Controlling MIL - what would you do?

[Solicitor123]

This will probably be a long one. I’ve been harbouring a lot of issues with my mother in law for nearly 10 years now. I think I am just about at the end of my tether, but first thought I’d reach out to hear generally what others think - is it me being too sensitive, am I overreacting/ being unfair, and what would you do?!

The background is that I met DH when we were at university together and we have been together ever since. We are now married with a 6 month old daughter.

My husband’s family are quite different to my own (my family is a typical nuclear family with 3 sisters) whereas his mum and dad broke up when he was younger and he has one brother. He used to be close to his brother, however the brother has unfortunately had a drug problem for many years (I will go into more detail below!).

I think my main issue with my MIL is her controlling nature and manipulation. So far, since knowing her, she has:

• At the beginning of our relationship she would always call my husband fat and make fun of his clothes. She did it in a jokey way but anyone could tell he was uncomfortable. He is not fat at all by the way, quite the opposite. Once, when he was shopping for his wedding suit, she asked the sales assistant to tell my husband he shouldn’t wear that style because he looked fat in it.
• As above, there have been multiple serious issues with BIL over the years and MIL has always lied to cover it up. He is a prescription drug addict and has spent time in rehab. His mental health is poor and he has previously attempted suicide. There have been long periods where DH wasn’t allowed to go home, because his brother was there and they had seriously fallen out. He borrowed money from us once (not thousands but still not a small amount) and never paid it back. On one occasion, masked men broke into MIL’s house to demand drug money. Despite all of the issues, MIL expects us to love BIL, treat him totally normally and act like nothing is wrong.
• On my husband’s stag weekend, BIL took drugs, tried to punch my husband in the face and strangled one of his friends
• The first time DH got a job, MIL rang up the company to tell them that she used to work as a CEO in the same industry and therefore wanted to check their ratings since her son would be working there
• One Xmas we invited both families over for lunch and MIL told us that her family would be staying the night, but not mine as they live closer to us
• The preparations for our wedding were particularly stressful. MIL visited our wedding venue with her friends repeatedly despite us asking her to wait and come with us, and then lied about it. She wanted us to invite her friends (she was paying half of the wedding so we agreed) but it was never enough and she kept asking for more and more people to be added to the guest list, none of whom I had ever met. It was a smallish wedding and my husband had met everyone on my side of the guest list beforehand. She also told us to ask the vicar to make a particular announcement before the church ceremony - we said that we didnt want to do that. So she proceeded to ask the vicar to do it herself (I managed to intervene and reminded her that we didn’t want that), but she then asked DH’s best man to remind the vicar to make this announcement on the morning of the wedding. She would also phone our vendors behind our backs and changed the seating plan on the day of the wedding so that troublesome BIL was sitting closer to DH.

** I should add at this point that at the same time as our wedding, my mum had a very aggressive cancer and was extremely unwell. Tbh, we all thought she wasn’t going to make it. Things were really bad and my mental health was at an all time low. She made this 10000 x more stressful

• When I was heavily pregnant, we invited her round for a bbq. It was meant to just be a small casual thing as I was huge, it was hot and I was struggling. She demanded that we invite the rest of the whole family (5 extra people) and then specifically that we make a cheesecake.
• When DD was first born, she told us that BIL needed to come and visit the same week and then stormed out of the house when we said it was too soon.
• She also has issues with my BIL’s girlfriend. For example she bought her a pram but then refused to hand it over unless BIL, who had recently been found to be taking drugs again, was allowed to be at the birth. BIL’s girlfriend didn’t want that at the time. BIL also had drugs delivered to his girlfriend’s house and MIL went round to request them back. She said that BIL needed them and she didn’t understand.
• She has repeatedly put my job down over the years, telling me that my salary is ‘alright’ and minimising what I do for a living.

The latest issue is that it is DD’s christening in a few weeks and MIL is demanding again that her friend be invited. Unlike the wedding, MIL is not financially contributing to the cost of the christening. My extended family are invited to the christening but my parent’s friends are not (MIL doesn’t have extended family but all of her close family will be attending).

We are not close to this friend, my DH has seen her twice in our entire 10 year relationship (one being at our wedding) and she has never met DD.

I am quite frankly sick and tired of constantly being told what to do by MIL and having all supposed to be happy events turned into a battle. I asked my DH multiple times when organising the christening who he wanted to invite and he invited several friends. He never once mentioned wanting to invite MIL’s friend because we don’t know her and she doesn’t feature in our lives.

Whenever we have to see MIL I get in such a bad mood, I just can’t help myself. My husband does stick up for us sometimes, but he has lived with her controlling behaviour his whole life and so sometimes lets things be brushed under the carpet.

My question is - what would you do at this point?

There are books on how to set boundaries with people, so I suggest purchasing one or getting one from the library. Then you and your husband can read it together and discuss how you'll then handle your MIL, as a team, to stop, or at least lessen, the stress.

That said, I know that the best way to change someone else's behavior is to change your own. Usually, one reacts in the same the way over time, establishing a pattern. But when you react in a totally different way for once, the predator is usually taken aback, and that might be a wake-up call to them. As an example, if she comments about your job negatively, you could say, "I'm proud of what I've accomplished. Your take on it is bringing me down, so let's change the subject." Ask your husband if he's willing to tell her when his mother calls him fat, something like: "I don't like that comment, even if you see it as joking. If you say something like that again, I will go home, or ask you to leave." (Depending on who is where.)

There needs to be consequences to her behavior. You can end a conversation over the phone when she's being negative or won't let up on a request. Decide as a team with your husband that there will be no back and forth arguing with his mother. If she keeps on after she's told "no," the phone will be hung up, or if you're in each other's presence, she needs to leave the house, or you leave from her house or the restaurant or from whatever location.

This should also coincide with praising her for good behavior. When she's positive, make sure you take note of it. Such as if she holds the baby while you attend to something you need to do, you can tell her she's such a good grandma, and that your child is lucky to have her living close by.

A retraining process might have its bumps, but think of it as something you need to endure until the road can be smoothed out. If she's untrainable, perhaps make the visits fewer than they've been. I'd assume she might begrudgingly comply since that would mean seeing her grandchild less often. That consequence might push her into better behavior.

I don’t know why you are bending to her will continuously. Tell her no. Then if she badgers you, say it’s not up for discussion.

With any luck, if you can hold your nerve, she will fall out with you and piss off?

Holding you hostage because she financially contributed to things is the height of tacky and controlling, and sadly seems to be an instinct for some people as you see alot of that on threads on here. My own aunty is like this, she is extremely transactional and loves to showboat her wealth, and has no children, so has contributed to mine and my sisters wedding (not a huge amount but significant ie paying for the flowers etc). She managed to control some aspects of my sisters wedding but when she tried it with me I just said no. She'd never stoop so low as to withdraw her money but think she knew I'd not take it if it came came strings.

Weirdly what you say about your MIL calling her son fat when he wasn't, also sounds so like my aunty. Growing up she'd make such barbed horrible le comments then give an airy laugh as if it was all a fun joke, when it wasn't. I don't know the motivation to this day, she's still like that. She has low self esteem herself totally, which may be a cause but it's ao strange.

It's a real shame your DH has had what sounds like a chaotic and emotionally controlling childhood and adult relationship with his mother. He needs to put a stop to it, not you. He says no, friend isn't coming. Simple as that. If she tries to bring up anything from the past that's emotional blackmail, call it out! Narcissists can't cope when their victims see what they're doing and eacalate, but ehats the alternative? To fo as she asks forever? Will she invite her friends to every milestone birthday your daughter had? She sounds like a menace and your DH really really really needs to stand up to her.

Go no contact

I would encourage your h to get therapy re his abusive mother. Controlling behaviour is abusive behaviour. He still wants her approval even now, approval she will never give him. He is also likely mired in fear, obligation and guilt: three buttons she put in him at an early age. His inertia when it comes to his mother hurts him as well as you. He has been taught by her to believe that Bad Things will happen to him
if she gets upset. Such people are really incapable of being upset.

You have likely come from an emotionally healthy family so had no idea there are families out there who do not behave by the normal rules of familial
engsgement. Your DH has not bern so lucky.
I guess you had never come across such a dysfunctional family unit before meeting DH. His mother was bad news also long before you married.

People from dysfunctional families like your DHs end up playing roles. What roles are all these people playing here?.

I would stay well away from her now. You do not owe her anything let alone a relationship here.

Do not invite Mils friend to your child’s christening. Say no and repeat no. You both need to put on a united front. Goodness knows what mils thinking is here but it’s disordered and you cannot ever reason with people this disordered of thinking.

You also need to keep your child well away from her. If she is too difficult/toxic for YOU to deal with it’s the SAME deal for your child also.

If you as a couple keep giving in to her she will merely
continue to further up the power and control against and your child.

This isn't going to happen.

It's been 10 years during which she hasn't once behaved in an appropriate manner.

You need to let go of this fantasy.

She is never ever going to be the MIL you deserve or the DM your DH deserves.

It's time to stop seeing her. If your DH can't face this then he can go without you.

Just say no, fingers crossed she will flounce off and then you don’t have to deal with her. She’s shown you if you give an inch she will take a mile. Give her nothing. Tell her no. Eventually she will learn.

For goodness sake stop putting up with it, you should have nipped this in the bud years ago, now she thinks you won’t stand up to her and she can do as she likes.

This is a very sensible reply.
also, going forward, let your husband take your child to visit her and remove yourself from the equation. She’s sounds unbearable.

We had a lot of similar-ish issues with my in-laws when our children were small. It got to the point where I'd have been happy to never see them again tbh. A really helpful thing to remember is that you can't change their behaviour but you can change the way you respond.

How do you respond now when she's being unreasonably demanding? Dh used to try to reason with his parents but in all honesty, that just rewarded their behaviour. Be careful that you aren't accidentally doing the same.

Instead you can draw some boundaries and stick to them. This will be a lot easier if you are both on the same page.

Ours include:

• we share very little information with them
• we don't see them that often
• we rarely entertain them (they inevitably outstay their welcome, they're hard work, feeding fil is a nightmare) - instead we go to them or meet on neutral territory so we're in control of when we leave. (My SIL once messaged me in despair after she'd been on 2 very pointed dog walks and not offered any food and they still hadn't taken the hint to leave)
• we have a rule that if they kick off we will leave. A milder version of this is just pretending I haven't heard them - small children are an excellent cover for that, you never know when a nappy might need changing 😉 I also just refuse to answer any intrusive questions eg I once answered "I don't know" in about 17 different ways to FIL's bizarre and intrusive questions about my parents' pension arrangements 🤣 Eventually he stopped.

Some specifics:

• don't invite her to things like suit fittings
• don't share many details of plans - present as a fait accompli
• you are right to draw boundaries re BIL. Don't discuss it with her.
• make the terms of any invitation very clear. If you don't want her to stay the night then be explicit. Or just don't invite her. You don't have to.
• re her inviting people - I might let the one friend to the christening go but otherwise (eg the barbecue) "that doesn't work for us, we're going to stick to our original plan" is a good response. Repeat if necessary. "Cheesecake would be lovely but I already have the menu sorted thanks" "Cheesecake is a great idea - would you be able to bring that?"
• comments about your job: ignore completely? Pretend you haven't heard her? Smile, look a bit vacant and make a non-committal mmm kind of noise? Change the subject? "Oh my goodness I forgot to tell you <insert seriously banal bit of news here>. Or oh dear the baby needs changing again 🤣 I guarantee that if you consistently deprive these comments of oxygen they will stop.
• storming out - let her go!! Act like nothing's happened (see above comment re oxygen)

Hope that helps a bit! I know it feels impossible but honestly you can take control here.

Break contact with her, block on everything, she would never get the opportunity to control any part of my life ever again

When mil rang the suit hire shop to alter the order thankfully the shop owner had the logic to ring us and check.

Gosh she sounds an absolute shocker! I don’t know how close you live to your PILs but honestly I’d consider moving jobs and house and going to the other end of the country. Don’t tell them until it’s done! Go very LC as much as possible and never share any info with her.

Yeah as ever with these situations. You have a DH problem.

He needs to sort this. You are not required to have a relationship with your MIL.

OMG! I hope my adult 'children' are reading this, your MiL makes me look like an angel 😳
That aside, you've done very well to cope with her for so long

Christenings are meant to be about welcoming a child into the church family. They're not supposed to be private celebrations for family and friends - though I understand that's how a lot of them function these days. But this gives you a couple of options: you can say of course the friend can come - it's a church service, you can ask the Vicar to publicise it to encourage the congregation to attend and/or move the service to be within the Church's main Sunday service when the congregation will be there anyway. You can 'dilute' the impact of your MIL's friend by having lots of new people there from the church congregation. You might meet some interesting people who are local / you might identity local people who are annoying.

As for what you do about her longer term I'd think about:

• Find the stately homes thread in the Relationships section here - it's all about difficult family members especially parents and may be good reading for both you and your husband.

*Couples therapy - make sure you and your husband are in agreement and he has support.

*Try contacting your local drugs and alcohol service for advice on interacting with your brother in law - they're usually set up to help family members as well as unwell people.

• If you're using a nursery / childminder establish a password to stop her collecting your daughter etc.

• Geography - can you move away from her towards an area with supportive people/ better jobs etc? Distance might reduce her opportunities for being difficult.

Just say no. I presume your DH told her no to 5 extra guests and making a cheesecake for your bbq? Just say no.

I tried ‘you’ll have to speak to DH about that’ which meant that any unreasonable request or attempt to control family events was no longer my responsibility. And forced the two of them to communicate more.
You have a near cast iron response here I think. ‘Sadly, MIL, we don’t feel it’s safe for us/you to be around BIL or any house where prescription drugs are, with our child present. I’m sure you understand’.

I would tell this fucking arsehole to do one, and never darken your door again.

Both you and your husband may benefit from some CBT to help you learn how to say no and how to set boundaries. Over an extended time you seem to have fallen into a pattern of MIL demanding something from you and you not being clear and strong enough in your refusal. I can see how it happens, but learn to find your voice and hold your place.

If it were me, I would begin to set clear boundaries, and be clear why you are doing it. I would not cut off all contact, because I imagine your husband wouldn’t want that, but I would certainly hold the relationship at a distance.
I would also try to build a good relationship with BIL’s girlfriend, as she is the mother of your daughter’s cousin, and she is in a similar position to you but with the added stress of BIL being the father of her child.

This is your family your baby tell interfering terrible mil to do one just that simple that read was exhausting so how you must feel is awful dont let her ruin your christening if I was you id do it in secret then have bbq amd let guests know its a christening bbq and this who want to moan or snub are nit excited

You need to speak to your DH and decide if thats how you want the rest of your life to be.

Do you want your child being exposed to her negativity? To drugs? To being put down all the time? All Christmases ruined?

I would have told her to fuck off long ago, you’ve both allowed her to trample all over you.
Do not engage her, tell her plans, any information at all, personally I’d block her and go no contact, she sounds horrific.

I can’t believe you have a 6 month old and the time to write this very long post. Not sure what you expect us to say abs we don’t know you or your Mother in law and we are only getting your version, so I have nothing useful to add except you are a very efficient person! What do you do for a living out of curiosity?