Benefits of marriage 2nd/3rd time around

[QueenBing]

It would be 2nd time for me, 3rd time for him. The romantic in me thinks marriage would be a lovely idea in a few years, we’ve been together nearly 4 years and living together for around 7 months. Practically though, is there any real benefit to being married? The house is solely in my name and I have around £125k equity, possibly more. Also there’ll probably be inheritance from my parents around £125k (hopefully not for a long time yet). He has savings of around £100k, earns twice what I do, but owns no property. I have DD16 and DS13 who live with me/us full time. He has 2 daughters, DD20 at uni and DD24 who lives with her boyfriend. Divorce has been hideous for us both, worse for him (2nd wife truly awful and dragged divorce out in court to the nth degree, cost him over £20k in legal fees and the judge ordered her to pay half of his legal bill in the end!).
Despite all of this I still hope we’ll get married one day. I can’t tell you why. We’re happy as we are, why change things? He’s not keen on getting married again because of people’s reactions to a third marriage. He says it’s embarrassing for him. I don’t know why a ring and a bit of paper mean so much to me when ultimately I could lose my home if we were to divorce.
So apart from romantic reasons, are there any practical reasons why marriage would be a good idea? I’m 45, DP is 53.

I would think of next of kin reasons, otherwise medical decision making will fall to his eldest at some point.

I think you can nominate anyone as your next of kin. Doesn’t have to be a spouse. I thought about this reason too!

I can’t think of any reason whatsoever apart from the wedding day ( which would actually be a negative for me) to ever get married.

I am a romantic I swear!!

I wouldn’t even want a big wedding day, I didn’t first time round. 12 guests then pub in the evening when some more friends came to join us. I don’t like being the centre of attention but I am a romantic!

Second marriages fair enough, but I would never be anyone's third wife.

Inheritance tax is not paid between spouses.

I think its the opposite of romantic to be trapped, contracted legally to someone and unable to get out of it. That can happen too, no matter how much you love someone, and it’s really heartbreaking.

Can you have a romantic honeymoon and skip the wedding bit??

I can’t imagine ever getting married again. I can see what men gain out of it, but not women.

I think in your financial position, a marriage would be an unwise move. If you were to separate you might well lose half of what you have, and that would go to his DC instead of yours. And, if you were to predecease him, without a will, it might well all go to him (and any future wife, and his DC). Please get legal advice. The romance is in the relationship, surely, not in a state sanctioned legal contract. Have a commitment ceremony and a big party to celebrate your relationship!

Even if the second marriage was very short and ended through no fault of your DP? His first marriage was long, they were together over 20 years, but the second lasted 15 months and she cheated on him. I think I’d feel differently about being a third wife if the divorce was his fault

I didn’t know this

This is what my head keeps telling me but I still want that ring and I don’t know why!

These are my fears, I’d want our family home to go to my DCs. I fought so hard for it during the divorce and I’ve made sacrifices to keep it. When we’ve discussed marriage previously I’ve mentioned a prenup which he isn’t entirely opposed to but I could never risk losing my DCs’ home

If you want to do it then you could sell your place and put £100k each into a property together. You could be tenants in common. Keep 25k as an emergency fund for yourself. Make sure you have a will leaving your 50% to your kids on the event of your death.

Personally, it's mot something I would do in your financial position.

I am in a similar-ish position, and I do have occasional flighty moments of wanting to be married to my really lovely DP but I quell those with an iron fist - I wouldn't want to put myself and my DC at a financial disadvantage because of one of these flights of fancy. Ultimately it is the relationship that matters not the ceremony. I had a gorgeous week-long celebration for my wedding the first time around, marriage that followed was awful.

We are sold this fairy tale of happierly ever after our whole lives. A lot of our value is based in men wanting to marry us. It's the end goal. The prize. Unfortunately, often what you win is shit but we still keep on playing.

I really like this idea

OP - I think the romantic in you wants to have a fairy tale, and to undo the failure of your first marriage. But marriage is not a romantic gesture - romance is how you are in the relationship, every day.

Marriage is a financial contract. And in your situation, at this time - it's not a smart move to entangle your financials and potentially endanger your kids' inheritance.

There is no rush - you have not been together all that long. Your kids are still at school. You both are not that old yet. Why not enjoy your relationship as is, let the time pass, let the kids grow up and establish themselves. In 10 years, say - you'll be in a very different place in your life and your relationship. You can then plan your estates and your retirement - and if marriage would make sense then, you can always do it.
But for now - both of you would probably want to pass on your assets to your kids - not have a new spouse have a claim over them. Don't bring this complication to a good relationship.

I think you need to respect his wishes and not pressure him to do something he doesn’t want to. What if your relationship doesn’t work out? About half of all marriages end in divorce. For second and third marriages the rate is probably even higher. He probably doesn’t want to end up being divorced for a third time. He can’t just keep on getting married indefinitely. I can’t imagine any future partners will look upon a thrice divorced man favourably. Same goes for you. If you’re not married, you both can just bow out of the marriage easily and gracefully. It’s good to learn from past mistakes. Why have history repeat itself.

Had a long conversation about third marriages with DH this evening. One of this oldest friends is about to tie the knot for the third time in his late 40s. We both agreed that twice is fine, completely non-sociopathic, often very happy. Equally, everyone we’ve ever met who got married a third time has been a horrendous spouse, full-blown narcissist, etc.

The fact that he doesn’t want to get married again is great news. He’s a keeper. Just don’t get married.

But what's so romantic about a wedding? Or a marriage?
It's an institution which has its roots in subjugation of women. Passing of ownership from a father to a husband.

Don’t forget OP marriage has always been about finances: it used to be that you’d marry well to keep your financial future safe. You need to think of exactly the same priorities, just that in our day and age and especially in your position it probably means not marrying. Be smart, listen to the Jane Austen-esque spinster aunt on your shoulder!

Be careful with this idea, OP. If you died, your children would own your 50% share of your property with your partner/husband owning the other 50% share. This could be fraught with issues around either them forcing him out or him refusing to move/sell, and complications over who pays property maintenance (your children should share the costs equally but wouldn't necessarily want to if he refused to move and there was no immediate benefit for them, they may not have the cash etc).

Also, this only protects your share on death, not on divorce. You'd need legal advice on that.

You clearly have your own emotional reasons for wanting marriage and this is something for you to work through. But financially, it makes far more sense for you to stay unmarried. I would recommend setting up a Lasting Power of Attorney for each of you nominating each other in case of accident/illness leading to loss of mental capacity.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned though, is that he is in a pretty weak position if you died, or both seperated. He is presumably contributing towards the household costs, but would have no ownership rights. He has his own savings to start again, but may have some claim over equity in the future too. Again, legal advice needed!

I think calling it a ‘contract’ rather than a wedding helps me. You could still get the jewellery and the honeymoon and sex, just not the contract.

I know though. It’s the hopeful optimism isn’t it.

Have a lovely celebrant led ceremony with rings and promises and a party after but don't do the legal bit.