Can a marriage recover after years of hidden debt and overspending?

[HulaHoop31]

I posted a few weeks ago about my situation discovering husbands 20k credit card debt, however I asked Mumsnet to remove the post as I was feeling quite overwhelmed and regretted posting so soon after finding out.

I am updating as the situation is now much worse.

After H swearing there was no more, it turns out there is. He owes a total of 60k over multiple credit cards and loans. He told me after I saw a 10k payment to a credit card and questioned where he got that sort of money.

He has a plan to pay this off by doing overtime over the next 2/3 years and his parents have loaned him 20k to pay a chunk off and stop the interest from overwhelming him. I have been through every statement with a fine tooth comb and it has all been spent on pointless crap. Shopping, buying presents for people, paying for rounds of drinks at work… he even spent 3k on add ons for a PlayStation game!! He would use his card for work and not pay it back when he claimed expenses. There is nothing suspicious on there. He took out loans to clear the cards, but then continued to spend and max them out again. This has been going on for around 4 years now. The payments started to be missed once the minimum payments over everything were almost 2k a month, which is when the letters started arriving to the house.

He spent all that on credit, and also manages to spend most of the money in our joint account every month. He orders things online all of the time, I have had countless conversations with him about stopping spending all of our money. He would do this without even discussing it with me first.

I am struggling with my feelings and how I can forgive him. I’m not sure I even can, but the thought of breaking up my family is killing me. In one sense we are lucky that we are able to pay this off, but this now means I have to take control of all our finances and ensure what we are left with covers bills and anything that the DC need. I am terrified to spend anything and am updating a budget spreadsheet I have made every day. He swears he will change and not buy anything stupid again, but I don’t know how I can believe him.

I am mentally drained and hurt by the deceit. I am upset that this has even happened as we earn decent money and have a reasonably nice life. It didn’t need to happen but it seems H has a spending addiction. Thinking back, it’s clear he has always been like this but I never realised until now. I feel like an idiot for not realising.

I feel now this is out in the open that he is feeling relief, whereas I am not. I hate what he has done, and I’m struggling to be able to even speak to him at the minute. I love my husband but I am so angry with him. He has put me in a situation that I never wanted to be in. I’ve always been big on financial security, and not spending above my means. Everything I have I’ve worked hard for. He knows this is important to me.

Has anyone got through this sort of financial infidelity? What did it take? Or if anyone has left, was it the right decision? Can people with this level of spending addiction really change?

For a bit of extra info - he has now told me that he got into an overdraft debt of 5k in his early 20’s and his dad bailed him out. I’m worried there may be a pattern to his behaviour.
We have been together for 9 years and have two young DC

Op, he really won’t change. I’ll give you 2 examples:

• my brother, forever in debt regardless of his circumstances. Many years ago the excuses were that his wife was a SAH mum and the kids were small. Then the kids grew up and his wife went back to work. Still in debt. Now the kids are adults, both kids are working and contributing to the household and my brother and his wife are also working. My brother is still in debt and doesn’t have a penny to his name.
• my friend’s husband. Very high earner. Never had any more. Excuses - high mortgage, kids in private school. Many years later- no mortgage (my friend paid it off) and his kids finished school. He still doesn’t have any money.

I can give countless other examples. This issue is not to do wirh the amount someone earns but wirh their attitude to money. You cannot help him and you should remove yourself from this situation as fast as you can. You cannot fix it, and any attempt to curb his spending and sort out his debts will end up in disaster. I’m so sorry

I would also be filing for divorce. And getting legal advice asap. I would also be wary of the money his parents gave him as this could give him the feeling of breathing room to then further increase debt.

This is one of the first things I checked, there is nothing against my name thankfully! My credit score is still really good

I would divorce for peace of mind. I'd not be able to relax. He's an addict.

If the wronged party is able to really forgive the person, then I think so. I was a SAHM and got myself into a clothes shopping addiction ion credit cards, my husband found out during Covid that I owed £7000 and he had no idea I was paying the min amount each month. He paid it all off immediately. He was devestated I had lied to him and said he didn't know if he could forgive me. He asked for some time and space. I gave him this and after a while he said he believed I was very sorry and would never lie to him again. He promised me he would forgive me and would never use this against me or make me feel bad about it, and would never resent me for it. And he stuck to his word. It has made us stronger. I almost lost everything and would never do so again. I made a colossal mistake and it once I got in really deep I didn't know how to get out of it. He does now trust me 100%. In fact I sometimes mention it and how bad it makes me feel, and I can't buy anything for myself any more without feeling guilt, and he is the one reassuring me and telling me to treat myself or buying things for me. But everyone is different, if you can't get past this and forgive then that's also fine, you must face up to that and end things in my opinion. For me the reason (not an excuse) was boredom and I felt like I lost myself as a mum of young kids and babies with no job, I was made redundant after maternity leave). I used the clothes to bolster my self esteem. I think my husband could kind of understand how I felt. He is the most amazing person. I hope you can get through this and I'm sorry you're struggling.

What's your housing situation? Renting or buying? Who is on the lease / deeds?

I’m sorry, I have a professional background in this area, and he won’t stop. You can try to control his finances but like any addict, he will out fox you. You will lose your own self respect, so best to get out of this now, whilst you have the energy.

He will definitely escalate to this in future unless you disentangle yourself from him ASAP.

Not as bad OP but my DH ran up 14k. I only found out about it when we sold our house and needed half the money we made to pay it off. I went mental. I paid the debt off, cut up his credit cards, and now he's only allowed to use the joint account so i can see it. Hes a really lovely guy but simply cannot keep track of his spending. I was always taught if you don't have the money, you can't spend it. I have to keep an eye on his out goings, any extra he has to ask me. Its bloody ridiculous, but he knows the only reason he's financially solvent now at 40 is because I control all the money!

When its that bad leaving may be your only protection. He won't pay it back unless he confronts his reason for overspending head on.

This!

Do not pay off his debt. It is not YOUR debt to pay. Depending on your housing situation, and on whether you decide to end the marriage, it would be better all round for him to declare himself bankrupt.

Make sure that all your money is in your name only. No joint accounts. No joint anything.

He has to face the consequences of his actions alone.

The lies. I could never trust or go near him again.

It won't stay like that for long as you have a joint account with this man. The first thing you need to do is close that and joint finances for the house come out of an account solely in your name, he needs to pay into that.

I would divorce him too.

It’s not really relevant I suppose as it’s my own personal trauma but no, I would not accept a threat to my security and my children’s security of this type. I probably posted on your previous thread. I grew up with a Dad who was actually not a spending or a gambling addict but a kind of financial status addict and never able to face the reality of what he had done. He ruined himself, my mum and embezzled money from multiple people. My brother and sister suffered really badly because of it - not just that we were broke but he wouldn’t ever talk to anyone about money or tell the truth, so they couldn’t get student funding for example. As for me, I grew up opening the door (or hiding from) debt collectors and ‘business associates’. He wasn’t a bad person, but he had a weakness that con men could spot a mile off. My mum only had peace and stability once he finally left her. All three of us children are pretty weird about money in various different ways. But I will not accept any financial lies from my partner. Other women? Pfft - I can deal with that. But risk the roof over my head and I am out.

Oh my. Leave. Please. You will never recovered from this level of debt. My ex was the same. Terrifying.

I was married to someone like this. I was constantly waiting for the other shoe to drop in terms of more debt. There was zero respect left.

I am so much happier without him as I like to live below my means. PS he wasn't just lying about money, there was more. Some of them lie about more things in their lives - there may be more, im afraid. Leave before it gets worse.

The stress of this will ruin your health OP.

He feels relief, you feel terrible.

For the rest of your relationship you will be on edge, worrying about money, calculating what he owes in your head, hoping he's not spending, feeling shit that your kids will miss out on holidays, school trips and whatnot because your income is now going towards paying off a debt you had nothing to do with.

He needs counselling and therapy or this will happen again. His parents giving him money is a sticking plaster. He's risked your kids future and the roof over their head.

No it won't recover. £3000 of family money on add ons for a game, strewth.

I would leave personally. I would also not repay or take out any credit to repay his debts
My dsis has been financially reckless all her adult life constantly getting into debt taking loans remortgages being lent money from dm tens of thousands but never paid back she has never learnt or changed probably because other than a quick lecture dm bailed her out. Dsis earns good money at one point when dc were little more than me and dh she is single and no dc

We are now nc as it came to light she was then helping herself to elderly dm money to skip the lecture and i refused to do an equity release on dm house she had gone through all of her savings She did the equity release blew the money on doing her own house up purely cosmetic nothing needed doing it’s just been sold as had changed her original mortgage to interest only planning on using inheritance to pay it off and unfortunately for her dm is in a care home but still alive dsis i presume will be moving to dm house that was being rented out not sure where she will go when dm dies and the equity release and care home fees need paying

my situation is extreme but I have shared it with you to help decide and show you how things can escalate.

Sorry op, for me it would be the end.

My ex was also incapable of being responsible about money, although not to the same degree. I would usually find out he had overspent or wasted money or stole from joint accounts, he would fall apart and swear he would never do it again, then a few hours later it was like nothing had ever happened. I tried controlling all the money and giving him an allowance but you can’t really function like that as two grown ups for very long and it was too much pressure on me. And I never could forgive the impulsiveness and dishonesty. I found it worse than if he had cheated on me because I can understand how you can fall for another person but not how you can just be so selfish and short sighted about money. There were other problems in the marriage but the financial abuse was in some ways the worst because it had the longest effect on me and I kept it a secret because I was ashamed my apparently intelligent and professional husband was such a wastrel. So to me it is grounds for divorce as it is unlikely he will not do it again without significant personal development.

We have been separated/divorced now for 5 years and he is virtually penniless, living in a crappy rental with no car. And it still affects me as he has no money for child support or to even buy them birthday presents. But I count myself lucky for getting out when I did as I am fine financially!

my main priority is my DC and making sure they have stability.
What does stability mean to you?

A roof over their heads? The house could be repossessed by the bank, if rented you could be evicted, possibility of being housed in a hostel as you will have made yourself intentionally homeless.
Possessions or cars? Bailiffs.
Father, mother and children in a nice nuclear unit? Father is unreliable, untrustworthy and a liar so it will never be a decent supportive relationship.

If you want a safe environment for your children then you will divorce.

What stands out for me is that he fucked up when young and his father bailed him out. So instead of learning not to fuck up again, all his parents taught him was that there are no consequences. He went back to them and they ponied up another 20K. He hasnt learned that you cant simply keep spending, as it will all be looked after by someone else.

If you want to stay married to him then he has to pay it all back via debt management/iva. You take control of everything financial and check his credit score every month to see if he has applied for anything else (although on IVA he wont be able to get any credit). He also gets himself into therapy to figure out where this came from.

If you dont then you take your half out of any joint savings accounts, have your salary paid into your personal account and, in writing, tell him that you have done this to protect you and the kids. Then you file. Mummy and Daddy always pick up after him so they can house him.

If you stay together you will resent it even if he buys a KitKat or a meal deal when he could have made a lunch at home. Whole you are going without and finding cheap alternatives he will still spend unwisely.

The fact that hes gone back to normal days it. His parents have bailed him out - again. He will never learn.

If for whatever reason you do stay with him, follow advice from previous posters and divorce him and get him to sign the house over to you. If you don't op, you will be back in five years saying you and the kids are lossing your home.