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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

If you suspected an adult had aspergers or similar, would you tell them?

74 replies

MadreInglese · 17/09/2009 13:18

I have thought for a while that a friend of mine has some sort of autistic spectrum condition, albeit a high-functioning one.

She is repeatedly alienating people with her increasingly inappropriate reactions to things. In the past the biggest dilemma for our group of friends was what to wear on Saturday night or whether the hot guy from the gym was going to call, and her outbursts and tantrums did not cause such a stir back then. Nowadays we're dealing with and trying to support each other (sadly ) through divorces, bereavements, miscarriages and other serious issues, and her behaviour is akin to that of a spoilt demanding two year old.

She displays no empathy or natural response to anything, will never admit she is wrong or apologise, never acts appropriately in new situations (in fact often calling up others to ask what would be the right thing to say/do), and most of her behaviour is robotic and seems rehearsed or overthought. She will fly off the handle and say horrible things, and awful things have been said back to her by many, but the following day she is back to normal and it's all forgotten - while everyone else is left reeling in shock. She can never take any kind of criticism or blame although she's happy to dish it out, and she never ever seems to think of consequences before she acts. She finds it very difficult to share anything, from food to friends.

On the other hand she displays lots of intelligence with heaps of talent for other non-social skills, including a freakily accurate memory and an incredible ability to learn new subjects very quickly. She is eager to help with anything (mainly I think for brownie points ) and can be fun and nice company on occasion (usually in shallow situations like during a chat about shopping), but it all seems overshadowed by the bad points.

Sadly, because of her behaviour and the upset she has caused, the majority of our mutual friends are shying away from her without any explanation, they are just totally sick of her behaviour and want to concentrate their energies on less draining friendships, writing her off as a spoilt brat.

I've thought for a long time that she may be autistic to some level, I'm not an expert on this kind of thing but it makes sense from what I do know. Would a diagnosis help her if this were the case? I really feel that she has little control over her natural instincts and I think it's sad that she may be left with no-one when it might not be her fault, IYSWIM.

Or maybe she is just a spoilt brat and I'm just a soft sap

OP posts:
BethNoire · 17/09/2009 15:56

Why wouldnt it be fair?

f ds1 says something to hurt people he has to know

'When you said X you amde me feel sadand that I dont necessarily want to be with you' is a fairly sensible covo- AS people still need to learn how to behave. And whilst they /wemihgt not make it to NT land (do I want to? I quite like me, am a good person) we can met people half way

MadreInglese · 17/09/2009 15:56

Why is it obvious? I don't see austism as an insult, I know it's a condition and tbh I think it is the only logical explanation for her behaviour.

But I think she will probably be insulted if I mention it to her.

OP posts:
Twinsmommy · 17/09/2009 16:02

Star signs can say a lot about a person. They could be just traits of her character and nothing to do with any possible medical condition.

OrangeFish · 17/09/2009 16:11

Don't tell her, there's no point. You will only hurt her and there is nothing she could do about it.

If you are finding the relationship too much, just distance yourself but don't hurt her in the process. If you are right, it's not her fault.

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 16:18

I was glad a friend didn't tell me - I found out for myself, and when I told her, she said "well I did sort of know, but didn't like to say".

wheniwishuponastar · 17/09/2009 16:28

i don't think there is anything wrong in saying it. it might explain things, and make her not feel so bad.

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 16:34

Actually when I realised I had it, I felt bloody awful. Which is why its not best coming from you.

wheniwishuponastar · 17/09/2009 16:36

but what if she never finds out? who else will tell her?

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 16:42

I think she has to realise it for herself. What you need is some way of getting her to find out more about it.

You might find this thread interesting, as a number of ladies on here have DHs with AS, as well as a number of us ladies on here having it too.

Unfortunately it looks like quite a few comments have been deleted, probably due to the DM fiasco...

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 16:42

Perhaps a book on the subject? If she's a good friend, ask her to read one of Tony Attwood's books on the subject...

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 16:45

Found the bit I wanted from that thread (quoting myself):

I've just finished reading a really good book - Asperger Syndrome and Employment, by Sarah Hendrickx. She's written other books too. Its got a LOT of case by case information I can really relate to. Where people with AS talk about how they deal with things. And it shows the different reactions Aspies give in a given situation.

The bit I thought I could mention (well there's lots, but this in particular) is to do with what to do when you suspect someone has AS. I'll paraphrase it to suit (as its concerning a work situation):
"Imagine how you would feel if you were told you had autism and this is the first you'd heard about it. The likelihood is that you would be shocked, upset, angry and defensive. The approach you use is whether the person is aware they have difficulties and what kind of relationship you have with them.

  1. Can you deal with the issues without mentioning your suspicions of AS?
  2. What is your motivation for telling them?
  3. Will it help the person to know? If so, in what ways?
  4. What will happen if the person rejects your suggestions or is very offended?"

It then goes on to say if it needs to be raised, raise it in an informal, relaxed way. Casually mention that the person exhibits some aspects of AS and give them some information on AS characteristics that they can read at their leisure. Its important that the person knows why it is being raised and what issues need addressing. If they have AS, they might not be able to process this huge piece of information immediately, and will be unlikely to agree with it. They may not appreciate it but may be intrigued to find out more at a later date. It is important to reassure the person that the relationship will not be jeopardised by this discovery and there are no negative implications to having AS.

Agree to discuss in 2-3 weeks time but don't bring up the subject in the meantime If the person dismisses it, the subject should be dropped. Only if there is a H&S issue should it be pursued - this is a very delicate and sensitive matter (this last paragraph is obviously more relevant for a work situation, rather than family, but i've put it in for completeness).

ottersRus · 17/09/2009 16:48

Don't tell her she has Aspergers.

Aspergers and autism are complex areas.

Psychiatrists and psychologists study for years to be able to diagnose such conditions.

If you think she needs some help, and if you really are the 'friend' that you say you are, then by all means help her to get some help or understanding about her behaviour, but don't tell her she has a complex developmental disorder when you have no real understanding of this yourself.

BonsoirAnna · 17/09/2009 16:56

DP has a friend who I suspect has some kind of ASD. He is very high functioning indeed but his emotional connection with others is non-existent. He can be pretty offensive hile actually conforming to very strict social rules on correct behaviour, à la française.

One day he came to spend the night at our house. I spent some time making up his room, making it comfortable, putting toiletries in his bathroom and a bottle of mineral water and a glass by his bed. When he saw it he laughed at me. Very odd.

Anyway, he and his wife are in couples counselling and have been for a while. He learns new "rules" of behaviour but he isn't learning to empathise. I just don't think it's possible.

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 17:00

Aspie women are generally better at learning to empathise than men.

BonsoirAnna, do your friends know that Relate do an Asperger support line?

BonsoirAnna · 17/09/2009 17:03

They aren't in England - they are French, but live in another country... The wife is fairly desperate.

wheniwishuponastar · 17/09/2009 17:05

i think it would be a shame if this girl's friends don't want to be around her any more because of the way she behaves, but might be a lot more understanding if they knew she had autism of some type.

surely that is much more hurtful and damaging than finding out the name of a condition that you have? if she has this condition then surely the last thing she needs is to be socially isolated.

MaryBS · 17/09/2009 18:13

The thing is, people know I have the condition and I am STILL socially isolated. And its not because I am always saying things to upset people, but I don't know how to make friends. Even though people know that it is socially isolating, it takes a very special person to make allowances for that AND a lot of effort on my part not to screw up.

MadreInglese · 17/09/2009 18:19

Thankyou for all your comments, you have definitely given me lots of info and different viewpoints there

I think I'm going to have to give it some serious thought before I make a decision on what (if anything) I will do

OP posts:
MaggieBeauLeo · 17/09/2009 18:23

I said it to my x and he was outraged.

Maybe you could get her to google left-brained, visual learner... that kind of thing, see where she goes from there. There are some quizzes online. I did one, trying to answer the questions as thought I were my x, and it came out as a definite yes. It's hard to answer as though you're somebody else though. You have to know them very well.

My AS x had developed narcissist personallity disorder as a result (I believe) of feeling so disconnected and misunderstood and unsupported throughout school.

My son is also on the spectrum but I have none of the same worries about him. I know and understand his little differences and I will be making the appropriate allowances and I'll have different expectations. Also, my son's having ABA and learing support that my x never had.

Just wanted to say that, in case anybody thought that I had a really negative view of anybody with Asperger syndrome. Or that I linked it automatically with NPD. Not so at all. BUT, I think that 'normal' life and socialising and social nuances are hard for somebody who has grown up and reached adulthood totally undiagnosed and unsupported.

BethNoire · 17/09/2009 18:45

online test that ahs a good rep

BethNoire · 17/09/2009 18:49

I get 39 on that BTW

colette · 17/09/2009 19:05

I got 13

BethNoire · 17/09/2009 19:15

16 is about average apparently

Scorps · 17/09/2009 19:20

i got 37.

BethNoire · 17/09/2009 19:25

Scorps- remmeber that, erm, recent trauma might make you feel less sociable. If it's a score you think you;d have got a year ago then consider it and either dismiss or consider- but knowing what I do about your last few months- trauma can make us isolate ourselves IYSWIM

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