My dh is having a terrible time at work and wants to quit.

[runragged]

Ok I will try no to waffle and stick to the point, my notes are a whole jotter full so I will summarise.

DH is having a terrible time at work, he knows that his boss hates him, she gave him a totally unfounded Final written warning in October and in January she told him there had been other talk of dismissing him. She expects all of her staff to work minimum 10 hours a day, come into work on days off and take paperwork home. Snidy remarks (again totally unfounded) have been made about a supposed affair between dh and previous boss. This has been quite upsetting for him and he hasn't discussed it with me until recently. The final straw came last week when after working about 100 hours in 10 days including several 24 hour stints he took the next day off, but because it was a week day she called him up and told him he couldn't have the day off, that everything that he had been sorting was his fault etc etc.

He has decided that he wants to quit and frankly I don't blame him but how do I get through to him that he doesn't have that luxery? She persecuted him last year until he came down with depression and I can see it all happennig again. I got him to see a solicitor who said that he must take out a grievance against this woman before going for constructive dimissal but he hates conflict. He has got a doctors appointment on tuesday, I know that he is becoming ill again but even though he has suffered before he doesn't see it as a proper illness. He thinks if he just gets out of there he will feel better but we / he will be faced with many more problems. He is already drinking / smoking rediculous amounts, even poors a drink before he takes a call from work.

Sorry to waffle, how can I get him to see that he must go to the doctor and tell him how he feels and find out if he is becoming depressed again? How can I stop him resigning on monday? How can I get him to take out this grievance?

I want him to go to his meeting and then go to the doctor and get signed off so that he can have some breathing space and hand back his bloody mobile. Please someone give me some advice.

Sorry runragged only just got back to PC. If you are still thinking of the doctor why not go with your DH. He might appreciate the suggestion coming from you and it might help while at the doctors, when we are not well someone else who is close can often add force to our position/say things that help a lot not just "patient" but also the doctor. I think a lot of peoples thoughts on here are so good hope it all starts getting better and maybe you can start seeing the wood for the trees or it it the trees for the wood?! Best wishes.

Pie thanks a lot, I will show it to him.

Well in the end he had his meeting and didn't crumble, she told him she didn't trust his decision making, that it was his job to work 24 hours if necessary and basically that a home life was an optional extra(!) He told her he couldn't take her attitude any more and that he had a doctors appointment (even showed her that his trousers don't fit anymore through stress - she said she wasn't interested), she told him that if he went off sick she would take it as a sign that he can't do his job and will discipline him and that he should consider his position (ie resign). He told her he could do his job just couldn't work with her attitude. That's it in a nutshell there was lots more.

I phoned the doctor and told him that dh was a reluctant witness and he might have to probe.

Luckily by the evening I was starting to get through to dh and he got fired up about a grievance, I added to what we had already written and he handed it in this morning. Now we just wait.

Gini, they have said that they will deal with his grievance when he goes back. Can we ask them to deal with it now on the grounds that what is in the letter is making him ill and until it is dealt with he can't begin to see the light at the end of the tunnel? I can't see him ever going back but would like hhim fit soon so he can face the job market and we can get past this. Thanks in advance

Oh and its really lovely to have all your messages / advice. Feel a bit fragile myself (only just come off the tablets so great timing!) but just have to hold it together until we go to corwall in a few weeks and hope it's over by then.

runragged -you must be so proud he didn't crumble. when's the doctors appointment?? I hope HR/personnel will really do omething about the situation now.

He had dr app today and is signed off for two weeks. His HR dept contains one person and she isn't great, in fact her tongue is stuck to general managres as and thats who the problem is with. I was really chuffed with him though as I kept telling him that I didn't care what happened as long as he didn't let them away with it.

54321 why did dr only give him 2 weeks, it just means we have to go through all this palava again in getting him to the doctor. He reckons he'll take the 2 weeks and then work his notice but we are supposed to be going to cornwall next thursday "for a break" which would do him the world of good but now he says he'll go back to work and face the music. It's so frustrating.

What do you think would happen if he said he would consider leaving voluntarily if they offered him redundancy. They might see that as a way out, particularly if he fudges the fact that he's only signed off for two weeks. I too have been bullied at work, but made it clear I wasn't going to resign and eventually got a payoff. He can't carry on like this forever, poor man. The holiday would almost certainly help him, can't you persuade him to go with you?

He did mention to his regional manager who has been summoned that if they made him an offer he would take it. This is why I would really like to know if we can force them to go ahead with the grievance while he's off sick because although he says they wont make an offer, they might rather than think they'll have to pay months of sick pay anyway. That way it would be over for everyone and we could start to plan, the uncertainty is as bad as the situation for me.

Runragged - does his company have an occupational health doctor they refer to? I recently was off work due to stress caused by my manager. Whilst I was off sick I had meetings set up with my manager, the overall manager, HR person and my union representative. Had I not had a satisfactory outcome, I would have progressed a grievance. Your dh has more bargaining power when he is off sick. He should stay off sick and progress a grievance if he does not have access to occupational health. That way the employer is on a sticky wicket if they have not demonstrated that they have done everything possible to get him back to work. Is he in a union? Phone ACAS for advice - they are very helpful and you will get your local office number in the phonebook.

Frankly, the cow is on very thin ice, having said that if he takes sick leave she will discipline him. Make sure he is making notes of when, where and what she says to him.

runragged, what a fantastic conversation your dh had! couldn't have gone any better, especially the bit where she said he had to work 24 hrs a day and everything else was an optional extra. any employment tribunal would love that. has the GM never heard of the working time directive?!

it is VERY important that he keeps contemporaneous notes of every conversation he has with anyone in any position of authority (his GM, the HR person etc). detailed notes with quotes. it sounds fairly clear that he could claim constructive dismissal if he wanted to.
he should then go and talk to his union if he has one and a solicitor if he doesn't to work out exactly what he wants to do and how to do it - eg go on immediate sick leave, pursue the grievance, claim constructive dismissal and bring them before a tribunal for unfair/wrongful, claim unfair/wrongful if they sack him for going on sick leave etc. Should do that asap so you are both fully informed and so you have a file with the union or solicitor that backs up what you are saying.

best of luck, the GM sounds like an idiot and I'm sure you'll have pleasure in not letting them get away with it.
Bon courage as they say in france!

it real does depend what is in his company handbook with regards to grievance handling - the norm is ussually a response within 10 days, this usually involves an investigatory meeting (they should be asking your H is he has any witnesses etc that they can interview etc). I will get some notes and e-mail them to you.... They are on stivky ground if he has been signed off with stress caused by work and they know it...

Gini, handbook says 5 days but they are postponing it because he is off sick, we'd rather they went ahead.

Anyway dh wants to resign again, tried to explain that he still needs to come to an arrangement regards his reference so he will still have to face up to some sort of contact. Have now been accused of trying to ruin his life and telling him what to do all the time and not giving a s* about what he wants etc. I think I'll keep my head down and wait for it to pass and then see whats left after the devastation.

On the up side he does have an interview on tuesday, but it's a whole day thing with presentations etc so he is convinced he is going to humiliate himself. His self esteem is at an all time low although this looks like a great job. Hope I can work on his self esteem without getting head bitten off too often!

if he does decide to resign I would get him to put something in there that implies he is resigning because of the situation, and feels pushed in to it. Also say that this decision is based on the fact that they will not process his grievance and this inturn is making him ill. incidently - have they written to him with regards to it?

Runragged - he should be signed off for longer - anyone with depression needs longer than two weeks to sort it out. He does not ever have to go into that workplace again. He should get them to progress the grievence while he is off sick. I'm sure they will be desperate to sort this out before he sues them for constructive dismissal. It must be incredibly hard for you to be living with this, has your husband been offered counselling or medication by the doctor?

I have to say I agree, he should be signed off for longer. Can you persuade your dh to go to see his GP again?

Runragged, I'm really sorry that you and your dh are going through this - his employers sound appalling!. I haven't read all of this thread, so apologies if I am repeating stuff that you have already considered.

Your dh's employers appear to have no qualms about being in breach of health and safety legislation (working Time Regulations 1998) which specify maximum number of weekly working hours as well as daily and weekly rest breaks, so I'm not sure that reasoning with them will be very fruitful but it may be worth a go.

I think you mentioned the possibility of trying to get some money rather than just resigning. One of the ways his employers may suggest is by reaching a 'compromise agreement' which would then be a legally binding agreement which could prevent him making any future claims in an employmrnt tribunal. If your dh is not very confrontrational, this may not make a difference (ie he is unlikely to make a tribunal claim anyway). To make such an agreement binding, your dh will be required to seek independent legal advise on the terms of the agreement.

On the claiming benefits side, I think he can still receive state benefits if he is persuing a tribunal claim against the employer - but it is worth checking this.

I hope your dh gets the job on Tuesday - and manages to convince his current employers to reach a financial settlement before he leaves!

Finally, I really hoope that you are doing okay as this must be a really stressful time for you too.

Sorry, just read a bit more of what has already been said and would like to add my agreement to princesspeahead's advice on keeping notes of who said what, when where etc.

BTW, Princesspeahead, if you are who I think you are, then I'm glad that you changed your nickname - although it could more flattering, but its a step in the right direction . If I have the wrong person, then apologies all round!

I've just caught up with this thead. Do
hope your poor dh starts to feel better soon, runragged.

Agree that he should fight this - it seems he has such a strong case.

Is there a third party you could involve? Speaking from my own experience, if you feel you have someone working with you, not just a person you phone for 10 minutes of advice, but someone who takes on your case and is there to see it through, it could make lots of difference to you both. Suddenly you and your dh are not carrying all the burden. In my case I was supported by a charity/advice/resource/training centre set up for all people in my industry. Knowing someone was there for me was such a relief and practical help when making decisions. Does your husband's industry have any such organisation? If you are unsure, could you check this with colleges that run courses in your husband's field?

Agree as well with others that a trade union rep would be a good support to you.

Has your hysband missed much sleep working those ridiculous hours and feeling so stressed? lack of sleep IME let along anything else can make you feel so depressed and unable to make decisions, so I hope he can get rest now - something to sort out with the doctor - that in itself might make things easier.

You are being so supportive. I hope you both get away to cornwall and your husband's presentatoin on Tuesday goes well.

Thanks everyone. Well, it's over. Dh's other boss who is the regional manager for his field was called down to go through all of dh's work effectively to find a reason to sack him! But this guy is actually okay (although a bit spinless) and was the one who interviewed DH for the job originally so he also considered it to be a bit of a slight that "witch from hell" didn't like dh.

It turned out much to her disgust I expect that dh had actually been doing his job really well and that if she had wanted to sack him she wouldn't have been able to - hahh!!

DH rang him to say that he didn't see anyway out of the situation and that he was never going to get better if he didn't resign because even if he went back she would get rid off him anyway, this guy said, "No, hold on, I'll get you as much money as I can," and came back with 3 months salary! AND a great reference.

So this is the best possible result, dh would never have been able to go through the tribunal, he can concentrate on getting "better" although having it sorted has given him an instant boost(!), and it gives some breathing space to look for another job. Also knowing that he was doing his job well will help him too.

He has decided that he is not cut out for management although this is total rubbish it's just the effect this woman has had on him and he used to really enjoy it, but we could manage if he wants to take a step back for a while. (I'm working now which was supposed to give us extra money but can use it for any shortfall)

I am so thankful it's over, by Thursday I was only just holding it together. Also we are going down to my parents on Thursday and dh couldn't come because he didn't want to ask witch features for time off so now he can and we can have a family holiday with no stress.

AND he has his interview on Tuesday although we are not holding out much hope as it's an all day thing but "you never know"!!!

Big sigh of relief

I'm so glad things have worked out for both you runragged. Enjoy the time with your DH and I'll be keeping my fingers crossed for him on Tuesday.

Good result runragged. It also means actually that your dh would have had good grounds for a constructive dismissal case and the regional manger knew that! He may well have got greater compensation had he sat it out but his mental health would have been in tatters. He has to remember that so that he does not lose confidence in his ability. Good luck for Tueaday. Enjoy your break away

so so happy for you both - have a great interview and enjoy that really well earned holiday (and let us all kno whow he gest on).