tv/west-central/primary-school-pupil-tests-positive-for-coronavirus

@RaspberryRuff you seem determined to argue points I'm not making. Regardless of your previous career history, I have friends currently working across all those sectors who have been told they are WFH till the end of this year or until next spring.
I also didn't say the teens had caught it in school but that they had been in school meaning their classmates and people they were in contact with need to self-isolate.

Obviously some people prefer their DCs' education to be ad hoc and subject to sporadic and unplanned interruptions every time someone in their class or peer group tests positive. But imo it isn't a better solution for working parents, teachers or pupils. It's actually more disruptive than having put planning, funding and infrastructure in place to deal with our current reality.

The difference with all those sectors is they are able to provide pretty much a normal service remotely. Schools are not. I just don’t see the point in moaning. Would I have preferred them in PT at least for a few months - yes but then our part time model was quite decent. Is there any point in grumbling about it now the decision has been made and they are back FT - not that I can see.

The “ignorance is bliss” comment is aimed at the parents who happily sent their kids in before lockdown when the virus was probably rife but there was no testing. There aren’t likely to be more cases now than there was on 20 March and everyone is now losing their shit over a handful of cases. It just doesn’t make sense.

[quote chocciechocface]Primary school pupil testing positive for COVID in Paisley.

news.stv.tv/west-central/primary-school-pupil-tests-positive-for-coronavirus[/quote]
This is my kids school. Not his year affected so hasn't been told to isolate but a few in his class been tested.

Plus even if the schools had been open part time these kids would all still have tested positive anyway. It wouldn’t have made any difference.

But the ones without tests could only infect half as many of their non-party-going classmates.

Again, @RaspberryRuff you missed my point. A large part of the government's motivation in opening schools is to kickstart the economy because they think parents are WFH because of DCs. Actually a lot of people are still WFH. As a PP said, the schools are back but the roads are still quiet. Our morning commute is half the time it used to be.
We didn't send our DC in when the virus was rife. We took them out before schools closed because we have vulnerable family members with underlying conditions. I'm not grumbling about the DCs being back. I'm grumbling about how half-arsed it is.

@Dugheed did they test in school or get sent to a testing centre?

Sent to testing centre I believe but I'm not 100%

The kids from positive cases class have been told to stay at home but all family members can attend (different) schools and workplaces.

Perhaps you could make your points clearer @BottomOfMyPencilCase then. I just don’t see the point in moaning on mumsnet. I haven’t got what I want out of all this either but it is what it is.

The work situation is not straightforward. Many employers will have tolerated wfh with children present as a temp measure but may not be able to do so ongoing. Many staff may still be furloughed but have to go back soon and may work in shops/cafes/care homes and not be able to wfh. There’s no perfect solution and doing nothing but moaning isn’t going to change or improve anything.