A question for Dittany

[roseability]

Sorry to target you personally but I have noticed your name on a few threads of interest and you seem to know your stuff

Basically I am trying to stir up an interest in feminism and feminist thinking/discussion in my bookclub. I am tired of the usual 'chic lit' that gets recommended, the type that revolves around romance and needing a man (yawn). I also want to stretch my brain a bit after a long period of domesticity and motherhood (I feel chained to the kitchen sink!)

I have recommended Sheila Jeffreys Beauty and Misogyny and they seem to be keen. One is an English Literature lecturer, who is widely read in feminist literature. She hasn't read this though. Do you think this is a good recommendation? Is it maybe too hard hitting for a first venture into feminism (I haven't read much myself other than stuff about the medicalization of chilbirth to allow male control of pregnant women as part of my degree).

Hope you don't mind me asking. Your comments on the thread about pornography were a defining moment for me. I had no idea, and I wept for my baby daughter and vowed I would educate myself more so that I can teach her to respect herself and never be controlled by men.

Sorry, it was in AIBU

Haven't finished reading the thread but had to second anything by Cynthia Enloe.
I read bananas beaches and bases while doing my degree in international politics and it totally blew my mind. She is the one who coined the phrase "The personal is political". Very easy to read as well.

Sorry, a slight diversion, but, SolidGoldBrass, did you know that not only is there a third book in the Native Tongue sequence, but SHE (good initials ) also wrote lots of other books? Didn't know this at all & have just been slightly overcome by Abebooks . . .

This thread has led me on a slight wander away from feminist books (more Abebooks coming, later, I feel) and on to this link which some of you might find interesting

Takver, ooh, no I didn't . I have always been a bit fascinated by language (indeed have told DS a couple of times that he is allowed to use expletives once he can explain their semantic index rating to me).

SGB, have a look here for lots of her books & articles . . .

What a fantastic thread - marking my place so I can come back and make a reading list.

Agree re A Handmaid's Tale - I found it really chilling.

SMP I was gobsmacked by that article. Great comments. Her language was worthy of any US talk radio right wing not job.

I also vote for Tenant of Wildfell Hall, and if we are into the classics then Tess of The D'Urbervilles is also a book that argues for women's rights and how men are crap. It's subtitle of "A pure woman" provoked outrage when it was published because it was felt she wasn't pure because she had an illegitemate child, whereas Hardy felt she was pure, she was a victim.

I would also recommend Wilkie Collin's "No Name", "The Law and the Lady" and "Woman in White" as brilliant illustrations of how women have to fight against major odds if they step one foot over the line of "be a perfect daughter and then wife".

The Woman in White is fantastic - Marion Halcombe is the best feminist heroine ever. I suggested it for my book group and everybody loved it.

Oh God I love The Tenant of Wildfell Hall, must re-read that. It shits on Wuthering Heights imo, have never got the loving Heathcliffe thing either. Yes to Tess also.

Just skimmed The Beauty Myth today, fuck it's depressing.

Tess had an illigitimate child because she was raped, not because she was unpure.

That book makes me !

Dittany you have just made my day with your theory on Wuthering Heights. The first line of my English Literature coursework read 'Wuthering Heights is often described as a great book about love, but I think it is a great book about hate'.

Every film/TV adaptation I have seen, focuses on romantic love between Cathy and Heathcliff. It drives me mad! When cathy states 'Nelly I am Heathcliff', I believe it is one of the most important lines in the book. To me, it represents how women (particularly in that era) rarely had seperate identities from men

My Beauty and Misogyny arrived, thanks for the recommendation. Have only glanced at a few paragraphs as waiting to finish my current book and get stuck in. I can tell it will be a real eye opener.

Oooh Miggsie THANK YOU for reminding me about Wilkie Collins. They are all fab. The Law and the Lady is one of the first detective stories, and features a newlywed husband sodding off, and the wife getting on a mission to find out what the buggeration is going on, she is a proper detective, it's excellent stuff. I love Marion Halcombe too, she has a moustache, she is amazing. Can I add the Dead Secret too?

I had heard all about Heathcliff as this romantic hero too - actually there is nothing good about him at all. He is a shit to everyone. In fact when I finally read the book I assumed it was a satire of overwrought "romantic" narratives, in that the brooding, dark hero is no hero at all. He is shown in almost comically clear detail to be a bully, an abuser (hanging the dogs is just a more obvious illustration of his cruelty), and a violent, unpleasant and frightening man.

You can get A Vindication of the Rights of Woman by Mary Wollstonecraft (1792) and The Book of the City of Ladies (1400ish) in those short abridged versions, if the originals are a bit heavy to start your friends off. Would highly recommend both in full though, to see that feminism wasn't invented in the 1960s

Finally, this is the most interesting analysis of Wuthering Heights I have been involved in. We didn't even touch on the feminist aspect at school

Thomas Carlyle wrote this in 1860:

socserv2.socsci.mcmaster.ca/~econ/ugcm/3ll3/mill/women.htm

It's quite interesting.