My mum...

[bellavita]

gosh, don't know where to start really. Here goes..

I think she is controlling, no actually I know she is controlling. When I speak to her on the phone or if she is here or I am at her house I feel like I am 5 not 43.

As a child I used to feel suffocated. I would always have to wear my big coat to school or wear woolly tights instead of socks because she said she knew best. I know most of the time us mums do know best, but I was not allowed to make my own choices. I could not go on school trips away for a few days because she thought something was going to happen to me and same for my brother. She was always the frumpy mum waiting at the school gates and since having my brother and me has always been overweight. She cannot understand why I try and watch my weight and why I wear jeans or thongs, or paint my nails/toenails or want to look nice.

My brother and I were at my parents last weekend and he brought up the subject of us always having to be in early when we lived at home. Yes, I know it was because there was a gap between her going out to work and my Dad coming in from work and she wanted to know where we were, but she jumped on me and I had said nothing.

My poor father - I really feel sorry for him. They are both retired, he drives, she doesn't. He wants to go to the local village over 60's club, she doesn't want to and because of this said he can't. He likes to go fishing, but she moans at this.

She never has a good word to say about anyone or anything.

My parents have been here this weekend, all was going well until yesterday afternoon. She said something which I happened to disagree with and said - she jumped down my throat and said something to the effect of she is the parent and I am the child so what she says goes. Luckily, DH stepped in and said that I was allowed to have my own opinion but she was not happy and you could cut the atmosphere with a knife and it was the same this morning before they left. She had a knee operation last year and has to have help to get in and out of the bath, so Dad went up to help her and came back downstairs. We heard her shout for him, so he went upstairs straight away, was gone for quite a while. When he came down he was visibly upset. I asked what she wanted and he said he is not sure, but went absolutely mad at him for not hearing her the first time and that she could have drowned and then in her rage at him smacked him across the face . He said to me he knows he did wrong, but he hit her back as he is at the end of his tether with her agression.

The last time she came she said something which I disagreed with - it was something really trivial but she had a hissy fit with me and said I had no right to disagree.

It is getting to the point where I don't want to speak to her on the phone or even look at her.

I have to phone her twice a week, always on a Tuesday and Saturday. God forbid if I have not phoned by lunchtime on a Tuesday - she starts phoning me wondering what I am doing or where I am, sometimes I have gone out but I think she thinks I need to phone her first and say I am going out will be back and whatever time and will ring her back then!

Sorry if I am rambling, but after last night with her hitting my lovely dad, I am just so angry.

I don't know quite what to say bellavita. It sounds like she has always been pandered to and is used to getting her own way. Your Dad should have stood up to her long ago - it is probably too late now. He should have a serious talk with her though although i would imagine that now she will make herself out to be the victim.

I am a confrontational type so would have it out with her but I understand that if you are not it is hard.

Bloody hell. So your mother is the boss then and no one can cross her or even disagree with what she says. Your poor dad. Did she apologise for hitting him? Did you say anything to her about not accepting violence in your house?

Thanks for replying.

I am not sure if she has hit him before (he has never said, although I think he might be too embarrassed to say).

What I do know though, is that if she is doing something say like making a cake or cooking and it is not going right, she will have a major meltdown and begin to throw things - this has happened for along time.

She once through a cup at my brother in such a rage because she was upset with him (he was maybe about 13 at the time). Another time she thew a whole plate of fish and chips because he had upset her.

I know I will have to ignore her strops when they are directed at me, but I feel so downtrodden like I don't matter.

Buda, yes, my Dad should have stood up to her a long time ago, but he won't because many many years ago, he had an affair and he left for a short while. He came back on her terms and she has never ever forgiven or forgot about it. So, I think he puts up with it, because she will turn round to him and say it is his fault for her being like this. My dad is one of the nicest people and yes he made a mistake but that was a very very long time ago.

Holy - the "boss" just about sums her up. From what I can gather she did not apologise and I did not say anything to her because it would have caused a lot more upset.

I can empathise with you bellavita and bet that your mum was as controlled in her youth as you, if not more so. Fear makes people control - particularly fear of not being good enough or loved (i.e if you do what I want then you must love me) it's crippling for those on the receiving end but the only thing I can say to you is to flip the roles and imagine she is your child, terrified she's not good enough and that her tantrums and controlling behaviours are the only ways she can reassure herself that she is important (all subconsciously). Have you tried asking her advice on things (you don't have to act on it) to make her feel more important? I'm not a psychologist but have experience in the relationship you describe and know it can be so painful to be on the receiveing end. I wish you luck and love - and I'm sure that the reason you & your dad are in the firing line is purely because she loves you more than anything and is so fearful of losing you.. much love xxx

Your Dad sounds completely under her thumb as are you still. He did not stand up to his wife nor did he protect you enough as children from her controlling. Therefore I do not let him completely off the hook either; he may well have acted as the bystander for his own self preservation and want of a quiet life.

As for your own self I would read "If you had controlling parents" written by Dr Dan Neuharth. Its a good starting point.

Having emotional and physical distance are key here.

Her behaviour is unacceptable. If this was a person in your social circle, you'd stop seeing them but I know it is difficult when this person is your mother.

I know you want to help your dad and you can by offering to support him if he needs it. Apart from that he has to deal with it, it is his marriage.

As for yourself, I don't know. I cut my own mother out of my life and I have no relationship with her. I get on with my dad but it is different because they are divorced. No one can really tell you what to do but if I were you I'd be giving her the last final warning. Anymore instances of this behaviour and our relationship is over.

Not saying that is what YOU should do but you have to have some self preservation and you have to put yourself first. Do you think you would be able to approach and talk to her, or is she always right?

Yes iris she was very much controlled, not by her mum but by her dad and I know to this day she really resents it. Especially now as her and my dad do all the running around for him (she has 2 other brothers who live very close by) who do nothing whatsoever. She is getting more bitter by the day.

iris - your post is lovely and has just made me cry.

Holy, she is always right, I would hate to think of the consequences of what might happen.

Attila - when my brother and I were children, my dad was always for the quiet life.

oh honey I'm sorry if I upset you - understanding is the hardest thing of all. I wish you all the luck in the world. Have you tried counselling?

Such behaviour is very much learnt behaviour (I see your Mum learnt her controlling behaviour from her Dad) and controlling behaviours are abusive also.

You are not responsible for how your Mum behaves now; you did not make her this way. She resented her own self being controlled but she still likes to control others around her (probably out of deeply set anxiety).

The way to help your own self is to keep your distance both emotional and physical. Do not phone her on Tuesday and bar her phone number. That may sound very harsh but its a way forward for you. These people do not change readily if at all.

I think that "Toxic Parents" also has a chapter in it on controlling parents - you may want to read that as well.

Your Dad was and remains the bystander in that dysfunctional relationship between he and his wife. people from such dysfunctional families often play out set roles (my own FIL is a bystander). Present day his family unit are affected as well by his wife's overbearing need to control everyone around her. That is why I do not let him off the hook either; he could and should have done more to protect you when you were children.

Do read one or both of the books I recommended. They are a good starting point to help you find a way forward through this. Counselling is also helpful, as perhaps would be posting on the "Stately Homes Part 5" thread.

I agree that she won't change.

How you deal with it is your call though. If you want to keep a relationship with her, it must be on the basis that this is the way that she is. It's a no win situ. If you stop calling, she'll say "oh you never call, you don't care about me" and if you do call, it will never be enough.

Just out of interest, I was wondering if she belittles and badmouths your dad to you?

irs - no, I haven't tried counselling, tbh, I wouldn't know where to start. It was the niceness of your post that made me cry - in a good way

Attila, have just looked on Amazon at the books and will order them. She is a very anxious person, a very nervous passenger, has everyone's worries on her shoulders, comfort eats and has before taken anti-depressants.

Even if both of my parents are sat in the living room and I come into the kitchen to do something, my dad might come and get a drink, 2 mins later mum follows and demands to know what he is doing and what he is talking to me about and tells him to go back in to the living room then she stays in the kitchen with me to make sure he isn't going to come back in.

Holy, yes she does belittle and badmouth him to me.

FWIW DH thinks my dad needs to grow a backbone and stand up to her and also that I speak out more.

I kinda thought you'd say that.

I agree with your DH but if you do speak up more, be prepared for a not very peaceful life - it will open cans of worms, but you already know that anyway.

Bellavita - glad it wasn't a bad thing then you're not going to change her behaviour - or your reaction to it, overnight, especially as these are such ingrained reactions/responses. I really would recommend a counsellor (family? through NHS website/Dr) to ease you through the subtle changes you can make over time to give her reassurance and make your lives less stressful - cutting her out is just going to cause untold anxiety all round. Keep thinking of her as a child

Holy

Thank you lovely mners for your input and support.

I have just googled counselling services in my area and we do have them so I will look into this.

Tbh, I wasn't sure if I was making something out of nothing but it seems from your replies that I am not.

It is funny you know, because I suppose from someone taking a quick peak in to my family life when I was at home, they would think, gosh, lovely hardworking parents, lovely house, nice furnishings, nice clothes etc etc, but it ain't all it is cracked up to be!

peek not peak, although it felt like I had climbed the blardy 3 peaks yesterday!!

Bella - reading your posts it sounds like not only is she a bully but she sounds really insecure too. What would happen if you told her that you WILL NOT stand for this behavious and the next time she does it, you will retaliate by NOT phoning on a tuesday? (or not phoning for a week? Or whatever) Sometimes you can only stand up to a bully by giving them an ultimatum. Then stand by it! That way you get out of phoning twice a week (a controlling mechanism) and she gets a knock back onto her arse.

tis a very padded arse captainmummy! Joking aside, she would go into a rage or hysterical meltdown. She would not be able to see though she has behaved in such a way. She would think I was over reacting.

most definately not something out of nothing honey!- we all have our cans of worms. good luck

I just think that sometimes people act this way to their nearest and 'dearest' just because they can - because there is no chance of you heading out the door, as most sane people would.

If you threaten to do just that, would she back down? Yes I can see that she would go into meltdown and that would be scary (as it would be if you were a child) but what have you got to lose? And what has she got to lose? (much more) You are not a child anymore, and she should not have that hold over you. You are an adult now, and can treat her as the child when she acts like a tantrumming toddler.

Honestly captainmummy? I don't know what she would do.