dh has decided he is "bored" with our little family - help please..

[sickofthisrain]

I feel like I've got myself in such a mess. Basically DH has always been one of those very "male" types, a high achiever, doesn't really show emotions type. I've always been a secure, fairly independent person and for 10 years it's worked fine. Now we have 2 DS', aged just 3 and 1, and over the last year it's emerged that DS1 has some mild special needs which have absorbed me physically and emotionally for the past few months. DS2 is gorgeous but a demanding baby.

We moved hundreds of miles (now 6 hours from my family) when DS1 was tiny, for DH's dream job, he then found a new dream job which means he is away from home 3 nights per week near where we used to live. It was supposed to be a temporary thing but now seems to be permanent. When he does come home he is constantly emailing or on work phone calls, even at the weekends. He works virtually every evening too, and has taken only 2 weeks of leave all year so far. It's as if he feels himself too important to help with household bits, and he's too exhausted from the work to play properly with the children.

I've now reached the stage where although I can cope alone with the ds', it's bloody hard work and I don't want to have to. I've broached it with DH and he just says his work makes him happy, and at one point, "it would be much easier if I were single," which supposedly was intended as a joke.

He is now making lots of little comments such as "it'll be fine, whatever happens" and if I mention any future event, he'll say, again in a supposed joking way, "if we're still together then" I've never felt insecure in our relationship before, but this, combined with my anxiety over DS1 is making me so miserable. I can't get him to talk about it further, he just says he doesn't know how he feels, or hasn't had chance to think about it. He did say the other night that he felt that we had become stale and "bored" with each other, and he felt our family life was "mundane". The thing is, I can't think that we see each other enough to be bored with one another, and there is no avoiding the demands of 2 such young children..

I really don't know what to do. I think we could make it work, as we do get on so well normally, but only if he is willing to try. I feel too vulnerable to cope without him, as his limited input at this stage is better than none but can't stay in this state of limbo. I feel physically sick, teary and shaky today. Can anyone help?

Do you smell a rat at all? I hesitate to type it but my first thought was affair, and I'm not a very suspicious type. If totally out of line, I'm sorry.

No idea on the 2 at pre-school, I only have 1 18 month old, he is at nursery all day four days a week, not ideal but needs must. I know some child minders do wrap around care like that, your local council would have a list of registered childminders.

It may be worth floating with DH (on one of Alexa's suggested adults' evenings together) - "I am worried about how much pressure you are under financially and thinking about going back to work, perhaps part time. I have looked into child minders and it would work like this ......" and see what he says. He may be appalled but it would at least make him think there is more to you than his domestic manager.

Men like your DH (who sounds a little bit like my DH tbh in personality if not in behaviour) tend to like strategies and solutions rather than whining (even if whining is what they deserve).

Sorry the first thinkg I thought when I read the OP was also "is he having an ffair" there does seem to be some characteristic behaviour

Yes, Gmama is right, forgot to say that. After a glass or two you should let him talk. Bring up the iussue. Absolutely not in an accusatory way, just let him speak & don't interrupt, no matter what. Listen & learn. Very good move!

BTW, totally agree with georgimama, they are simple creatures and direct solutions and structure works best!

As for childcare, my business partner has wrap around childminding care after school so it is possible, just ask any local mums or groups for recommendations.

Agree with postings here on work, that's not to say that staying at home isn't the right option for many mums but fro me, working and having that sense of ownership over my future makes me much more content.

I have to add that I am absolutely on your behalf and obviously your (D)H should not be treating you like this, but you already know that.

I think he is being incredibly unkind with the 'if we are still together' comments. This must be torturous for you.

Personally, I'd kick his self-pitying arse out the door - but I have become cynical. You will not want to do that whilst there is one scrap of hope that your DC's might grow up in a 'whole' family, I imagine, and quite rightly.

But what he is doing is a form of abuse. He is making you feel very vulnerable. In turn, you will seek security by trying to get assurance from him, and by trying to do things that please him. I imagine he could derive great power and pleasure from this, which would make him a bit of a sadist, tbh.

Hope I'm not being too harsh. I wish you every happiness, and hope this will resolve itself well. But resolve it soon, or you will lose your whole identity in trying to keep him as your DH ((()))

You sound just like describing my h a couple of years ago.
High achiever, workaholic, dream job......

Me stuck at home little help - supporting him.
My h did have an affair - i was getting paranoid and actually so many of our friends were more shocked than i was .
He had also been to see a solicitor so he knew his rights... this all that the same time as moving us as a family!!

The alam bells for me would be 'if we are still together' - is this what he said on the wedding day??????

My advice would be that whatever he is up to even if it is work it is not good for your needs at the moment and that is not a partnership marriage. Even if he is saying the working is for you and the family as we all know that is not the point.

You need to take some control of this and although it may feel negative i would say get some legal advice and if he ever said 'if we are still together again' i would point out how much better your life could be - he would have to take care of his children regulary and believe me he would either have to actually do that or make sure you had enough money to finace care while you re-built your life ect.
Seeing a solicitor was one of the best things i have ever done - i am no longer scared of divorce - and knowing what it would mean for him too gave me a bit of power back.
Of course you dont want your marriage to fail but it does take 2 to make it work.

Counselling is also good and i would reccomend it but again you both need to be willing to do it. We have done counselling and we are slowly re-building our relationship again.
One of the things remember from it all is that the marriage is only working while it is good for you both. That is not to say that there will be some downs but if the balance is not restored i will no longer tolerate to be in a bad marriage for the sake of it.

We both now feel like that and do take time for each other.
It is hard with children and there are a hundred excuses stopping you taking time out for yourselves but it is essential for a healthy marriage imo.

Good luck - i feel you have overlooked your needs and allowed your h to ignore you too, but you are not alone it is very common and can be resolved.
Take care and let us know how it goes.

I think your dh is behaving badly - but "normally". Not wanting to generalise but I do think that lots of men react badly to the arrival of children (especially those who have a tendency to be selfish!) and sometimes they bury themselves in work as a way of coping - and tbh (and generalising again) men (more than women) do tend to measure their success by what they achieve in their career rather than family life...

I think women instinctively put their children first and men resent them doing that -when I went on maternity leave with my first child my boss wrote "don't neglect your husband entirely!" on my leaving card and he had previously spoken about how he felt way down the pecking order of his wife's affections (below the cat iirc!)

So what to do - I would make more of an effort to find a babysitter. Ask around for recommendations - maybe someone has an au pair or nanny who would be interested in extra work - sometimes staff at nurseries babysit too. I do think it is important to try to spend some time together as a couple. If that's not feasible, order a takeaway or get some nice M&S meals and have a quiet dinner together after the children have gone to bed.

And I agree with Alexa that you should get as much help around the house, etc. Maybe even sent yoor dcs to a nursery/childminder for a few hours a week so you get a break? If your dh makes any comments tell him you are simply paying someone else to do his share of the housework/childcare!

sickofthisrain-he sounds very selfish. They are his children too and you are their mother.
You deserve more respect

He has had three yrs to get used to it Grapefruit moon!
It is mental cruelty to hint that yiu are thining of leaving
He has robbed her of her self esteem

I think some men never get used to it!

So that you are going through this SOTR - I know exactly how you feel. I have had months of my h saying things like your h has - "I dont love you anymore" - "I dont want to be your husband anymore" - It is so incredibly hurtful. He also had an affair which has been the biggest slap in the face of all.

My h has done exactly as your has - completely thrown himself into his work, working away for whole weeks at a time and when he comes home, shutting himself in his study to make phone calls/deal with e-mails.

I do think that they start to see themselves as separate to the family unit. Bringing up kids is hard, especially if you have kids with problems, no matter how small!

I really think your h needs to talk to someone. He really needs to see things from your perspective. But, as you say, he doesn't want to talk to anyone so it seems like he isn't prepared to do anything to make things better.

I definitely think time on your own will be helpful, as long as you are both prepared to talk and see the other persons point of view.

I really hope things work out for you

thanks so much for your kindness everyone, today is the lowest I've ever felt in 10 years of being together. I've always felt really happy and secure in our relationship so to suddenly feel otherwise is incredibly unsettling.

There is no way I'm putting up with any more of the little comments though and he will be told if I hear another. I do hear the people who say affair, but he's always been brutally honest and I can't see him sneaking around, I think he would rather end it if that were the case. Am alert to it though just in case.

And you're all right about the precise orders thing. He is so practical and logical and a "come to me with answers, not problems" kind of bloke. He finds it hard to keep talking about the same thing, which is why i've driven him insane with my concerns over ds1. Need to come up with a strategy.

He's just phoned and we've agreed on a week away so i'll get that booked. Plus I'll book a few evening meals out and ask around for babysitting.

I do have a cleaner who comes in for 2 hours a week, dh is absolutely fine about that. He has also offered to pay for a nanny or childminder if that's what I want. It probably would help, but I'd rather he just be at home more tbh. It feels like he's just outsourcing his children.

I know dh's mum is dying to have a word with him as she thinks he is trying to "have his cake and eat it" but I don't want others involved in such a private matter and she knows only the bare minimum of details such as the days he works away from home! She does often suggest that I go off for a weekend and leave him to it, maybe I should. Even so, coping for a weekend is not the same as coping for 50 weeks of the year straight.

No it isn't the same, but it would give him a tiny taste of what you do, and it would be good for him and the kids - it isn't right that all he is to them is provider/bill payer, it isn't good for him or them. Baby steps is usually the way with men as well as children, my DH was scared to do very much with DS when he was a newborn, he genuinely wanted to, but I think he was scared he would break him!

Take him up on the childminder/nanny offer, just to dip your toe back into work or education - did you say DS1 is 3? He should (or will soon) qualify for early years funding (if you're not already claiming it), I think it's about 12 hours a week, this is not means tested.

At least he is responsive to the suggestion of time together alone, if things were very bad he probably wouldn't be keen.

My DH always panics when he doesn't have a solution - he sees it as part of his job to have answers and expects me to have them too vis a vis DS - and it may be that your DH is more worried about DS2's special needs than he is letting on.

He is also being a bit of a twunt, though, and needs to make this up to you. Good luck.

Thanks georgimama, he is a good man, and having just read greyday's post I'm counting my blessings a little. Even if we split I really don't think he would try and shaft me or the dc's. I know he also worries about DS1's problems, but he was similar himself as a child and then it all magically righted itself aged 5 - whether it will with DS1 remains to be seen.

I don't think he realises quite how upset I am about what he considers throwaway comments, he can be a little tactless and prone to saying things without thinking how the recipient might take them. This is especially true when he's uncomfortable, and we don't normally have the deep discussions we've had in the past fortnight (this is maybe part of the problem.) I'm also usually laidback about things, so I think he's now realising he's really overstepped a mark.

I think getting back to work will help me feel more like an equal, I enjoyed being at work and need stimulation other than from 2 demanding dc's who don't yet talk back to me much. And yes, ds1's at preschool 15hrs a weel now, so I just have DS2 in the mornings. He's still so little, and at the stage where he's changing every day so I don't want to be away from him for long, but maybe a couple of mornings a week would mean I could do part time work.

sorry no advice as such and have not read whole thing so sorry if i repeat other posters

you sound just LOVELY and i so agree that your dp is really taking you for granted.

maybe all he needs is to see that you are not a walkover

make a few suggestions that make him sit up and think - even if you dont really mean them - talk seriosly about moving back/working full time. echo the silly little throwaway remarks back at him and see what reaction it gets

not game playing - just a wake up call. Sometimes men ( and i think it mostly IS men) lose sight of what they have got...

its like he needs some gorgeous hunk to click his fingers infront of your dps face and say ' hey mate - look what you have got at home - if you are not careful you will lose her'

sorry excuse typos

ooh yes, Chacuna a gorgeous hunk would be nice! Not many of them where we live, more country bumpkins and i'm not in a state to attract any hunks at the moment either! DH does need a kick up the arse though, and maybe to realise I did once attract some male attention other than him (back in the dim and distant past when I worked in an office full of young blokes, wore a size 10 and kept up with my roots..)

I think your approach is right, I'm not going to be scared to play him at his own game. He needs me as much as I need him, and the power balance has suddenly got seriously out of kilter with me being a SAHM and him being a big cheese.

Hopefully this will all resolve without too much game playing, we've never been into that, but a wake up call is definitely what's needed.

i must say i purposefully read some of mine and your posts to my dp who suffers sometimes with the same....

I am just as bright - quick wittted and probably more ( ) attractive than him but due to having a great job and being 'admired' and 'complimented' daily his ego sometimes makes the power balance 'out of kilter' as you so appropriately put it..

I often do 'pull back' a bit and let him know i am still ME!

Some might call it game - playing but i don't - I just need to feel respected and sadly that sometimes takes a bit more work!

SOTR: your last post got me worried, too. Why is your self-esteem so low? I'm sure you're still the same woman you were before. Having said that: men are visual animals and please, please don't take this the wrong way, but I think if you feel you've gone down in style and standards and turned into a slummy mummy, please re-wind the clock and invest in a new haircut, high-lights and a nice mani/pedi. It sounds like you're financially comfortable, so get that nanny in!! 2h a week for a cleaner? When DH and I lived in London we had someone come in 12-15h a week for our mews house. Don't be worried about someone else being there and doing all the boring stuff. You'll have a lot more time for your dc and if you get them to go to childcare you can book in a private trainer and a make-over to help you get back into your comfort zone. Honestly, don't get dragged down by feeling unattractive and be sad about it. You have the money to do something about it, so do it. I was told that once you have kids it's all about organization and finding the right people to support you if your family isn't close. Your dc will be just as healthy and cared for if you get a helper in. A happy mummy makes for happy kids!

A happy mummy also makes a confident woman = a happy husband.

I think you are currently being walked over by your husband. I called him selfish before, but you are too nice!! Get searching for a cleaner and ironing lady. Get a make-over before the hols and buy some new outfits. If possible, get a personal trainer or a DVD for at home.

These are just tips for yourself, to make you feel like the girl you were.

I think everyone has given you good tips for how to bring your DH back into the fold. It might not be a bad idea to see a solicitor. Just for a 2h consultation. AS HW (who's very wise) said: it gave her the confidence to know where she stood.

Next time your DH brings up talk of how he wants to be single he should be reminded of: Kids are for life, not just for Xmas. And: if you guys were to split, he'd have to pick them up at times the court stipulates, he has to financially support all of you, you'll stay in the house to allow the kids to continue their lives as before, he'll cause a rift in the family, he'll lose friends and any comfort zone he's ever had. He'll have to start completely anew again. Emotionally & financially. If that's what he wants, be my guest...

Thinking of you.

sotr - again i can see so many similarites to my previous situation.
my h was happy to get childcare/household help ect - it is almost the norm in high power careers anyway.
But like you say until he understands exactly what it is like to be at home 24/7 he will never really be able to help. After all who will organise the babysitters/where you go out to?
You even say you are going to book the holiday.

My h is a changed man - because in his words he came so close to losing everything he had ever worked for and even activly sort to destroy it.

You need to somehow show him exactly what he has got and just how precious it is.

Good luck and please try and make him leave his phone/blackberry at home when you are away (my h is a senior manager and he now tells his staff to leave theirs at home when going away - and he leaves his now.

I do sound like I've let myself go a bit don't I? I haven't especially, but I piled on a whopping 4 stone with DS2 and still feel about a stone heavier than I'd like to be, and haven't felt the energy recently to tackle it. I need to as I have a wardrobe full of gorgeous clothes which don't quite fit. This wallowing really isn't me though, and it's stopping today. Got hair booked for next week, and nails for Sat.

Have also this morning sorted out a childminder to take DS2 2 mornings a week which will free me up either to work part-time or to go to the gym or even occasionally go off shopping for the morning. Will ask cleaner if she can fit in another couple of hours a week, don't do much ironing if I can help it tbh, am lousy at it but can manage 5 shirts a week for DH without too much bother. Can always get the cleaner to take these too.

Need to find a willing babysitter now so I can go to the pilates and aerobics evening classes some of my friends go to. Will tackle that today.

And that bloody blackberry, I could cheerfully chuck it down a drain. In fairness, DH did turn his off for 2 weeks while on holiday, and is quite good at switching off once officially "off", it's just getting him to book the time off that's the problem.

I think I just need to start being a lot more assertive, and accept that I'm not being spoiled or failing somehow in needing or wanting some help. My family are too far away to help, and DH's tend to be fairweather grandparents, so it is logical that we need to find and pay for this help with the children/house elsewhere instead.

soory no time to read abck through but in reply to your OP, i suggest he HAS had quite a lot of time thinking about how he feels, that HE has become bored and should never second guess or try to get himself out of it by saying he feels you have both become bored!..and to say things like 'if we're still together then'!!??...you need to get you self esteem back, tell him you work bloody ahrd with you dc and either he pulls his finger out as a father and husband or YOU will be having second thoughts about everything!..good luck chick

I think you need time for yourself more than'couple time'. The trouble is with scheduling couple time is it can too easily slide into the man thinking 'oh this is the night of the week when she lets me have sex with her if I pretend I'm listening for an hour or so' and the woman feeling that sex is expected so is just another chore.