armbow here i am weakening i need a good talking to.

[armbow]

I am convincing myself that h will come to his senses and come home. it doesn't help that friends are saying the same thing to me. both his friends and mine all think he is foolish for throwing away his family.

i am thinking of writing him a letter (i know i know )in the hope to get through to him.

i am convincing myself he still loves me.

someone shout at me please.

i dont know your story!!

but i'd say he'll prob come back,yes,when he wants something!!

I have followed your story. I think he probably will try to come back when he realises what he's lost. Only you can decide if you can still trust him not to get bored and do it again though.

Writing a letter may help you as a last ditch attempt so you can say to yourself you tried everything you could but you don't want to beg, it's undignified. Also, don't let him think you can't be happy without him because you can, even if it doesn't feel that way now. Good luck to you and stay strong.

I also don't know your story and I obviously don't know your H but in any situations I am aware of where the H (or W) has come back and stayed, it is because the other party has just got on with things (at least to the outside world).

It may have to be an act but be strong, be upbeat, look great, act as though you don't need him and in fact, can manage very nicely without him. If he is going to come back, that would be much more effective than pleading or sobbing.

Armbow, I've seen your thread and I'm in a similar position myself after having kicked out DP. I'm seeing mine for the first time on Saturday and I'm starting to weaken too (maybe it is just part of the process, after the anger has worn off you start remembering the nice things etc). The only thing I can say to you is think of the hurt you've been through so far, was that really all for nothing? Be strong, however hard it is. If/when he decides he wants to come back, make him grovel. THEN decide if you want him back, on your terms.Stay in control of the situation, and make sure he knows it's you with the power now, not him. (I'm not really sure if I'm telling you or myself!)
thinking of you. x

was going to more along the lines of you muppet throwing away 13 years and 2 gorgeous kids because you want more excitement.

would not be a begging letter more of

"look what you are going to loose. I am getting on with my life now, you have treated me appallingly and I won't be able to play at being friends for a long time"

write the letter, and put it in a drawer for a week.

guarantee you would want to edit it by then.

could you start keeping a diary of how you are feeling / what you would like to say?

dont tell him you are getting on with your life, just get on with it! actions speak louder than words.

FWIW i am going through a similarish thing, DP doesnt love me anymore he says... im painting the house, working out, getting early nights, got an interview for college course monday, drinking loads of water, looking great, lost weight, got a heap of self help books recommended on here...

you deserve more

katerum has the right idea (Good Luck katerum)

When I split with my ex h, I spent months wallowing. I did try begging {blush], I gave ultimatums, I tried all sorts. As soon as I started to ignore him and move on, he wanted to try again (by which point I'd realised what a total arse he was and how I was much better off without him)

Write it all down but don't give it to him. Leave him to stew. Any pressure at all (no matter how gentle/none begging etc.) is likely to have the opposite effect

this is what i want to tell him

(hoping that getting it out on here will have a cathartic effect !)

You have behaved terribly. You have not fought for your family and that in my mind is the worst thing you could have done.

18 months ago you told me your were not happy. You left and then returned within 3 days telling me you had pulled yourself together (but you had not). You made me feel lonely in my marriage and I was left wondering what I could do to fix things.

I have worn myself out trying to make you happy but you have not given our marriage and your family the same amount of attention.

This year you left again this time for slightly longer and we agreed to go and seek help from a counsellor. You told me that for the past year you have had feelings for someone else, but on hearing this aloud you tell me you realise that this crush is not real but merely a form of escapism in your mind.

I forgave you this and try and get on with trying to make things work again.

The counsellor told you in no uncertain terms that you needed to promise me that if you were not happy or you felt things slipping back that you MUST tell me immediately.

You made a promise to me in front her that you would do this. You lied and proceeded to leave me in the dark about the state of the relationship. That was wrong and unethical.

I have gone through emotional torture because of you. All I have done is love you and try to make you happy.

You have shown me the greatest disrespect by admitting to me that you did not really try. In your words you are disappointed that things did not come naturally after we had seen the counsellor. You have to understand and take responsibility for the fact that in order for things to have worked out you needed to have actually put in effort.

You were naive to think that 3 sessions at Relate would magically fix us and make you fall in love with me again.

It is possible to fall in love again - it happens all the time in long term relationships and marriages. Of course having children and life knocks the stuffing out of the lust and excitement that you have when it is just the two of you, the key is to recognise what is happening and not call time because it is just not coming naturally to you. You have to try, instead you sat back and waited for it all to come to you and miracously get better in your head.

This lack of disrespect that you have shown your wife and your children is terrible. whilst I know you have been unhappy you must know that you have not done anything to change the situation.
Going to a counsellour and going through the motions does not automtiacally a happy marriage make.

The couselling was a building block for which we were meant to rebuild ourselves.

You gave up on us and for that I will never forgive you. You let me down, you let your kids down and you behaved like a teenager.

You should have been a man and grown a pair.

I am so sorry armbow

I do hope that was cathartic. It must be so hard to deal with but ultimately, it his decision and nothing you say or do can change it. The lack of control must be one of the most frustrating things. Is the OW definitely out of the picture ?? I suspect she, or someone else, is in the background

me too tilly but i can't prove it.

I've known so many people leave relationships and deny involvement of OW/OM because they think they are being "kind" but most of the partners left behind just want a reason (above and beyond "its not working anymore")

armbow I agree with the suggestion that you keep editing that letter but don't send it.

Unfortunately for you - and because of his lack of honesty, all the while there is an OW in the picture, these words will not move him. Nothing, absolutely nothing, removes empathy for a primary partner more, than a new love interest.

The only thing that will change his feelings about your relationship will be a change in you, that convinces him that he really has lost you for good and that he's not a prize worth waiting for - and secondly a change in his feelings for the OW. All the time he is keeping that relationship in a secret bubble, it retains its illicitness and allure.

Now you know full well why I think his relationship might still be secret. It's either because he doesn't want to admit to the world that he is "that man" who has had a cliched affair - and also because she might still be with her H and therefore he is protecting the secret for her benefit.

One of the things I often suggest in circumstances like this is to tell him that you know about the OW and can prove it, without telling him how you've got that proof. And that since you have found out the truth, there is no going back for you. You feel released to get on with your new life and have nothing but contempt for his lack of honesty; honesty that would have allowed you to move on much earlier. Watch his face and his reactions. For once you will have him on the back foot wondering what you know.

You know instinctively, and because we've been telling you for months, that these changed feelings were not attributable to anything other than an OW. There was literally nothing you could have done to prevent this. But because he has kept you in the dark for so long and you have been exhausting yourself with trying to make him love you again, you have been fighting with one hand tied behind your back.

Turn that letter into a daily journal Armbow, but the very best thing you can do now is to put on a very brave defiant act when he is around - and take him at his word that he wants out of the relationship. Set up firm boundaries and once you've said your piece, communicate only about the children and not how you're feeling, or about the relationship. Keep him in the dark about your movements and your life.

Tillyscoutmum I quite agree, but this "being kind" thing is such a self-indulgent delusion. It actually helps people to move on, if they realise that there was nothing about them that caused the person to leave. Instead, it was all about the other person and the secret relationship. Much better for armbow to stop thinking of her H as a nice kind man who couldn't help falling out of love - and think of him as a gaslighting arse who is having an affair.

whenwilli - he has tld me that the reason why he came back the second time was to work throug hthat his feelings fr Ow had gone as he would not be bale to face his kids if he left me for someone else. so i see you are right about this cliche he is avoiding and he has stated a fear of this many times.

i will do what eeryone suggests I just want him to tell me the truth - not just his watered down version.

But whilst he is denying the OW - he can pretend to you, himself, his dc's and everyone around him that he is not a cheating bastard without any moral fibre. He can make out he just fell out of love with you first and that the poor lamb was unhappy and then, some time down the line, the OW will be introduced as the one that "saved" him (and of course, there will have been no overlap - oh no - nothing will have happened until after your marriage had irrevocably broken down)

Its so textbook its ridiculous (can you tell I've been there ?!)

I like whenwill's suggestion of telling him you know but honestly, anything else you say to him will be pointless.

Armbow...every sentence in that "letter" you wrote is just another reason why you should never consider taking this man back.

It seems you want to "set the record straight". Well, OK but...

Like WWIFN, that will never happen for him. You and him have a different record. No matter how hurtful you tell him he has been, he knows that but did it anyway

Trying to make him "understand" is futile. It will only prolong your hurt.

Please listen to his words and actions.

He doesn't love you. he hasn't for some time. He didn't even properly try to fight for your relationship and let you take all the responsibility for that.

Take back your heart, armbow. It is within your power to do it, I promise you.

I meant like WWIFN said...oops

see the letter is all "you..." "you..."

"you made me"...

having eben on receiving end of a "you are at fault" letter i realy dont think you will achieve anything - either he wants you or he doesnt.

try rewirting it with "i..." "i feel"... - for yourself - not to send...

if you want him back - say what you offer him.

the only thing you need to say to him is 2i wil not ahve you back until you show me more repsect".

but frankly - if he done all those things to you - why would you want him anyway?

yes is his loss.... it isnt your loss.

i think i need some kind of proof one way or the other about an affair.

i looked at his bank statements / phone/ email. but nothing. can't think of anything else i can do

if i call his bluff then he is going to ask me about the proof i have ??? what would i say then

You don't need any proof. The reason you can't find anything is because in all probability this woman is at work and they can say all they want to while they are there - and nowadays in the evenings as well. He could well have been deleting everything too.

When asked what proof there is, you say you are not going to reveal it, simple as that. You can do that, can't you? Imagine a friend asked you to keep a confidence. Wild horses wouldn't let you blurt it out, would they?

But really watch his face and his reactions. That should tell you an enormous amount. Look for panic, rapid eye movements, gulping etc.

Hi armbow. I'm feeling weak today too. Having long daydreams about XP asking to try again, not helped by the fact that he signed an email to me this morning with an x. No other sign of affection, remorse or regret, just a solitary x instead of his name. And that's enough to make me feel like crumbling.

I would say definitely do not send your letter. It just reminds him that the door is still open should things go tits up. He has to really believe that he has lost you before he can actually comprehend what he has done.

Oh, and I'll hold your hand while we both feel weak. I might feel like crumbling but I remain resolute that he's out on his ear!

This is just a daydream for us, that these silly men come to their senses. I'm allowing myself to indulge my little fantasy just to have a break from the shitty reality.

Armbow it doesn't matter whether or not there is someone else. He DOES NOT LOVE YOU ENOUGH.
(And, BTW, everybody, if this man (or anyone) has left his relationship before dating or shagging the Other Person then that's not an affair. That;s what everyone says you should do when you realise that you are unhappy in your current relationship and 'have feelings' for someone else).

And sending him the letter will achieve nothing (writing it and editing it may well help you of course). He knows that you are hurt. He may well be sorry for the pain he has caused you. However, he doesn't love you enough to have not done it, or to come home.

I'm afraid everyone has the right to leave a relationship, no matter how hurtful it is to the left partner - people should always try to be fair and kind when doing so but most make a mess of it. Often the nicer ones make more of a mess in their attempt not to hurt anyone along the way.

"Often the nicer ones make more of a mess in their attempt not to hurt anyone along the way...."

Absolutely true ime.

right i will tell him i know something and watch his eyes.

SGB I know he is free to pursue some now but i am trying to find out of he did it whilst he was telling me we were fine. i need to know for my own sake.

i am not sending the letter.

Hi littlecritter - i have to see him tonight that is what has brought all this on.

I will let you all know how i got on