I've really upset dh and don't know if I can make it up to him :(

[TheRedSalamander]

Dh and I had a row on Tuesday night and I don't know how to even begin to make things better. It was about the fact that I had to get up very early on weds morning to drive 5 hours to get to a meeting, and that I wanted him to help me get the childrens things ready for the morning (book bag, school lunch and nursery bags, uniform etc), he was doing the school run instead of me. I was upset that he wouldn't, when I had just done all the above (as usual) for the last two days plus two evenings of bath and bedtime as he was either playing golf or having drinks with friends after work.

None of that excuses how I behaved however.

When he refused to acknowledge the fact that I had a problem with this and basically ignored me, looking at the computer, I got more and more irate until he finally spat the words "ok I'll f*g do it just stop f*g going on about it" I guess I should have stopped there and be satisfied that he was at least going to help.

But I kept on wanting to talk about why (I felt) he was being so unkind- I even helped him get his golf kit together that morning before work ffs- blah blah blah blah snipe snipe etc. I was being rather controlled and reasonable about this however I didn't rant and rave. More of the same from dh, ie he continued totally ignoring me unless to say shut the f* up I am doing what you want fgs now go away.

Not proud of this but I was holding a towel and ds2's nursery bag and slapped his back with the towel a few times and chucked the bag at him, totally out of anger and frustration before storming off. So unlike me I don't know what happened.

He refused to come to bed that night, slept in the spare room and has refused to talk to me bar the odd text telling me how angry he is that I lashed out at him ever since

I feel so remorseful and ashamed about this, as he points out if the shoe was on the other foot (which it never has been- I trust him 100% not to be violent towards me) this would have been a hideous event. Although it didn't hurt him physically I've obviously really done some damage. What's nearly the worse thing is that I didn't even realise until he told me that it was the fact that I'd lashed out that was winding him up. "If you were a bloke you'd feel sorry for your wife" is what dh said and he's right.

He still doesn't want to talk to me or see me (we work fairly close by to each other and I wanted to see him at lunch time, plus I stayed in a hotel last might as planned because of my meeting on the other side of the country)

Am I able to make this up to him? I feel dirty and scared about this and don't know what to do next

Not sure to make of it all- however- just to point out, your DH is now behaving slightly manipulatively IMO. Not saying either of you have behaved particularly well but I think he is making more of this than he needs to, in an attempt to deflect attention away from his own selfish behaviour.

My ex used to do similar things a lot. He was abusive (not saying yours is but just to give you an idea of the type of man my ex was).

Yes you can, but I think it is probably really important you give him time to be angry, IYSWIM. Trying to make up before he's got through his anger may just make things worse. Maybe you could send a v short text to say you are desperately sorry and would like to talk it over when he is ready?

Another important thing is perhaps to try and work out why you got so angry and frustrated, not to shift the blame or anything (though he should apologise for the swearing-also not ok), but so you can show him you've really thought about it and so you can have a constructive discussion about how to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Done it myself, so I know just how you are feeling (throwing shoes in my case). Am lucky DH laughed as he dodged shoes, because our usual issue is that I DON'T express my feelings so he found the anger refreshingly honest. I still grovelled and we still agreed it should not happen again.

Agree with CW.

I am assuming that you have offered a complete and unqualified apology? And told him that you wnat to sort this out in a way that ensures that you never lash out like that again?

If you have, he should accept that, I think. The thing is, he lashed out at you verbally, and had been selfish, lazy and unhelpful. None of that justifies being violent, but the way you both deal with resentment and then snap or explode could be addressed. Preferably through counselling.

DP and I simmer and then snap like this at each other all the time, but we are getting better at stopping ourselves in our own tracks evcery tme we start to feel martyred or resentful - you don't have to roll over and 'let it go', but you have to put yourself in direct and assertive mode, not nagging and guilt-tripping.

He sounded wound up well before your lashed out at him, OP. I also think he's being a bit manipulative but I also think it's important to offer a proper apology for hitting out at him & acknowledge his point about only being able to get away with doing that because you're a woman. Not sure how you're going to do this if he won't communicate with you, though. Maybe he just needs time to calm down.

i think you have both behaved badly. i think he is getting a bit too comfy on his moral highground and should be accepting responsibility for the argument too.

and i don't think what you did equates to a man being violent to his wife - there are many reasons why it is not the same despite your DH is asserting it is

sorry you feel so bad, sounds like there is probably a big back story here if you have been getting so frustrated

I think you need to wait for him to calm down then offer a sincere apology, BUT and I would say this if it was the other way round,

if this is completely out of character for you, your dh needs to ask why you lashed out in the first place, sounds like you have gave him a scapegoat to forget about his own behaviour leading up to the event

There are two issues here.

1. Your loss of control

1. Your husbands abysmal behaviour.

Is your husband usually this shit? Is it a habit of his to NOT help you out, to expect YOU to help him, to expect that HE should have a lot of ME time while you dont, to NOT take his share with the kids, and to NOT acknowledge that you are even speaking to him?

No, you shouldnt have hit him, and Yes you should apologize.

But it seems to me you have worse issues to deal with than just you snapping and whipping a towel across his back!

Yes, it was not good that you lost control and hit him with a towel. But he is not without blame. You had to nag him to get him to help you and he swore at you?

Does he often react like that when you ask him to do something?

I would have thrown something (perhaps not at DH but in an attempt to get his attention and release some of my anger) if I had been ignored and then sworn at.

You have both behaved badly, so I don't see why he gets to be the wronged one and make you feel guilty for days.

TBH, I'm not that surprised you lost it with him if he was whinging on and on about doing something that can't have taken that much effort, especially if you'd done everything else.

Is he normally this unhelpful? Or did he feel that he was putting such a special effort in to take the DC to school the next day that he should be let off all other duties as a reward, or something?

WTF was he doing on his computer that was so bloody important? (this is a niggle of mine too, can you tell?)

I agree that he is now being manipulative - he is playing on your guilt to make you feel that you were the only unreasonable one in the situation so that you never feel able to express your frustration with his lazy-arse ways again. (not that you should make a habit of hitting and throwing things, don't get me wrong, it's not good)

What do you do about it? Apologise ONLY for hitting him and throwing the school bag and then LEAVE IT. You don't have to do anything else to make up for it. He'll come around eventually - you just carry on as normal.

"I think he is making more of this than he needs to, in an attempt to deflect attention away from his own selfish behaviour."

Completely agree. He feels ashamed of his own behaviour so is attempting to regain the moral high ground. My DH sometimes does the same.

How about "I'm really sorry for hitting you, should never have done it of course. But you must admit you were being a bit of an arse..."

let's be honest here though, if the situation was reversed nobody would be saying that op had provoked her dh to lash out. There would be talk of women's aid and leaving the relationship before things got worse.

Op tbh I think you were deliberately trying to provoke a reaction, and when you failed to do so you lashed out.

You need to apologise unreservedly, violence is never acceptable. You possibly do need to sit down and talk about issues that led up to this happening in the first place, but the two things need to be separate.

no no, that's a "qualified apology" and technically doesn't count as an apology at all!
PITA but true.

Apologise and leave it - later on when he's talking to you discuss his lazy-arse selfish behaviour - keep it separate from the apology or you lose the impact of the apology entirely.

"How about "I'm really sorry for hitting you, should never have done it of course. But you must admit you were being a bit of an arse..." "

Hmmm how well would that go down if the OP was a man. "I'm sorry hurt you but it was your fault".

Apologise. Sincerely. And only when that is done and things have calmed down address the other issue as a couple. It can't go on.

I do not normally post on threads like this as I don't really have a great deal of experience in manipulative behaviour and domestic violence. Having said that when I was younger I did throw something at a bf and even slapped one. However, it didn't achieve anything, made me feel crappy and was exceptionally hypocritical. If said bf's had done the same to me no matter what provocation I would have been out of the door sooo fast. Rightly so, one of them chucked me. Why should your husband be any different?

A number of the posts so far have intimated that there was provocation from him and even going so far as to say he is manipulating. As if this justifies the situation. If the shoe was on the other foot then there would be cries of it doesn't matter that he didn't hurt you, it doesn't matter what you did, he shouldn't have behaved violently. And that is correct. If my husband had done what you did to yours then I would feel that the trust would have been destroyed and I don't see why that is different because you hit him not the other way around?

Him possibly being manipulative is one issue (without further info I wouldn't like to make judgement on that). You hitting him is another. The one does not justify the other.

Having said all that you do need to talk as you both need to move on from this impasse. Even he must see this in his current angry state. I would just aim for getting him to start talking about it and as other people suggested apologise unreservedly (none of this 'well you were an ars'). Unfortunately you have lost the moral high ground - but that doesn't mean you can't get it back and learn from your mistake.

Give him time to calm down and for him to sort his feelings out. Apologise unreservedly. Don't say anything that can be construed as "I'm sorry but you made me do it." Keep your fingers crossed he'll accept it as a one-off and never, ever do it again.

I think it's really really shocking that so many people seem to think this is not on a par with a man hitting his wife. Sometimes MN can be scary.

Of course, you must apologise profusely. Yes, he was being an arse, but that's separate to the fact that you used physical violence to draw his attention to the fact.

FWIW I think your H was being incredibly foul, abusive verbally and, yes, provocative. In decent relationships, one person does not tell the other to "shut the fuck up."

You say you were being calm and controlled when you were nagging him. Though I HATE the word nag. So I take it you were not effing and blinding at him.

Has he effed and blinded you in this way before? Ignoring you, not looking at you, winding you up then using abusive language to tell you to shut up? Has he? If this is genuinely a one-off and he does not usually get so aggressive, verbal and provocative, then you BOTH need to apologise. If it is not a one-off and he has told you to shut the fuck up before, then I am sorry but I would seriously consider your future state of health if you remain in the marriage.

He verbally abuised you and made out that you wound him up: did din't bloody like it did he. No So now he is doing the same to you in spades by not speaking, not communicating, making you feel like shit, intimating that you are physically viiolent, has got out of a few more days of essential child-care duties and is expecting you to grovel to boot.

You slapped him with a towel because he told you to shut the fuck up If he had spoken like this to a stranger or even a mate, he might have received a lot worse in return. Bully.

Unlikelyamazonian, so the OP bears no responsibility then?

PS, I don't expect for one minute that he would dare tell his boss at work, or a good mate, in a genuinely aggressive put-down way, to shut the fuck up

Bullies are cowards.

Actually, I think that provoking someone to the point where they lash out in a minor way is abusive, manipulative behaviour. The OP didn;t punch him, she swatted him with a towel. Some people do provoke, quite deliberately, a loss of control in another person (though what they are usually aiming for is the provoked person to cry or run away, nothing that's actually going to be physically painful). SOme women behave like this, so do some men.
If your H frequently behaves like this, then there are problems that need addressing, definitely - and I do rather wonder if he didn't provoke you this much in order to be able to play the martyr the next time you ask him to do his fair share round the house.

FoxyRevenger - I want to say that I don't think it is quite on a par with a man hitting his wife but I do see that in principle there is no difference.

In principle, neither should hit the other. It's wrong to do it. But in general men are much stronger/heavier than women and if they hit a woman it leaves bruises/marks - this woman hit her H with a towel and flung a child's backpack at him.

I'm not sure whether I'm making excuses - it's still wrong what she did, but if it HAD been the other way around I think she would have been more likely to be physically damaged then her DH is.

So perhaps my post is pointless/ridiculous but that is how I feel about it.

Good lord. I'm amazed he's still alive. I think you showed admirable restraint and he is a complete arse.

BTW you might point out to him that you were actually looking for understanding, fairness, reasonableness and love, none of which is covered by Fuck off I'll do it in a fucking minute.

thumbwitch, I am not 100% sure what I think either, but I don't agree that we can use strength as a mitigating factor. How do we know the size and strength of the OP and her husband?

You know, I have seen two threads on here this week where a husband has smacked a child and the majority of posters have advocated throwing the husband out/leaving the marriage immediately, before the husband becomes a rampant domestic abuser. And now this.

I am going to bow out now because this is seriously not helping the situation at hand. Sorry for crashing your thread OP!

If my dh spoke to me like that he would be a bit maimed.