if you have exluded a parent or parents from your life

[abletosplash]

I have name-changed for my privacy but I have been a regular MN poster for a long time.

My sister has recently asked me if I think our mother is narcissistic. Unfortunately, I don't have many memories of my childhood and I put this down to it having been mostly troubled. I had a very aggressive relationship with my mother and my father physically abused me (us?) - not sexual at all but terrible beatings for punishments.

I have been reading a lot about narcissism and there are definitely clues to my mother and father's behaviour. My sister is considering cutting off our mother. I have always tried to maintain a relationship that was based on her being a grandmother to my eldest daughter. When my dd1 was born, my mother did as much mothering as me and I was always grateful that she was a better grandmother than a mother.

My questions really are for those who have excluded a parent or parents from their life.

• how did you do this?

• did doing this feel as good as you hoped (not having "ties" with your parent/s)?

It's such a long and difficult journey and I'm really not sure how I want to proceed. I get a sense that my sister is really suffering and her memories are affecting how she behaves.

I have cut my mother out of our lives.

I did it for the second time last autumn.

I wish I had not given her the benefit of the doubt when she turned up on my doorstep on 23rd December 07, wanting a reconciliation after five years of separation.

The first time was tough. This time it is dead easy.

The destruction that that evil woman has caused is beyond description.

I have been honest this time with family and friends as to why I have done what I have done. I am hearing the same thing from everyone I speak to. She, as a person, is wrong. No one can quite explain why or how, but wrong.

I now can explain how and why. She is "wrong".

This time round I am still in touch with extended family, and that helps a lot. Last time I had to deal with not going to family events, weddings and especially funerals, only get one chance at those. But I didn't want to put extended family in a position of having to make a choice.

This time, I will take things as they come. I am not responsible for this .....she is.

thanks saddest. It sounds like a tough journey and you seem to have found strength.

Can I ask whether you told your mother that you were ending the relationship with her? My extended family are aware of my volatile relationship with my mother and sympathise. In fact, there are more people that I feel cross about not intervening while I was a child.

i have not seen or spoken to my mother or father for 14yrs. Shes not a nice women and controls everyone, including my dad, which is why we dont see my dad. I have 5 sisters and a brother, 1 sister is at home still and my brother still speaks to mum but my other 4 sisters dont speak to her. I cant begint to tell you how nasty she is, she wished her own grandson, 1st grandson my son dead when he was born. Shes beaten me and my childhood was crap to say the least, i can hardly remember any good times..only shouting and being hit..and her shouting at my dad and hitting him..and he still stays with her and will not stand up to her.

I am currently deciding whether to cut my mother out of my life or not. She has definite narcissistic and bipolar tendencies and has recently revealed herself to be a nasty piece of work. She abused myself and my siblings emotionally and psychologically. I have finally seen the big picture and I don't think I want someone like her in my life.

Good luck with your decision. It's a tough one and I am seeking psychotherapy to help me deal with everything.

apart from the cruel things your mother said to her grandchild, your childhood sounds just like mine bitcat. It's so sad.

All the very best with your psychotherapy, wrinkly. I hope that it helps.

Isn't it incredible how many mothers out there seem so mentally ill? It's tragic. We are fed this image of unconditional love and support from home cooking women in nice clothes, who listen to us read and put plasters on our knees and give us Calpol and make beds on the sofa when we are ill. And when our mother fail to match this image it's like our worlds come crashing down. I'm beginning to wonder if we all have too high expectations. I know no child deserves abuse, in any form, but it seems such a common occurence. I used to feel so isolated but hearing so many stories similar to my own here has made me feel like one of many - which is so terribly sad but also makes me feel less alone.

my mum was mentally ill - undiagnosed - but definate paranoia - thinking people were watching her and her house was bugged etc.

anyway as i became an adult and got married, she got weirder and we eventually fell out.

i didn't contact her for two years.

sometimes you ust have to do what you have to do.

I went into care at 15 and havent seen her since 16, so nrly 10 yrs now.
not having contact/cutting her out my life was like lifting a massive burden off my shoulders, i was finally free to be myself for the first time in 15 years, I cannot describe accurately in words how good that felt.

she has recently(the last 2yrs) sent contact via letter via SS. needless to say, I have not replied. Im convinced she is possibly BPD and almost definately a narc

she has never had any contact with my 2(soon to be 3) dcs and never will have. My oldest is 6 and has just started asking Qs about our family, Im not sure entirely how to proceed with this, either to tell them she is dead or just change the subject before more questions arise-something I will have to start thinking about.

you are so right wrinkly! We have this image of how a mum should be and how we thinks things are in other houses.
bless you all for sharing your stories. I guess I am most afraid of treating my girls similarly. The signs and symptoms have really frightened me especially when I recognize my own behaviours.

I think the difference here is you recognize when your behaviours might start going down a bad road. My mother never did. As far as she was concerned she was an amazing mother who suffered so very much in order for us to have a good life, and we, her children, should be grateful. Ummmm, ok. NO.

The one thing I have really had to come to terms with is that a mother, MY mother, can and did make choices that actually harmed her children. It's a bitter pill to swallow, especially when there is no acknowledgement from her that anything was awry in our childhoods. As far as she remembers, she was the victim in everything and we were all fine and dandy.

I think abletosplash that if your sister is suffering with the memories of her childhood, then perhaps she should 'take a break' and possibly consider counselling too, it might help.

You seem to say that your Mum is a good GM, and has been helpful, so it's not like she seems to be as evil and wicked as some of mothers described here.

As her sister, the best thing you can do is to support her decision if that's the one she needs to take. If you are happy to continue contact with your mum, absolutely continue.

My mum cut contact with her mother, because she was not well treated as a child, and was 'the middle one'. She grew up watching her brother and her baby sister be doted upon, while she was subjected to different rules entirely.

So on the day of her marriage, she said Enough was Enough and didn't have any contact with her parents, nor her sister and her family.

27 years later, they met up. I only met my GM when I was 23. She was just an old lady to me, not my Grandmother, and she never really will be.

I feel badly somehow that we are not closer. She is a GGM to my son, and we all know how rare GGMs are.. so really special. I always go to 'do's she'll be at, and have seen my mums sister and her family a few times. I like them very much.

My mum knows now that the decision she made (at 21yo) was flawed. That she denied her DC the chance of knowing their only grandfather, he died when I was in my teens, I never met him. She realises that the actions she took had deep and far reaching consequences, and that had she known, she wouldn't have cut off contact.

So, the point of this tome of a post is to suggest that if you know that the DC will be safe, to perhaps encourage your sister to still allow contact with their GM, but by all means for her to take a break from seeing your mum, if that's what she needs to do.

Apologies, that seems ridiculously long...

I have not spoken to my Mother for well over a year now. There wasn't a huge falling out or anything just that I decided I would start putting as much effort into the relationship as she did, needless to say she has put 0 effort in and hence we now do do see her.

I wrote her a letter explaining this and the one I got back was well apparently everything is my fault, even as a child I thought I was better than her! She has always been intensely jealous of me and resented me for being this independent little girl so she shut me out in favour of my brother who in her words was slower and needed her more. She never had a nice word to say to me and I grew up without cuddles or any words of encouragement. She has tried to continue this through my DC and has said some pretty nasty things about them (of course everything is denied) as to the outside world she is the prefect mother who is SO proud of me.

I still have contact with my Dad (they are divorced) and my brother who kind of feels caught in the middle of it all.

It's sad as I miss having a mother and a grandmother in our lives but I do not miss her and her poisoned view of the world. When we did have contact it was maybe 2 visits a year and fortnightly phonecalls about how ill she was which were so depressing as she never has anything good to say about anyone. It hurts when you see other GPs having such an active role in the GCs lives that mine do not have that though.

So in answer to you questions OP

I stopped making any effort to visit or phone and neither has she

although it is sad I do not have a Mother in my life, I feel better for not having her negative put downs around me

I haven't spoken to my parents since november.

They do not know I am expecting dc2 (they wouldn't be impressed) or that I am getting married in a couple of weeks.

Once I finally snapped it was easier to cut them off than I thought, but I did it by letter and not in person.

The feeling of relief was immense. I still won't answer the phone, but I don't feel sick everytime it rings or the doorbell goes.

It is sad in a way but I didn't realise how much stress I was under until I made the decision and I can honestly say I've never been happier.

I cut contact with my Mum when I was 27 (I'm now 40) and am in the process of cutting my Dad out. I have never regretted it and wish I had done it earlier. She is a full on narc, ex-alcoholic and very abusive. My sister has arms length contact with her.

The fact that your mother can be a good grandmother must be galling, as she didn't look after you that well by the sounds of it.

Two months ago my DD (5) was talking to friend's DS (7) and said 'oh my gran is dead'. I said she's not but I don't see her because she wasn't very nice to me. 'Why?' She used to shout at me and hit me. Two children go quiet and think long and hard. But they both got it, I think kids can cope with the concept of not being friends with someone better than adults.

Oh, and as to how, I wrote her a letter. She has intermittenly tried to re-establish contact but I've never engaged. Why would I? It's so much better to have that sense of release.

i have cut my mum out of my life so many times. i did it for my own sanity, because her behaviour and attitude towards me was just foul, and because i could not help but hope for and expect her to like me and support me.
i now have a conditional relationship with her. our relationship depends on her treating me like a human being; any failure to do so results in me insisting on being treated like a person with feelings, and reminding her to feck off until she can grow up and do so. counselling really helped me to achieve this.
over the years i learned to survive without her support, and need nothing from her. she now needs us, and has had to adapt her behaviour in order to have us in her life. now my dc is older her bad behaviour is not only seen by me, and my dc vocalises his unhappiness with her when she does play up
i have to treat her like a child; i reward positive behaviours with praise, and dish out a bollocking when necessary. yes it can be tedious but it really is the only way we can have a relationship.
i really feel for you and your sister; my situation filled me with anguish, i grew up without a self-esteem. counselling really did help on every level.

I stopped speaking to my father about 12 years ago. A couple of years ago I got back in touch, maybe I was feeling guilty and thinking that I should get back in touch now that I had children. We had a year of sporadic contact where I realised just why we were separated in the first place. Another year has passed and I wish I had not bothered trying again.

I think that if you are seriously thinking about this, things must be bad.

I feel better now, when we were in contact I agonised over things all the time, now I don't have to worry. I don't think about him and how he might feel, he made his decisions and this was the result. I do not feel guilty.

Two of my closest friends were abused by their mothers. Both have cut contact. I only knew one of the mothers but the reaction described here is so familiar - the victim mentality, lack of responsibility for anything. Some abusive parents, I've heard, learn enough about loving from their children to enable them to be better grandparents than they were parents.

My Dad's mother was also abusive. And she's still a vicious old bitch, frankly.

I think Wrinklyraisin makes a very good point - we're so conditioned to the idea of perfect mothers, or mothers being the better parent to look after children, that we allow these abusers to get away with it. It worries me very much, for example, that something like 97% of family court cases end up with Residence going to the mother.

We need to allow children to be much more open and honest about their relationships with their mothers if we are going to tackle this abuse, rather than reinforcing the stereotype of male abuser/female victim all the time.

Sorry to be late replying to your question.

I think she knew that, that was that, when I asked her if she was still in touch with my xh. I now know that she...along with my sisters, were behind the endless custody cases. She has had a hand in the current breakdown of my second marriage, and every relationship that I have ever had. She completely controlled my early career. Badly.

She said that she was still in touch with xh...and I put the phone down. This was last september.

I have blocked her number as she has been calling our home over and over and over.

I want nothing more to do with her....ever.

This has been confirmed as the only viable route by my doctor, therapist, relate et al.

I cut contact with my dad a year ago. I do not miss the panic and upset I used to feel every time I spoke to him on the phone. He was/is emotionally abusive.

I sometimes feel guilt at the fact that he won't see my dcs in their early years, and have thought about trying again. He would have to make amends in some way first, and I know he is passive so I would need to arrange for this to happen, and the potential that I would be hurt and humiliated would be too great for me to risk it at the moment.

I cut all ties with my father, whom I'd only known since I was an adult owing to my parent's divorce, nearly 3 years ago. I realised (because of specific events) that he wasn't the man he aimed/pretended to be or the man I viewed him as and because of his attitude towards me there was no going back.

I did it in anger and it took me a long time to calm down, months, if not years. I still don't regret it, which surprises me. I now feel relieved that I'm no longer on call when he and his wife fall out, no longer to blame for whatever I say in response and at peace with myself. Had I continued the relationship the dispute between us would have run and run with neither of us backing down yet here I *knew8 I was not in the wrong and I would forever have felt judged, hurt and it would always have come between us.

The pay-off was of course not just losing my father but losing my roots, my children's Grandad and the chance to catch up on all those missed years. I'm resentful that this is the case, particularly as it was caused by another family member to start with, but accept that the alternative would come at too high a price.

Sometimes you just have to accept that it wasn't meant to be and move on. With great friends and the security of knowing that I am happier and no longer in the centre of family politics I managed to do just that.

Should you decide to walk away from your family's problems I hope you will feel the same. I can only advise that you don't do it without being able to say that you really tried all alternatives and that if you do walk you surround take comfort and support in the people around you who care about you.

I can honestly say that the relief of not having to deal with people who not only don't have your best interests at heart, but who often actively work against your best interests, is worth everything else.

There is a lot of sentimentality written about mothers and fathers and family in general, but the truth is that some people just aren't good parents. If your parents are lacking then it just isn't your fault and you don't have to put up with it just to keep society at large happy.

It's completely possible to make your own family and to be as secure and happy with them as with your blood family.

Life is short and it's only natural to want to feel happy and secure. If you aren't dealt a perfect life then you have every right to try to build yourself another one that suits you better.

yes celtic, the relief is amazing. The knot I used to feel in my stomach when the telephone rang was ridiculous.

well my dad decided to move to another country and not tell me. I didn't notice for several years as he had been totally disinterested in my family for years (ie he has never bothered to meet one of my children)
So when he got his new wife to ring me, bleating about how all this had gone on for long enough, I realised what a relief it was to have such a negative influence out of my life. (he was emotionally abusive to us all for years and years when I was young)
Minor upset every now and again when he gets to have a pop at me, but other than that....
As i got nothing out of him, practically, or emotionally as a parent, I can't say I miss him.