PIL - how do we respond to this email

[pickupthismess]

SORRY - LONG ONE

At the start of this year we fell out with PIL. It was a long long time in coming. Since then 'we' have only had one contact (when DH rang them on his birthday) otherwise absolutely nothing.

It has really been bothering DH however he also finds it great not to have any hassle from them anymore.

DH got a blunt email yesterday from his dad saying in summary ; "we have waited in vain for you to ring us but you obviously can't be bothered. We have presents for the children and we want to send them but we expect they will be thrown back in our face" and that's it!

Given DH was the last one to make contact, I think they have got something of a cheek. In addition, they have shown NO interest in our children EVER. They have three other grandkids and they favour them massively (embarrassingly so). Oh and their parting shot to me was 'we have never liked you and it'd suit us if we didn't see you again'.

Tonight we have to write a response. My knee jerk reaction??? - tell them to off but I am conscious that if we do this the children lose their aged grandparents once and for all as they will be too proud and spiteful to ever offer an olive branch.

Can anyone think of a suitable way to respond without backing down? We still feel very upset by the way they verbally bullied and attacked us in front of the children and it upset them terribly. I know there's always two sides to a story but we honestly did nothing to provoke it and we didn't lose our cool. When reason failed we just picked up the boys and walked out.

We don't really want them in our lives but it is not like us to get involved in feuding families.

HELP!!!

my gran was like this. my dad said it was unacceptable behaviour, and he would cut contact until she could be civil.

To demonstrate that he continued to love her and miss her - and that he was upset by her behaviour = he'd call her once a week and ask "are you still angry?" . If she was (i.e. for the next three years )he would say goodbye and hang up. It did lead to a sort of unstable truce.... only flares up a couple of times a year, and civil at other times,

Me and her get on fine now - we've had some nice times - shecan;t get enough of my dcs, It's def. an improvement - we started with her disowning me and 'banning' my `dads family from seeing baby-me. Apparently my great gran used to set up covert meeting in the park with my mum, so she could at least see me,

The thing that I most have a problem with is the fact that PILs openly state that they don't want a relationship with you, but do want a relationship with your children. Personally, I think this is atrocious and nobody would be having a relationship with my children and not me under these circumstances.

I would reply to the email very firmly and factually.

Would say,

Thanks for the presents you have bought the children and feel free to post them to us. I am sure the children will be thrilled. We would not throw them back in your faces and are unsure why you think such a strange thing.

We would like to mend our family's relationship with you, but this must include all four of us (ie OP, DH and 2DCs?). We would like our children to have a relationship with you, but it is not realistic or acceptable to exclude [OP] from this relationship.

crokky you're right.

I don't actually know what they want. MIL is nuts (acknowledged by all) and FIL is a horrid, bullying man who has never had a kind word to say about DH and just brings him down. They can't stand me possibly because I'm the first one to stand up to them.

They treat DH dreadfully. They bought his sibling a house in its entirety and told DH. Isn't that mean when they've NEVER given him a penny or any moral support? So what do they want from our kids? I suspect what they'd like is DH and DCs to go visit without me. But THAT is never going to happen.

let them get on with it and surround yourself with people who add something to your life.

i wouldn't engage with anything nonconstructive that they send your way.

I have a very similar situation but the e-mail was only directed at me (DH is a saint in MILs eyes).
So I ignored it completely even though I really wanted to attack back. As my friend said "she can't wage war on someone who doesn't respond".
Now, nearly 3 years later she has started to make contact with DH again (he hadn't spoken to her either as it was that bad), and has conveniently forgotten sending an e-mail .
Not replying was the best thing I ever did as she wanted me to fight back, which would give her a real reason for her nastiness, and if I rolled over to keep the peace she would have felt like she had power over me. The silence completely disempowered (sp) her.

Your PILS are probably checking their e-mail every 5 minutes to see the response!

Totally agree with qwertyqueen. They will be absolutely choking for a response from you, and they would so love it if your response is horrible so that they can then bitch to everyone about how nasty you are.

I wouldn't give them the satisfaction, tempting tho it is.

Say -

"We are sorry you feel this way and we are disappointed that you'd think we would be so petty. We welcome kind and loving gestures and we would love for you to arrange handing over of the presents to our children. We wish we could have a better relationship between our family (you DH & children are a unit) and you."

That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. Say "we" not "i'm". Very important.
Balls in their court. THey need to suck it up and contact you.

They will also use your children as an emotional weapon to beat the two of you with. They have already affected one generation (i.e their son/your husband) by their behaviours; toxic behaviour cuts across generations.

Any e-mail response by yourselves will be counterproductive and may even be used against you. Your ILs are not worth your time; if these people were at all open to reason I would have said respond. But they are not - and likely never will be. Toxic people do not play by the "normal" rules of family interaction and behaviour.

Their original e-mail is full of emotional blackmail. Note as well that they blame their son for their lack of action.

Follow crokky's post...and pay attention to AttilaTheMeerkat's line of thinking...
imho, the script the PIL are on will involve presents for the innocent dear children to buy them. Gifts are so tricky. And manipulation is clearly involved here. They have set this up:

1. degrade the child for years which transforms into degrading the adult children for ego fodder (or whatever!).
2. adult children show some backbone and won't tolerate it (as any normal person wouldn't tolerate it from family/co-worker/'friend').
3. up the ante...involve the innocent dear children - warm and fuzzy and slightly out of focus lens- with the "grandparent relationship" card. If the grandparents are serious about a 'relationship' they will take the dc to the park and spend ZERO money on them. Money talks...who would deny children the perks of expensive gifts? The adult children will feel guilty if they say no, the adult children will be degraded door mats (potentially for eternity) if they say yes. If the gifts are begun, then expectations of the children are built up to the PIL's advantage. The children will follow the materialistic trail and turn against their (adult children) parents. Much to the delight of the PIL.

My initial reaction to the email was:
do not respond. It is nothing more than bait. Leave it.

Answer this: If they hate you so much, why on earth would they want anything to do with your children?

The above is one possibiliby. Nip it in the bud, don't let the gifts start.

Take care, and best wishes for Happy Holidays [hwink]!

Am in similar position and believe you need to take the emotion out of it all. They are getting older and hurt has been caused on both sides. Forget the origin of it all ...lifes too short.

Am with watchtheworld and VVVQV .. take the moral high ground but don't take any prisoners. Behave politely and be prepared to be hurt. But you'll know that when they are no longer around you did your best. It may be really important to you in later life.

HOw about.....am so pleased that you e-mailed us, what time would you like us for lunch on Christmas day? insert evil icon here!!!!!

"They are getting older and hurt has been caused on both sides. Forget the origin of it all ...lifes too short".

Advancing age is no excuse either; besides which pickupthemess's ILs have acted awfully for many years now.

The only hurt I have seen on this thread is the hurt caused by their inlaws in their own warped minds. I don;t think for one minute that pickupthemess and her H have at all contributed to this state of affairs.

You can do the above in "normal" healthy functioning family relationships but the one that pickupthemess writes about with regards to her ILs is clearly not normal or emotionally healthily functioning. Therefore that approach won't work.

Think as well these two have been emotionally hurt far enough; it is telling to me that her husband finds it nice not to have to deal with their hassle any more.

And just what on earth did the PILs hope to attain by sending such an email loaded with such emotive, unpleasant language? "waited in vain," "obviously can't be bothered," "thrown back in our face"
I don't hold with the notion that some relationship with family is better than none at all. Unless they're remotely normal. But this lot are toxic, so all ordinary princliples of operation don't apply.
I would leave it for a few days and then take the moral high ground along the lines of what VVV suggested.

did she send back a reply?

ime your children will not be missing anything by not having these people as grandparents.
my parents had a terrible relationship with my dads parents, which they tried to keep civil for the sake of my brother and i when we were young, however they eventually felt that having my grandparents in and out of our lives was worse than us just not seeing them at all (we were quite young and could never understand why my db would get birthday card and i wouldnt, that kind of thing).
we stopped seeing my grandparents for good when i was about 7, and i didnt see them again until i bumped into them in a shop when i was about 25. i can honestly say neither my brother or i missed them or felt that we had missed out by not having contact with them. we were lucky because we also had a wonderful nan that made up for the terrible one.
These people sound really awful and you really shouldnt put up with it just so that they will be in your dc's lives, infact going on my experience you and your kids are just better off without them.

nancy I am really interested to hear that.

LBAMKS on my God you are evil

Update: wWe haven't replied .......yet.

But DH says we write reply tomorrow. He is a really kind and lovely person and doesn't get into arguments (even with me ) so this whole situation is alien to him. Truth be told, his parents are getting a bit rickety and I think he's worried one might peg it before he resolves this.

However, for those that said we're better off without them - you are completely right. Even DH admits he's so much happier not having anything to do with them but feels upset too.

This is not a sane situation. We have had some 20 years of trauma, bullying, passive agressive behaviour and outright nastiness. When I had the children I just suddenly gained the strength to assert myself.

I REALLY don't want them in our lives. However, that's what I want and I would hate it later if the children blamed us for cutting them off from their GPs. They have my parents and they are very close and love them to bits. WIth regards PIL, this morning DS1 said "I love nanny and grandad X zero". We haven't been discussing this with them but he remembers. On the one hand I felt 'good' but then I thought how sad for them. I had kind but crap GPs and I really wanted better for mine!

Seriously though Dh needs to take the lead on this one, he's right you never know what's round the corner so be true to yourself. Godd luck!

pickupthismess,

I would still be extremely wary of replying at all as any response by yourselves will be twisted to suit their own ends and you will end up being the bad guys yet again. It may well backfire on you as well because you may receive some snotty reply in response.

Take heed of what your DS1 said for his words are telling. They will NOT blame you for cutting them off. You can protect them and yourselves from bullying ILs. Yes you can feel sad for you and that is okay but look at the wider issues here. Your ILs have already upset one generation (i.e their son/your H) and will quite happily take it out on a second i.e your children. They will buy your children expensive gifts and buy their love that way. (Re-read Toomanystuffedbears response). These people as well have never shown any interest in your children either.

People who thankfully do not come from families where toxic parents are present do not understand what these types of people are fully capable of. Draw a line now in the sand for all your sakes. Do not reply to their bait and loaded e-mail.

I would suggest your H reads "Toxic Parents" written by Susan Forward.

Oh this one rings loud and clear for me.
My PILs are extremely difficult.
DH say they were very overbearing parents, convinced that he would go to the dogs.
Since I married him there have been endless periods when they have stopped speaking to us.

• when we moved in together MIL burnt many of his belongings
• when we got engaged they didn't even send a card becasue we didn't tell them before my parents

-when my father was dying because DH shouted at them that they needed to help more -on the day we scattered my fathers ashes because MIL still felt 'bitter' about DH shouting at her when DH was dying.

I could go on and on.
Each time i admit it's me that instigates the reunion but reading some of the posts on here maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm just facilitating Dh being hurt again and again and maybe I'm setting up DCs.

Should also say we got one of these emails.
We hadn't spoken to PILs since the summer when MIL started a ludicrous argument on the day we scattered my father's ashes.
The DCs birthday went by with no call ( although they did send cards and money). DHs birthday weny by with nothing.
Then xmas loomed and we got the email.
I smoothed the whole thng over and normal service resumed.
However, only a month ago MIL stopped speaking to us because we couldn't attend PILs birthday meal ( DH was abroad with work).
Again I've smoothed it over.
Maybe I should just stop doing this.

Hi there, not read through all the responses yet, but just thought I'd share my thoughts with you quickly. I think that this is a good example of a time when you have to really think hard about what you want to teach your children about family relationships. I don't know what your values are and where you stand on this, but that should guide your response (or lack of) to them. If you want your children to see you as being good negotiators, forgiving, understanding, calm, etc etc, then behave in the way that best shows them that. I know they may be too young to understand now, but family disagreements such as these will be talked about in the future, so your response is important. Our children need to learn that not everyone behaves in an ideal way, but IMO, that doesn't mean you have to stoop to their level. It is easy to feel angry when someone treats you badly, and much harder to respond to them with love, but I truly think this is what you should try to do. It will stop this whole thing spiralling out of control.

Also, I personally don't think this is the time to explain your position in much detail, as it is only likely to put their backs up and make them more defensive - not very helpful! Their defenses need to be weakened, not strengthened, and then you are more likely to be able to explain your viewpoint and have them listen.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do (or have done!), I really hope things resolve. Families are awkward, it takes a lot of strength to sort problems like this out.

Tonight MIL called! DH didn't take it and we let it run to voicemail.

All MIL said was "X, it's your mother here" click.

DH now resolved to deal with by email tomorrow. I am still totally in two minds about receiving the presents and money etc etc. DH says take it, the DCs will be happy but I feel why accept when we are not even on talking terms and when they have such bitter dislike of us? Aren't we then total hypocrites? Are we saying everything is back to normal?

Also, does that mean they expect us to send them things? I'm damned if I'm going to buy them a present or send a card. One of the things they said during their last rant was I was 'heartless and cruel". This centred round the fact that I didn't send them cards (yep I know, that's how trivial it is). Not their son, only me. Even though for 20 yrs I've bought them, stuck them in front of him, made him sign and then posted them. Since I had kids I thought, if he wants to send them he will. Which of course he didn't! They held this against me in a vitriolic attack on my 'behaviour'.

If they send gifts for the children, accept them and make sure the children send a lovely 'thank you for the gifts' letter afterwards, perhaps with some pictures in.

With regards to this situation, it's tricky.

No matter how badly they behave towards you they are still your dh's parents and he will still love them. I would probably respond to the email. But be nice and don't answer their nasty comments. Be overly nice and tell them about the children. If you keep it focussed on them, what can they hit you with?

Something along the lines of:

Sorry we haven't heard from you sooner, hope you're both well. We're all getting ready for Christmas and the children are very excited about it all. Then mention how the children are doing.

Hope you both have a great Christmas and the season finds you well.

Perhaps we'll hear from you soon, pickupthismess and family.

Keep it short and sweet. Don't react to their nastiness.

I would also send a Christmas card, no presents but a card just so they don't feel forgotten about.

I'll admit, what your pil have said and done to you is very hurtful and cruel. But if they've contacted you I would make the effort to reply, for dh's sake and for your childrens.

That's just me though.

I think what Catcha says makes a lot of sense. Your PIL are obviously very angry people, so horrible for you to have to deal with their immature and spiteful behaviour. But I don't think ignoring them is the answer. I really don't. You can't just cast your family aside if they don't behave in the way you want them to. Most families have communication problems somewhere in the mix, it's a fact of life, and it's a shame when it's the people in the family who should be full of such pride in seeing the generations continuing that are causes such problems. Let them keep their bitterness, don't react angrily, it is what they want. Just send back love, if you can, it will keep you feeling calm and will confuse the hell out of them.

Why am I not at all surprised she has left a terse message on your answering machine?.

Your DH is happy not to have them in his life now so you should follow that example.

I can only repeat what I wrote earlier:-

I would still be extremely wary of replying at all as any response by yourselves will be twisted to suit their own ends and you will end up being the bad guys yet again. It may well backfire on you as well because you may receive some snotty reply in response.

Take heed of what your DS1 said for his words are telling. They will NOT blame you for cutting them off. You can protect them and yourselves from bullying ILs. Yes you can feel sad for you and that is okay but look at the wider issues here. Your ILs have already upset one generation (i.e their son/your H) and will quite happily take it out on a second i.e your children. WHy do you think they want to hand their gifts over, this is manipulation on their part; to buy their love with expensive things. This is not real love (Re-read Toomanystuffedbears response). These people as well have never shown any interest in your children either so why now?.

People who thankfully do not come from families where toxic parents are present do not understand what these types of people are fully capable of. Draw a line now in the sand for all your sakes. Do not reply to their bait and loaded e-mail.

This is not purely about casting them aside because they are not behaving in the ways you want them to. Toxic people cannot and will not play by the rules governing normal healthy family relations and behaviour. Your whole family unit have been on the receiving end of their toxic behaviours for years. Time to draw a line in the sand.