please help me forgive him, he treated me terribly early on in relationship, i want to move on

[brokenheartedgirl]

i have name-changed for this as DP knows my usual username.

i am desperate for some impartial advice and to see what other people make of this.

background - me and dp got together just over 3 yrs ago. he is 10 yrs older. he had seperated from his wife a few months before we got together, although we had known eachother through friends for several months. we have a DD aged 14 months and i have another DS from a prev relationship who is 4.5. and he has a 14 yo DD from his prev marriage. she was 10 when he split up from XW. he is now divorced and we are engaged.

when we got together we fell for eachother very quickly, neither of us could believe what we felt about the other and we were very happy. we were practically inseparable and he moved in with me and DS after 3 months. and the sex was out of this world!! the only cloud on the horizon was that his XW was starting to try and wreck his relationship with his DD, trying to stop him seeing her etc.

One day, after about 6 months, we had a silly argument. He had always been jealous of an ex of mine i was good mates with and he had found out i had been for lunch with him. nothing in it for either of us, not great of me, i know i shouldnt have done it but hardly a dumping offence?? He packed and left i was shocked, devastated, i couldn't eat, i couldn't sleep, i felt like i was having a breakdown. i couldnt believe that this amazing new relationship had ended. i was training as a nurse at the time and i had to quit as i was such a mess. there was no real explanation, but he kept in touch with me saying that he still loved me, that he missed me, he wanted us to try again etc. we were separated but in contact for about 3 weeks. he then asked me to get back with him. this was just before xmas 07.

on xmas eve 07 he just disappeared. i didnt hear from him for 24 hours and his phone was off. when i did hear from him it was a text (yes. A. TEXT.) to say that he was sorry but it was over. again. well, after everything that had happened you can imagine the state i was in.

then i didnt hear from him. until new years eve when he rang wanting to talk, i spoke to him purely to try and get some sort of honest explanation as to what was going on in his head. he explained that although he still loved me, he couldnt cope with his jealous feelings and never felt good enough for me as i was so much younger than him etc, and (in his eyes) i was out of his league. he he said he wanted to meet and try and sort things out but i said it was too late, that i couldnt take the risk of him hurting me again. however we carried on talking (but i still refused to see him) every day over the next month and i decided, against my better judgement, to give him a 3rd chance.

we got back together and everything was amazing, even better than it was the first time. he admitted he stupidly over reacted about me meeting my X and promised to control his jealousy, he fully admitted that he treated me terribly over xmas. things just got better and better. he moved back in and after a while we even discussed marriage and kids. fast forward to Aug 08 and i was hit by a bombshell. i found out that over Xmas, when he "disappeared" he had gone to stay at his XW's house. i told him that was it, it was over for good this time, i just couldnt believe the level of betrayal. he begged me to listen and explained that while we had split the first time, XW had asked him to go back to her. when he said no, she said he couldn't see their DD anymore unless he agreed to try again. he told her he didn't want to but he was so scared of not seeing his DD that he said he'd think about it, just to buy some time really. XW then said that he couldnt see their DD at xmas unless he saw her at their house. it was his first Xmas without his dd and he says he just went a bit loopy coz he just couldnt cope with the thought of not seeing her. so he went over xmas eve and stayed till xmas morning. he swears that nothing happened between him and XW, that he stayed on the sofa but he would say that wouldnt he?? he says he only stayed because he wanted to see his DD open her presents. i asked him why he didnt admit this when we got back together and he said he was too scared i wouldnt get back with him if i knew.

well yet again i was a right mess. i just didnt know what to do, the last few months had been blissful, the best ever, he had been an amazing partner and amazing with my DS as well. we talked and talked, he cried and begged me not to split up with him, and swore that nothing had happened, that he never wanted his ex wife, he just wanted to see his DD and it was the only way, that he couldnt bear to be without me etc etc. and i decided to let him stay try and forgive him. then i found out i was pregnant with DD.

fast forward nearly 2 yrs and he has been the model partner and father. he loves and adores DD and my DS. he proposed just after she was born with the biggest diamond i have ever seen. and we have just moved in to a lovely new home together. he is the classic, old fashioned provider, he is hard working, amazing round the house, does more than his fair share with the children. we have amazing sex still and we are so close and affectionate. he is reliable to the extreme... i dont know who the unstable man he was for a few weeks was, but i dont believe it was him. i know how much he loves me because he tells me all the time, i can see it in his eyes, i can tell it in his action, the way he looks at me...he is so perfect.

i love him to death and can't imagine life without him, yet i still sometimes look at him and hate him for what he did to me at the beginning of the relationship. sometimes even though it would kill me and also mess the kids lives up, i fantasise about packing his stuff for him and dumping him, to hurt him like he has hurt me. sometimes i even think of it while we are having sex...out of nowhere i imagine him shagging his ex wife that night he fucked off. even though he said nothing happened, how can i believe him when he lied to me and let me down so much over that time? even though it was now nearly 3 yrs ago that it all happened. why can't i fully forgive him??? why did he have to do what he did???

i am so sorry this is so long and thank you to anyone who has taken the time to read it.

Hmm, well, as someone else who had a bumpy start to their relationship (for different reasons) I think it just takes time to get over this kind of thing.
It's not a concious decision, and it takes a lot of talking it through. Have you told him that you still feel angry?
It really does help,we discussed it lots and lots
Reading your post now, I realise that something has shifted and I no longer feel angry or resentful, but settled and content. I hacve felt like that for a long time now.
In hindsight, I think he had issues and baggage to work through , which he has now done.
But please talk and talk and communicate, maybe he can explain his actions now
Good luck

I dont blame you for hating him for what he did so early on . He was obviously well taken in by the Ex wifes demands and threats. .
I know my Ex used to pack up and leave over a small argument and it used to cut me up something chronic. I bitterly resented him for doing it.
Your last question ?........He didnt have to do what he did. . .but i guess the Ex wife was blackmailing him and he fell for it. You can understand he was scared he would lose his DD. Who knows whether he slept with her. . .you may never know. He was clearly feeling guilty thought about pissing off to her place; especially over Xmas. Thats really tough . Was he merely thinking about how he felt and how the Ex felt ?? And not thinking how badly it would affect you.??
Understandably you feel betrayed and that may never go over this incident when he went back to her to see the DD.
Maybe you both need (for your sake more than his) to thrash this one out at Relate. He must try to see that unless you do , you may not be able to move on. His actions has caused you to feel this way, so he must take some responsiblity for it.
Good luck . . i hope you can sort your feelings out. x

I don't believe "the episode" had anything to do with jealousy - it was about control. I think the reason you still feel off-balance is that it has never been resolved honestly.

If your relationship is now a good one, you'll be able to tell him how you're feeling and he will care enough about your feelings to discuss more, and tell you, sincerely, how he was feeling at that time.

I'm taking you at your word; it was't that long since he and X had split up, and people do go off the rails at such times. Have you modified your behaviour to allow for his 'jealousy'? What happens now, for instance, if you meet a male friend for lunch ot drinks?

I agree with Grace. This is about control, not jealousy.

Tell us why he left his wife and whether he has a relationship with his DD. What was the catalyst for him leaving home?

If he has painted his ex wife as a harridan who was making unreasonable demands, as a mature and sensible woman, what do you really think about that?

yeah he knows i still feel angry about it. it comes up every so often where i have a meltdown over it and we talk it through again.

i feel silly for still not being "over it" nearly 3 years on...

mrsruffalo i am glad you are ok now.

maltesers i do feel betrayed, i feel that he chose his "old family" over me. but at the same time, i know that if i couldnt see my kids, i would probably go a bit crazy as well. but he has admitted that he was being very selfish as not only was he not thinking of me, he was not thinking of his XW or DD's feelings. he said at the time that he felt bad for hurting his XW as she wanted him back and he lied to her as well.

the ladies who have said the jealousy thing was about control, how do you mean, sorry, i dont understand?

whenwillifeelnormal yes, he has a good relationship with his DD now. and his marriage ended as it just ran its course, they had been together since they were very young and neither of them was happy. he said they had not loved eachother for a long while but had been coasting along for the sake of their dd. his ex is ok now, they are civil. he didnt paint his wife as a "harridan" as such, just that she was trying to get him back and was using their DD as a kind of pawn i guess.

Does he ever compare you with his exW? Does he try to dress up a disparaging remark about her as a compliment to you, i.e. it's lovely being with someone so much younger, you are slimmer, more beautiful, less jealous and controlling than her?

And again, if the marriage had been coasting along and had run its course, what was his catalyst for leaving when his DD was 10?

All of these things are hugely significant in trying to establish whether this man is controlling.

WWIFN's questions are useful imo, bhg.

Since all the uproar you described happened at the same time, I feel it's possible he was having an emotional blowout folowing his marrage breakdown and getting together with you quite quickly. What bothers me is that he's not taking responsibility for it - not, at least, sufficiently for your needs. You needs matter, very much. he wrecked your Christmas, kept you on an emotional knife-edge for several weeks and treated you with immense disrespect.

Again, this may have been a sort of mini-breakdown but you still need him to care enough about you to shoulder all the responsibility for the hurt you suffered.

While you say wonderful things about your relationship now, it clearly isn't ideal because you still feel insecure within it - insecure enough to be having the odd 'meltdown', three years later. This means something's not right.

Insecurity can be a weakness, but has it purpose. Even if you've always felt insecure in relationships, that would mean you need extra care from your partner. You're not getting that - not in ways that you need, anyhow. I'm trying figure out why, and what you might be able to do about it.

wwifn

thank you for responding to my post btw - i have read some of your other advice and think the things you have to say are very helpful and interesting - you should be an agony aunt!!

anyway in answer to your q's. he doesn't compare me with his XW as such, although he has said he has never been this happy in a relationship before but then neither have I, and have said it to him before. i dont mean it horrible to my exes, just that none of them have been as right for me as my current dp. he doesnt have anything bad to say about her really, just that they weren't right for eachother.

there was no catalyst as such for him leaving, they were just both unhappy together and had just realised that they didnt work anymore as a couple and he hadn't got any feelings for her. he wanted a chance to start again, he said that when he left he just wanted to be single as he had been so unhappy for such a long time he didnt know who he was anymore.

also it might be worth mentioning that once, i confided in his mum, who he is very close to (we get on really well) about what happened, and she told me that she knew XW wanted him back at that time but that he never wanted to go back and just lost his head a bit at the prospect of not seeing his DD. she also says that him and XW were never "quite right" together in her opinion.

isgraceavailable ...he has described what happened over that xmas period as him having a breakdown. on top of everything else he was also very stressed out as he was selling his old house (the one he had lived in with his XW) and it kept falling through, but it was in his sole name so he was paying the mortgage on that.

(i forgot to mention as well that his problem with jealousy has completely gone now, i still see my male friends and he is totally accepting of that.)

thanks again for the answers. it is helping just to write things down.x

grace as ever is right.

You are feeling bad because something is wrong with this relationship.

If something sounds too good to be true, he usually is, and for some reason you still have deep misgivings, despite his wonderfulness at the moment.

I would be interested to know how he speaks about his ex w, and about his relationship with his daughter. I would want more details than "it had run it's course". I wonder if he ever questions her judgement or sanity?

Seems to me that your instincts are trying to tell you something and eventually you will be forced to listen.

thisishowifeel

there is nothing wrong with this relationship other than me not being over what happened.

i dont have misgivings about the relationship, as i said before the past 2 1/2 years have been amazing. and if it wasnt for what had happened at the beginning then it would be as near to perfect as any relationship can be.

i mentioned above what happened with his XW, and how he speaks about her, he doesnt question her "judgement or sanity", why would he? and his relationship with his dd is fine now.

You said you already knew eachother before he left his wife - did he leave her for you, at least in the sense that he wanted to approach you and wanted to leave the field clear?

If he's got a good relationship with his DD now, presumably you see her too and have a relationship yourself with the exW? How does that go?

I've got to admit some scepticism about the story he's painting of an angry exW trying to wreck his Father/DD relationship, when apparently he left for no-one else and after their marriage had simply "run its course".

Did she feel that he left for you, because that would certainly explain her anger.

Why are you a broken hearted girl then?

I am going to against the others here and say that it sounds like you had a rocky start to the relationship and that he was confused.

His marriage had ended, he was distressed about not seeing his DD often, his ExW was making that difficult for him.

If he truly is good to you now, treats you well and is honest and caring then you have to let it go.

In fact, look at it from a different perspective.

If you had been unsure at the beginning of the relationship about your feelings, coping with a difficult breakup and not being able to be with your DC, and now after all these years your DH still brought it up during arguments, would you find he was being unreasonable?

How long and how often does he have to apologise?

I've just scanned this quickly and maybe my radar isn't as sensitive as others to controlling men and secretly bad relationships....but I really think you should give him a break. He had just ended his marriage - major stress and emotional upheaval for anyone, then had leapt straight into a relationship with you - not sensible but these things happen. So he had a 'breakdown' of some sort, triggered by a combination of insecurity and jealousy and being pressured by his ex and behaved badly and in a way that upset you. I am sure many people do crazy messed up stuff at the end of a long term relationship or marriage.

Since then it sounds like he has apologised, made amends and been a loving partner.

All the hunting for signs that he is actually a bastard hasn't come up with much:

He doesn't negatively compare you to his ex.

He doesn't stop you socialising with men.

He has a healthy relationship with his daughter.

He doesn't disparage his ex wife.

Perhaps if you guys had not got together so soon he would have had the chance to resolve his feelings and get closure without it affecting you. But it didn't happen that way.

Unless there is something else you are not seeing or telling us I would really try to move on and forgive him for behaviour which even you say wasn't really him.

Be happy. People forgive a lot worse.

wwifn

no he didnt leave his XW for me (or anyone) he was on his own for a good few months before he told me he liked me. i had no idea he liked me, we barely spoke to eachother (just knew eachother through mutual friends) (although when we got together we both admitted we fancied eachother rotten and thats why neither of us dared speak to eachother. )

thisishowifeel i do feel broken-hearted still from what he originally did to me. obviously not as much as i did initially but the hurt is still there.

mme lindt and kitsilano

thank you for giving me your perspectives on it all, i really really appreciate it. i do appreciate all the replies but i do feel that some of the posters seemed to be looking for proof he is a bastard.

BHG
Sadly many women have been hurt by controlling men, and it is easy to see signs of that in anyone. I don't think that your DH sounds controlling or like a bastard. He made mistakes, he was in a bad place.

Since then, he has done all he can to make it up to you, has treated you well, is reliable and a good partner.

I do wonder why you are still questioning his devotion. Is it a sign of your insecurity that you might not deserve such a good man, that you try to find fault where there is none?

If there is something else there, something that other more experienced posters have seen in your posts then obviously these issues must be addressed. But I would start by taking a good hard look at yourself and your relationship to see why you are not over this.

mmelindt

i am glad you dont think my dp sounds controlling or a bastard. he isnt, although the things he did when we first got together were quite bastard-like.

i am not questioning his devotion. i can clearly see he is utterly devoted to me, he is so loving and its not just the things he says, its the things he does. and the fact that he is an absolutely amazing father not only to our DD but to my DS (who is not even his) just makes me love him even more.

its just that i wish i could forgive him for what he did. and question how he could do what he did to someone he loves so much. as you said as well, i don't want to keep bringing it up with him and going over and over it for the reasons that you said.

i don't like the idea of going to relate but i know that they do online counselling and i am considering that, just for myself.

I think that Relate, or some kind of counselling would be good, BHG. There does not seem to be anything more that your DP can do to persuade you that he regrets his behaviour. Perhaps looking at why you still feel anger towards him would be a good step towards forgiving him.

Actually, a couple of Relate sessions would probably sort this out for you. I think you'd both need to go because the issue seems to be some sort of communication 'interference' - what he's saying isn't what you need to hear, or what you're hearing isn't what he means.

As he cares about you and your 'meltdowns' must be distressing for him, surely he'd agree to give it a shot?

If it goes pear-shaped, you can always hold up the current evidence for Mumsnet scrutiny

i don't think i would want to attend any counselling sessions actually with dp...as i feel i have "made" him go over and over it enough as it is and as mmelindt said, there is nothing more he can say about it i think it lies with me now to just "get over it"

fwiw i have felt slightly better since posting this, as i said before, i can't tell any of my friends because i just don't think they would understand why i didnt just end it for good that xmas. but then if i did i wouldnt have my DD now for one thing.

You can't get over it because you haven't forgiven him, you don't believe it couldn't happened again and all this is becasue he hasn't given you a good enough answer as to why it happened. When reading your story I alrady knew he had gone back to his wife before you said it. The truth is you only know what he has told you, I'm not saying he must be a bastard or anythig worse, just that I think I would be nervous in these circumstances.

lovebeing34

i do believe it wouldnt happen again, the person he is now is a completely different one to the one he was when we first got together. but you are right that i havent forgiven him. he didnt go back to his wife, he didnt move in with her or anything, he only stayed for that one night and he says it was just because he couldnt bear the thought of not seeing his daughter. even his mum has told me that he didnt ever want his XW back.

i am just so confused because on one hand i love him so much but on the other hand i have these overwhelming feelings of hate and anger towards him.

well i have contacted relate now for email counselling...got an email back from them today with an attachment to fill in and send back to them. at £28.50 per bloody reply ...and i can't even get the stupid bloody attachment they have sent me to open up on my laptop...well its dps laptop and i am shit with computers and i dont want him to find it. i dont want him to know what i am doing....i guess part of me doesnt want him to know i am still in a state over it...i am embarassed almost

since my last post, i have been thinking about it all day today, i am really depressed today, crying on and off...i was even sat at the bus stop earlier and started crying, luckily no one was there or i would have looked a right mental case... ...dp is working till ten tonight and i have been sat here on my own since putting the kids to bed in tears on and off.

I think it sounds like he had a wobble and you didn't resolve it properly at the time. He'd been in a long term relationship and within just a few months that was over and he was with someone else with their own 'baggage.' Add the complication of access to his daughter, a house to sell and probable feelings of guilt and I can see why he made some stupid decisions. He seems to be giving you all you can hope for and more now so I hope you can get past it and you're not too upset tonight. I think you need some help to let it go so you can face the future together. I cn empathise a lot with your situation and on a smaller scale I was in a similar place with my DH near the start of our relationship but 10 years down the line I have to say I'm over it and I actually feel a bit of compassion for the person he was then, and understand a little more the way he dealt with his overwhelming emotions.