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Scotsnet

Welcome to Scotsnet - discuss all aspects of life in Scotland, including relocating, schools and local areas.

Original poster

What would be a good time to change schools from England to Scotland?

50 replies

ARoomSomewhere · 15/08/2018 13:27

If at all...
I have a house in Scotland.
Kids went to Primary there.
Been in England for 2 yrs (semi temporarily)
Aim to come back but not sure when best?
Do they have to live in Scotland to apply for free uni place?
Or be educated in Scotland for 6th form?
Not sure when best to disturb them?
(they are 11 and 14, just)

OP posts:
HirplesWithHaggis · 15/08/2018 13:40

They need to be "ordinarily resident" in Scotland for three years in order to get free tuition. So I would.move sooner rather than later, for the sake of your elder child and the qualifications they'll be starting to take.

prettybird · 15/08/2018 14:03

Depending on when your kids birthdays are, moving sooner rather than later, so that one goes into S1 and the other into S3 (which is when many schools start their Nat 5 curriculum) would be good. At push, the older one could start at the end of S3 and in theory have enough time for at least the key Nat 5s (the ones they want to take on to Highers). That would also ensure you are back in Scotland long enough for the 3 years required before applying to SAAS for free tuition and loan.

Where would you be moving back to? Whether schools start their Nat 5 curriculum in S3 or S4 depends on where you are.

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 15/08/2018 16:50

Thanks Hirples

they are happy in their English school (just over the border) atm.

Its cOMMUTABLE

If they LIVED in Scotland, but School in England, does that still count?

OP posts:
prettybird · 15/08/2018 17:27

If you lived in Scotland as long as you were genuinely doing so , that should be ok.

www.saas.gov.uk/full_time/ug/young/eligibility_residence.htm

lettuceWrap · 15/08/2018 17:39

As pp have said, the DC need to be resident in Scotland for 3 years before the start of the university course.

Just pointing out that if they choose a university outside of Scotland, they will pay the full fees ie, if it’s an English university, they will pay the full, normal rate of fees, it won’t be “free” if they study elsewhere in the U.K. (or rather, it won’t be funded by the Scottish taxpayer).

My Scottish DC was in this situation very recently (which is fine but something to be aware of when making plans and choices).

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 15/08/2018 20:39

prettybird i'd not be pretending to live in a country!

I'd be paying Council Tax, on the electoral roll etc.

But the kids wouldn't. If they are educated across the border, GP across the border how would i prove it to suspicious minds?

OP posts:
dementedpixie · 15/08/2018 20:46

That link doesn't say they need to have lived in Scotland for 3 years, it actually says 3years in the UK. It says you need to be a resident on the relevant date which is 1st August. It does say you wouldn't be eligible if you solely moved for the education though.

dementedpixie · 15/08/2018 20:48

To meet the general residence conditions, you must have been ordinarily resident in the United Kingdom, the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man for the three years immediately before the first day of the first academic year of the course (the relevant date). For the majority of students who start their course in the autumn term, the relevant date is 1 August.

You must also be ordinarily resident in Scotland on the relevant date.

If you are not a UK or other EU national, you must also have ‘settled status’ in the UK (as set out in the Immigration Act 1971) on the relevant date. If you have not been living in the UK, you may still qualify depending on your circumstances.

We will not treat you as being ordinarily resident in Scotland if your main purpose in coming here has been to receive full-time education and that you would have otherwise been living elsewhere.

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 15/08/2018 21:09

Sorry, maybe badly expressed.

They were born in Scotland.
LIved there for all their lives (11 years, 14 years)
We've just spent 2 yrs in England.
(still have house in Scotland)
Thinking of moving back but don't want to disrupt schooling.
So would keep them in their (just over border) school but we'd all live in Scotland.
I know its not unique around here but don't know any other RL families with kids old enough to 'know the rules'.

OP posts:
Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 16/08/2018 21:22

I think im being dopey sorry.

So, if we have a house in Scotland but they live in England
(so, UK for the 3 years prior to study...)

as long as they were resident in Scotland on 1st Aug on the relevant summer then they could apply for a Scottish Uni place with no fees?

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 16/08/2018 21:26

I imagine that the powers that be would be a bit Hmm at the "Scottish" kids applying to Scottish universities with English exams. Whilst you may be technically correct in what you say, I'd suspect it might not be entirely straightforward.

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 16/08/2018 22:35

Yes i see what you are saying.

But if they are born there and live there and i choose to send them just across the Border for education i cant see that they are any less 'Scottish'

OP posts:
prettybird · 16/08/2018 22:42

Having recently filled in the SAAS forms (or rather, ds did), I don't remember them being interested in which qualifications the applicants had.

There are also apparently quite a few who live in the Borders areas and choose to go to Scottish schools but who live in England.

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 16/08/2018 23:51

yes there is a bit of a crossover i think but dont know how that works £ wise? are scottish schools happy t0 pay for an english childs education and vice versa (assuming state school)??
Interesting...

OP posts:
prettybird · 17/08/2018 00:20

I found this article - I remembered seeing it on Reporting Scotland earlier this summer. It's about the pupils who live in England but go to school in Scotland because of historic problems at Berwick Academy. It mentions funding but says that the extra cost of accepting placing requests is marginal.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-south-scotland-44540012

prettybird · 17/08/2018 00:21

....but no idea if English schools/councils are as relaxed Grin

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 17/08/2018 14:03

That is a very helpful article prettybird thank you .

It implies there are no reciprocal arrangements. Yikes

OP posts:
prettybird · 17/08/2018 14:13

....but it does say it happens, even though there are no reciprocal arrangements, so that's the good news Smile

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 17/08/2018 16:43

Yes. Thank you.x

OP posts:
Thomasinaa · 17/08/2018 17:01

Yes, free Scottish university places are about residence, not where you go to school. You could live in Scotland but go to boarding school in England, and qualify for free Scottish university.

motherstongue · 18/08/2018 09:01

Anecdotally, my DS went to boarding school in England but has always resided in Scotland. With 11 A at GCSE and predicted 3 A for A level on his application last year he wasn't offered a place at Edinburgh or St. Andrews! Indeed, it is openly acknowledged amungst many in the boarding community now that if your child boarded down South, keep your expectation low of a place being made available at a Scottish University. He missed out on Oxford (got an interview but not an offer) but the other English Universities offered. He (or us) are resigned to the fact that he will pay the full Tuition Fees to go to university in England.

Original poster
ARoomSomewhere · 18/08/2018 12:32

motherstongue

Yes i can well believe that.

Places would probably go to Scottish Exam students or English living students who would pay.

I wonder whta the stats are?

I did hear anecdotally that College Further ed places have suffered badly under the SNP?

OP posts:
Thomasinaa · 18/08/2018 12:36

Why don't Scottish unis want Scottish students who've been to boarding school in England?

Thomasinaa · 18/08/2018 12:38

Do they feel the same way about people who've taken GCSE'S and A'levels at Scottish private schools?

prettybird · 18/08/2018 14:03

I think that is anecdotal. The percentage success rate of Scottish students applying to and getting into St Andrews (in particular) and Edinburgh are very low so it is probably nothing to do with the fact that the young person in question has English qualifications. Numbers of Scottish/EU students are capped.

St Andrews, at least for the Arts subjects, pays close attention to the personal statement. So for example, if you want to do International Relations (it's the only Uni on Scotland that just does IR, unlike the others which do PIR and you can then specialise in IR), your personal statement should just talk about your interest in IR and not mention Politics Confused

Fortunately, ds didn't like the feel of St Andrews (even though he acknowledges it was probably the best course) so didn't waste one of his 5 applications on it (and I say that as a graduate of St A who loved her time there a gazillion years ago Blush). Unfortunately, he did waste use two of his applications on Edinburgh. But he's more than happy with the idea of Aberdeen (2 weeks until he goes Shock)