We are separating, but I feel SO guilty

[geekdad]

After almost a year of counselling my DW and I have decided to separate. Through counselling we have realised the problems that we have carried throughout our 18 year marriage. When we met as young 20-somethings, we had problems with sex , none of them physiological, I should add (I was a virgin, she had had several partners, and was pretty experienced). Anyway, we went out together for about six months and then she dumped me for someone more exciting in the sack. I hung around, and failed to move on, being her "friend" for several months until one day we got sort of intimate and starting going out again. The sex thing wasn't resolved, but somehow this ended up with us being married within the year. Our early marriage was fairly unhappy, and my DW was pretty depressed because my job took us abroad where she had few friends. We even talked about divorce after a couple of years, but I think we were both two scared. Things settled down a bit after our DS was born, but our love-life never clicked. A few years later our DD was born, and we had a stable, happy-enough life together.

Five years ago my DW started an affair (kind of inevitable that one of us would), which gave her what she was missing in the marriage, and which I found out about last year. We tried to work out what to do. DW didn't want to leave, but we discussed it, and there were a couple of times when it looked like that might happen. We got into counselling, and were able to work out why we were in this mess, but not really how to overcome it. How do you get intimate with someone when it has NEVER worked emotionally? Basically, we realised that we married way too young amd for the wrong reasons.

We ended up thinking that we would stay together for the children, but take partners to satisfy what we weren't getting from the relationship. DW started seeing the OM, and I eventually met someone else. That (as you might predict) was when things went from bad to worse. I became more involved with my "girlfriend" and DW realised that she didn't want a relationship with the OM after all. I ended my affair in an attempt to see what we could salvage of the marriage, only to find that I had essentially fallen for this OW, and became depressed that it was over.

I realised that I didn't feel as strongly for my DW as I thought, and we ended up discussing and deciding upon separating for real. That's kind of where we are. We told the children, and are in the process of readying the family house for selling in the new year. Neither of us can afford to move out without doing this. Needless to say, we feel incredibly guilty that we are doing this to our children. On the whole we both continue to get on as friends (as we have throughout the marriage), but we can't face a life of celibacy and lack of romance. I know we've already done this for 18 years (though for four of them DW was in love with the OM), but the counselling has revealed that the relationship was built on sand. Going back to where we were is NOT an option, but I don't think we can build a new realtionship under these circumstances. Hence our decision to separate. We both feel so down, and that we have failed our children. Friends have said that we deserve a chance of a happy relationship, and that staying together for the children in a loveless marriage is not acceptable, but this is certainly going to affect their lives irreparably, and I can't help feeling that separating is selfish.

You sound like a decent enough guy. most of the men who've dumped me haven't given it a second thought.

so, cut yourself some slack.

There is life after being in a mumsy/dadsy couple and there are so many benefits and freedoms. (not that i do anything with my freedom, but i just feel free, dykwim?)

The first year just feels like adjustment. adjusting to anything can be hard, even if it's for the better.

My children are happier now than when we were together. I knwo it's slightly different as their dad was horrible, but it is not only possible to bring up happy children in a single parent family, but there is no reason why it should be harder! a lot of the shit that gets thrown at single parents are issues relating to poverty. my own children's dad has become a better dad now, because when he sees them he has to do everything,not just be there in the background. i think the children like him more now.

the guilt won't weigh as heavily on your shoulders for the rest of your children's childhoods! it won't honestly.

Sorry to hear how bad you and your wife feel about this. How old are the kids? Late teens?

ps, you sound very aware. my relationship was also built on sand as you say.

also, it's very fair of you to not just rush to blame your wife, adn say that it was 'inevitable one of us would'. You sound very fair, and very forgiving, and your children will be absolutely fine. Their parents are decent, intelligent, loving and reasonable people.

it's the war and the slanging matches and the bad atmospheres that do the damage.

When me and ds' father were falling apart, I saw a therapist for a couple of sessions, and one thing stuck with me...she said "it doesn't have to be a tragedy" And that really really helped.

It took a bit of time, but we are completely fine now. Not living together really helps you move on also.

DS is fine also! He has two houses, two parents who love him. We don't do any of the acrimonious stuff so he has never been exposed to discord in that way. Yes, he would probably like us to be together, but as it is it is a pretty good compromise.

Give it time. And be kind to each other. You will be surprised just how normal your new way of living becomes.

If you are separating just because your love life is uninspiring then I'm sorry to say that does sound a bit selfish actually.
You loved your wife enough to have children together, you say you still get on, I think you should be trying to rediscover that spark which drew you together in the first place not chucking it all away forever.

You have tried, worked at it and it isn't going to work. Don't fee guilty - your kids will be fine - it is by no means the end of the world. Children only really suffer in these situations when the adults fail to put them first - its clear that neither you nor your wife will do that.

Time to be happy in your new reality!

um, jemart, I think the OP made it quite clear there was never any spark. Kinda hard to rustle is out of nowhere.

When I got pregnant with ds, my relationship with his father was on the way out. We stuck it out for a few years, but finally had to admit defeat. It was painful, but necessary.

best thing we ever did as parents for our child. Happy boy, happy homes, happy parents.

Thanks for your replies, everyone. I'm not sure what I'm wanting from posting my story. I think my concern is that while they are broadly supportive of our decision, none of our friends really understands the situation, so I was wondering what other people's perspectives might be, particularly those of you who have been in this situation.

jemart, we're not separating beacause our love life is uninspiring. I actually thought, when I found out about the affair, that that was all we would have to address. It's deeper than that and goes back to the reason we got married in the first place. My DW says that she has felt pretty unloved for a long time (possibly the whole of the marriage), and that the OM gave her the love she felt she never got from me. She feels differently about him now, though, so it wasn't a question of leaving me for him. The "spark" maybe was never actually there. It sounds crazy that we could get married under those circumstances, but my neediness and relative inexperience in relationships, coupled with my DW's family history sort of created the right circumstances.

SleightiesChick, the DCs are 14 and 11.

I asked about the ages because I haven't experienced this myself, but my DH's parents separated when he and his brother were in their late teens. Their marriage had on the surface been succesful for many years but had been rocky at the roots (?mixing metaphors there) for ages. Theirs was very acrimonious and I think they imagined the DC were old enough to cope with that but they were actually quite hurt by the need to 'tke sides' etc. So I'm sure many people with experience will have much better advice, but mine would be that if you and your DW are able to be amicable and friendly and co-operative, that counts for a lot, and if you can reassure them you still love them and each other but that you are better off leading independent lives, they are of an age to understand that provided they feel secure in your love for them. Obvious I'm sure, but it sounds as though you can work out even though no longer a couple.

Sorry, no similar experience or advice. Just wanted to offer support as you are clearly a caring father in turmoil.

If you both love them (DCs) and are caring and respectful to each other, I am SURE your DCs will be fine.

You are teaching them to not settle for second best and to tackle difficult choices head on. That lesson may save them from making the same mistakes so you are not only saving yourself and wife from feeling shortchanged and unappreciated, but possibly your children too in their future relationships.

[as an aside, your DW sounds needy --perhaps living abroad didn't help- so cut yourself slack on the sex issue, the OW obviously wasn't complaining. Best of luck finding love again]

I don't think you should feel guilty based on what you have posted.

I am married and have 2 DC, younger than yours. I am deeply unhappy and I assume my DH is as well - I don't actually know as he won't talk to me and spends as much time outside the home as he can. Anyway, I wouldn't admit it to anyone in real life because I am rather ashamed about it all. We have no plans to get divorced yet as our children are very young and we need eachother in a practical sense at the moment. Some of your friends might be similar and may understand more than you think, they might just be unwilling to admit it. I think if I admitted it, everything would start to unravel.

Like people have said, cut yourself some slack. You have tried for a very long time to make this work and it does not seem possible. Your children are old enough to understand and critically, you are still friends with your DW so there will presumably be no difficulty when you have to make joint decisions or visits etc. You will probably be a better parent once you are released from the unhappy marriage. Certainly, I should be interacting more with my poor little DD, but I feel pretty depressed about the state of my marriage so I am on MN instead!

You both sound caring, sensible and mature, and I think your children will be fine. I think that the example parents set of how to conduct relationships (with each other and with other people) is also vitally important for children, and you and your wife, even as you separate, will be setting an example of good communication, tolerance and responsibility, while also looking forward. If either or both of you then end up in happier, better relationships that will also be an important model for the children. And whenever they have questions about what happened you can both say quite honestly that you gave it your very best shot, and spent a great deal of time and energy trying to make it work. As leavinglondon says, you are teaching them to face hard decisions in a careful and responsible way.

Was the separation a joint decision or did one of you make up their mind to leave?
My gut reaction is still to say "Don't do it!" but then I don't really know the full circumstances. Eighteen years is a long time to be together, surely some of that was good times?

You have to stop feeling guilty as that will make the whole thing more stressful and give the children the idea you have done something wrong.

You have tried to make this work and while some people can be happily married without any sex, you are not happy like that. Nothing wrong with that.

I wish you luck.

Oldwoman HUGS....

Totally can see why you don't want to rock the boat but perhaps a little gentle talking, a little meeting in the middle could improve things for you and him? Hope you are okay, you sound sad.

Hug DD, she will love you forever!

I think its inevitable that you feel guilty about the kids but agree that it sounds from what you´ve said that its the right decision for you both and will make you both happier in the long run. Its not ALL about the kids. How would they feel when they are older and realise you have essentially led an unhappy/incomplete life ´for them´. As an adult child I would hate to have that responsibility for my parents on my shoulders.

It will be hard for them but it is your life too. And agree that it is the acrimony and discord that upsets kids of divorce more than anything. If you can maintain honesty and generosity of spirit to each other throughout this split it will hopefully work out fine. Your kids are preteens/teens so its a tumultuous time for them but your parents splitting is hard at any age and I would hope that with time they would see it was for the best.

Good luck.

Oldwoman I'm really sorry to read about your problem.

I agree with LL, you should try and broach the subject with him. Perhaps he doesn't feel the same as you. There are parallels with how my DW felt in our marriage. We thought that we were very good at talking to one another, but clearly so much was not communicated.

If your DH is not willing to talk, perhaps you could arrange to see a counsellor on your own. Your GP should be able to refer you to one on the NHS, especially if your situation is making you depressed, or you could contact Relate.

Please, please don't be ashamed. We didn't tell anyone about our problems, but most people have been very supportive even after they'd heard ALL the details that I posted here.

jemart, yes that's my gut reaction to. Has been since I found out about the affair. I made all sorts of compromises at the beginning - even saying that she could carry on seeing OM. I thought anything was preferable to splitting up. I regret those decisions now, but not the process of reconcilliation that we went through after the dust had settled. My DW fell deeply in love with the OM, and it was thus unsuprising that she had difficulty in deciding what to do.

The decision was mutual; I realised how I felt, or rather didn't feel, and she realised that she had spent too long feeling unloved to go back to where we were. It's all VERY sad.

There were good times. Lots of them. But they were almost always connected with being with the children. She once said that she felt we had NEVER been lovers.

No MaggieAnFiaRua, my relationship is just fine thanks - this is geekdads OP not mine.

I do find it quite shocking that nobody else is encouraging him to save his marriage though.

mumsnet have bizarrely deleted my comment. staying with somebody when neither party wants it is a recipe for misery jemart, and I do wonder why you would suggest that op do that. it was a reasonable question and i am puzzled that mumsnet deleted it.

did you report my comment?! omg you must have. you protest too much me thinks. it's all clear now.

Parents who live a lie about their own relationship can really damage their children's view of what a relationship is actually worth. It happened to me. I was 15 when my parents separated; it should have happened before.

Separation is absolutely the right option for you. You don't love each other in a couple-sense, and trying to pretend that you do or force yourselves into a romantic relationship will end up making you hate one another. Right now you still have respect and fondness for each other, which is a great foundation for building a good co-parent relationship on. It will be rocky with the DC at the start (children don't much like change) but it will settle down. Best of luck.

What I would say is that there is no good time for parents to split

early teenage, ime, possibly one of the very worst times

I am not saying don't do it. I wouldn't presume - it's clearly a very complex situation that you are both giving profound thought to.

But my experience leads me to want to remind you that even fairly amicable divorce can be a devastation for some kids. I think sometimes it's tempting for people to think "Ex and I are amicable therefore there will be no long term effect on the kids" I would just want to say be very watchful and open minded about how they are. Just because you may do everything 'right' doesn't mean your kids will automatically be fine. Allow them to have problems with it is what I think I'm saying.

I do wish you the very best of luck, hope all goes well for you all.