Is this mental abuse?

[rubymum123]

I have been with my husband for about 12 years and have been married for 8. We have two children ages 4 and 9. We live in the north of Italy ( my husband is Italian).

Before my children were born we lived with my in laws and I always felt like I came second after my mother in law. Despite the lack of affection from my husband I just kept thinking that things will get better when we have our own place. We got our own place but things didn?t really change that much and my mother in law was still very controlling as she only lived a couple of minutes away.

My mother in law passed away 3 years ago.

My husband main focus now are the children and displays a total disinterest in me. He sleeps on the sofa every evening and says that he doesn?t mean to but he falls asleep in front of the tv. I have tried waking him but he just falls back to sleep. This has be going on for about 2 years.

When I say to him that he only wants to be with me because I am the mother of his children ( hoping that he will tell me that he loves me as his companion too) he tells me that the mother of his children is not a position to be undermined.

I work part time and when ever I need any extra for shopping etc I have to ask him and account for what its for.

A couple of times when I have spent too much he will react by smashing things up. After when he has calmed down I tell him how this upsets me and the children he says that I am over reacting and that he didn?t hurt us. However he doesn?t realise how intimidating it is.

I have said to him that I want to start looking for another job that gives me more hours but he says that he does not want that.

Yesterday whilst parking the car I scratched the side light against the wall ? when he got home from work he commented on it and said that we would get it fixed and said no more about it. He then went upstairs to get changed. After about 15 minutes he comes down and says that he has spoken to our daughter ( aged 9) and starts ranting and raving that I lied to him about being on the phone at the time. ( I know this was foolish parking whilst on the phone but I didn?t lie about it I just left that detail out so to not to anger him). Anyway he started making all these smark comments about why don?t I just take the car and smash it all in tomorrow and how I don?t have to worry because I?m not the one forking the bill. Anyway this went on for about 15 minutes he just kept putting me down in front of the kids and saying how blooding great he was for putting up with me and how hard it would be for me to find another man like him. I felt like I was going mad and walked out to get some fresh air. After a while I returned and felt calmer only to hear him say ? well I hope you pull yourself together as you have some issues. He denied everything that he had said before and said that I was not a rational person and needed help. He always puts it on me that I have some kind of mental problem.

Is this a form of mental abuse?

You're going to be alright, Ruby. You need to figure out what you need to do and how to do it.

I am just thinking about this evening when he gets home. he slept in the spare bedroom last night and barely spoke to me this morning other than ask me how much i needed and threw 50 euros on the table.

I know that he will be playing the victim this evening, he always does. he makes me feel guilty so that I come round and apologise. This is what I used to do - I don't any more and so it is all just left up in the air and gradually forgotton. I will have to put up with his sulking for a few days.

I am going for a job interview tommorow and I haven't told him about it. I really hope that it works out. I am trying to put on a front that I am a confident strong woman but inside that is not how I feel at all, I feel broken.

If this job works out it might give me the strength to decide to leave him.

The job is a great first step. It's not quite so drastic as leaving, but it is in the right direction. Good for you!

So , he asked you how much money you needed and gave you ?50. Does this mean you don't have equal access to a joint bank account. If this is the case, open one now and start a security fund of your own. Do it NOW.

God! Your relationship sounds like my first marriage He played the victim too and I always had to apologise for my behaviour to stop the days of endless sulking. I often had to get round him by using sex, or I'd end up with even more shit.
Good luck with the new job. You are a strong woman Ruby. You've put up with crap for years, you must be strong. A weak woman would've crumbled before now, so just believe in yourself, you can do it.x

dont beat yourself up. i came from emotional abuse and the reason its so vile is because you start to believe that you are insane. that your are the one in the wrong and that you cant survive alone any more. its not true. its not easy but you can rebuild and for the sake fo your kids you have to!

agree with pretty fly. MY X expected my to sink when he left - 10 months on and we're swimming along just fine and dandy - and you know the best bit - not watching the clock wondering what mood he'll be in when he gets home. it's so much more relaxed now.

good lulck for your interview tomorrow.

one thing i'd agree with thou, I never had any money put aside - stupid given the situation but I never thought it would happen to me. I also thought how you did - ie look at me now single mum etc and people would think bad esp from waht oyu say about the teenage mum thing but remember he's in the wrong and you never asked for this - you're a ma

(sorry don't know what happened there)

a married lady, not someone who's purposely got PG and now gone after all they can get from the state. if you need the help go for it.

get the child benefits etc and tax credits etc all in your own account, start that fund off today. and if you can start sending little bits of clothing home so if you do decide to come back here you can if need be just grab the kids and know you have money and some clothes over here.

Yes. When did all this start to happen? Was he unlike this when you met and married him?

oh and the charm thing - classic way to control you keep you where he wants you to be. nice one minute horrid the next.

I remember the week before I split for XH sitting down really upset, and he turned it all back on me and had a go at me for an hour about what I was doing wrong?? wtf!!!

these are NOT MEN!! they are NOT.

you're stronger than you think - just believe it.

I have just spoken to him on the phone and he is acting like nothings happened and when I brought it up he asked if I have calmed down?!

Apparently, so he told me about a year ago he has alo of anger towards me .. for what I don't know as I have never done anything to cause this. I never go out in the evening, itried it a couple of times as I have an english friend who lives near by, but he ended up coming to get me at the bar we were at which was so embarassing.
He said that he didn't want me making a habit of it so I just gave in to him to keep the peace. Now it is getting ridiculous. If I take too long doing the food shopping he gets the kids to phone me very five minutes to ask where i am and I get back to a sulky husband who doesn't even help me bring in the shopping. Once again he did this in front of a friend and it's not nice. The most annoying thing is that he is so pig headed and is convinced hat he is always in the right. Sometimes I think that for the amount of respect he has for me I might as well be off sleeping with other men - obviously I am not but I feel so alone.

I have thought so may times of just getting up and leaving with the children. A few years ago I would have done but I tend to think things over alot more nowadays and think of the consequences. I don't think that going back to the uk would help as I would feel like I was punishing the children, both my children were born here although they have double citizenship, and they both go to school here and have their friends and life here. I am trying to think of a way to start a new life for us here.

My husband was not like this wen we first met, don't get me wrong he was never over affectionate and never one to compliment me but I guess I just thought that things would get better and turned a blind eye. Sounds pathetic but I wanted to prove to everyone that I could make it in this relationship. I remember when I lived with his parents I felt like leaving him a couple of times but didn't have the nerve as I felt so pressured by his mother.

It's funny how life turns out...back home in the uk as a young girl I hearing this kind of stoy would have shocked me, I would have thought how can she let him treat her like that and would have never dreamt of being in that situation myself.

It's true that you start believing that it really is you that is the problem and that you wouldn't be able to cope alone.

Nevertheless I am starting to think about building a future- as I said I live in Italy and am bilingual, i am also learing german in the hope that this will improve my prospects. Obviously my husband thinks this is a waste of time and laughs at me when he sees me with the book in my hand but I shrug it off and try and think beyond that.

I do worry about the effect that it is all having on my girls. I would hate for them to be in this situation in years to come.

Thank you all for your comments - it is nice to know there are people who care out there!

Listen here. You are fabulous. You uprooted from the uk to go and live in Italy. that is no mean feat. You are Bi-lingual - respect to you, and you are learning another language - fabulous.
You have two beautiful children and you are clearly a strong woman. You know that something is wrong here. This is not normal behaviour in a happy loving marraige so please dont think it is. You deserve to be happy and respected which is clearly not what you are getting.
I wouldnt normally advocate people leaving people but Please leave him. I dont want to think how this could end up for you. Step away now whilst you have some self respect and dignity. Please be strong for you and your children

oh we care and many of us have been there. of course he is nice at times - if he was always a monster it would be easy to leave. in my exes case i ended up feeling i was to blame for everything in his life that was wrong. and mine. and pretty much the entire world and it only took him eight months to turn me from a confident, outgoing woman to a frightened neurotic mouse. BUT i am slowly slowly coming back to life. I am lucky in that i can support myself. You still have the grief of not being with someone you love no matter what they have done but at least you dont feel scared any more. Just imagine what you want to say to your girls in fifteen years if one fo them is in your shoes. That was enough motivation for me. Start to squirrel away money, get yourself educated.look for jobs online but remove the email history and begin to formulate a plan of action. But whatever you do get out.

I would have to add get out now as well whilst you still can (before you're completely in his control). You are in an emotionally abusive relationship with a controlling man. Not really surprised either that he's acting like nothing has happened; this is what controllers do. He's also projecting; blaming everything onto you and is not taking any responsibility for his actions.

I note as well he is trying to isolate you socially. He has no right whatsoever to come and collect you!. You are an adult. This is yet another behaviour that controlling men do.

He would ideally like you in a gilded cage with no friends to help you. He wants you to become totally dependent on him (as his Mother tried to do with her son).

Your children are learning from your relationship - what are you both teaching them now?. You really do not want your daughters to learn such patterns and your daughters will not thank you for staying with their Dad if he is like this. Your husband clearly learnt controlling behaviours and relationship patterns from his late Mother who I see was herself controlling. Its not your fault that he is like this - he would have acted the same regardless of whom he married.

The signs were indeed there in the beginning - his Mother was a major influence. You probably thought that he would change and thus turned a blind eye - to your great cost now. Many controlling men also are very plausible to the outside world.

You may also want to read "Why does he do that?" written by Lundy Bancroft. It may also help you as he writes at length about controlling men. There are excerpts of it available on online too.

I'll check it out, thanks. I have to admit that I still have this feeling that is niggling at me that it is maybe all getting out of proportion and that things are not as bad as that. It's so confusing - I just have highs and lows, today is a low but once its blown over maybe it will be ok for a while... I feel pathetic thinking this way but I can't help it.

ruby - i still do that "mmm, maybe its me" , mmmm, maybe i am overreacting, mmmm, maybe i am insane, maybe i should just have tried a bit harder not to wind him up so much. maybe i should just agree with him. hes not all bad. he cant possibly be abusing me - we just row a lot. maybe if i sleep with him more he will be nicer.....

sound familiar?

Hi rubymum,

Just to say that I often feel like you.... maybe its me getting things out of proportion. It is confusing... i understand about the highs and lows.

However let me tell you what just happened to me today. I got up and DP stayed in bed tiill around 11 as he hasn't got work today, when he was up he went to the gym (hes a bodybuilder), when he got back he started doing gardening... i helped out a bit but then he had a go at me and said I'm lazy for not wanting to help.

(despite the fact i had been up since 7am looking after DD and doing housework ect ect.).

Just went to the shops and I was putting some rubbish out when he saw that i had left some lights on in DD's room . He then said to me 'why have you left these lights on...all day... would you want to pay the electricity... i fu*cking thought not'

He has now gone out for his run... again leaving me one my own with DD yet again.

I tried to stand up to him and he said 'shut up u stupid fu*cking cunt - i'm fed up with u...your a turd and i hate you'

At times like these i think get out...then he turns up the charm and makes me reaccess my opinions... Sorry , im not trying to hijack your thread but had to say that I understand what you are going through...it's hard

mmm.. yes, apart from the sleeping with him bit. We haven't had sex in about 6 months.

Dear Star Sparkle,

Sorry to hear you are going through this too. It is hard, my husband doesn't insult me like that he isn't that direct. I almost wish he was sometimes - at least I know where I stand. He will mix his words very carefully with sarcasm then he can turn it round to his advantage when he needs to. It's hard to explain but it is unbearable.

Lots of luck to you..x

I do belive that mental abuse comes in lots of different ways/types ect.

I still remember that about 4 wks after the birth of our DD and we still hadn't had sex and i didn't feel like it.. he said to me 'well...if u don't give it to me, i'll have to find someone who does'

If i heard this from a mate i would be 'Why the hell don't you leave him'

But when you are in the situation yourself it is very hard... you doubt yours4elf, you wonder if you are over reacting ect ect.

We both need to realise that our DP/DH our detremental to our mental health/enjoyment of life ect ect.

Easy said than done though , huh?!

so true...

I have a good friend here in Italy who says that I should take the kids and leave him..why do I put up with it. Only someone who is in that situation can really understand how difficult it is, especially with children. My husband also thinks that I do nothing all day ( I don't normally stay online for this amount of time, but todays an exception!) I work part time look after the house and children and have meals ready when he gets home.

just did a long reply and it went! lol. typical!

My X has/had the sarcasm of ruby but directness and hurtfulness of star - a very hard man to live with at times. men like this won't change, they'll turn everything they can back on you and make you question yourself. It wasn't until I started to tell my folks what had been happening it smacked me in the face it wasn't right and my X was abusive.

I used to think the same as you guys and did for a long time after we split - after 8 years it's hard to loose the mentality, but i used to think, if i'd tried harder, if i'd lost weight, if i wasn't so frumpy, if I didn't ask him to get up and play with DS on the weekends, if I didn't demand family time, if I didn't want to send time as a couple etc etc. you can go on driving yourself insane over it. what it boils down to thou is you constantly trying to change your behaviour to suit a man who keeps changing the rules/goal posts. it's exhausting.

I know you 2 are not ready to leave, but what i'd strongly advise you both even if you never have to use it and I hope you don't - maybe you'll be one of the lucky one's who's partners actually changes. but squirrel money where you can. remove important docs & pics etc a few clothes anything really you can without him noticing too much. (I had done this bit but not the money)

Things are crap at first yes when you leave but it does get better.

fwiw, even after we split my X still thought he could control & dictate to me what I could/couldn't do - about 3 months ago I stood up to him and he's not tried it since. he was very very very good at turning things back on me, very good at it - they call that manipulation I believe?? or at least that's how I see it as he used to manipulate me into thinking it was all my fault.

unfortunately XH also learnt this from his mother. (seems to be a trend here! lol)

but i'm determined that DS won't turn out the same as his dad - and to be fair that's all you girls can do - make sure your kids are safe, secure and don't turn out like their dads.

we all do nothing all day - we drink tea and MN don't u know that! lol. sorry have to keep your humour.

how many of your friends know the true extent of the situation? (and I mean the TRUTH - not just the bits you'll admit to but all of it??)

only Jarm on here knew mine, (well 3/4 of mine) no one else did. didn't think any one would believe it - but there's help out there - even if all you want to do is talk it thru ring the guys at womens aid, i'm sure they won't pressure you in either way - or your GP.

thanks. I'll keep you posted.