Family drama and I am in the middle

[Daffodilsareyellow1]

I would do with some advice as im not sure what (if anything I should be doing to help).

Im 38 I have a younger brother who is 34. Oir mum is 63. Our mum and dad separated when we were 10 and 6. Dad died 11 years ago.

My mum has some health issues. I can't always keep up with what! She has fibromyalgia, sciatica, tennis elbow, back pain. Also awaiting a hip op anytime now. So she's currently in a lot of pain. She was also recently in hospital with vomiting and is still weak but mostly better. She hasn't worked since we were younger and doesnt do much with her day. She tends to be up late, in bed until late and watching TV. She doesnt really have friends or go out...im just providing the context.

My younger brother can be quite blunt/unkind and is very inpatient. He has said for a while that pir mum need sto help herself, he has no sympathy for her and she's useless. He thinks she should have worked and been able to help us financially etc. I think hes quite resentful. He also does have periods of feeling low and I think hes quite lonely. However, he does get on with our mum and she is genuinely kind and loves us a lot.

Yesterday out of nowhere he sent me a screenshot of messages he had sent our mum. Basically he messaged her saying he was going to kill himself at xmas like 'bob'(a friend of my mum and stepdad who killed himself 2 years ago at xmas). He then said he was only joking. He then proceeded to tell her she is useless, she's a shit mother, she's never been there for me or him and that hes been alone since our dad died. As much as I loved our dad, he was an alcoholic who would tell us as kids that he was going to kill himself.

He's not seeing her xmas day and wants nothing to do with her. I asked what had happened and is he OK, it seems anger is triggered by an issue with a girl he was seeing (found out she had slept with his friend). When he gets angry, you cant really talk sense into him.

I appreciate his feelings are valid but hes been very cruel. I think if he had any issues then he should have spoke to my mum in an adult like way to address them. I spoke to my mum and she's really devastated. My brother asked my today if I had spoken to mum and what was her reply. I told him she's really upset and he said 'good, she's useless'. My mum has asked if i have heard from my brother but what can I say??? I don't want to say 'yes but he wants nothing to do with you'. I know its not about me or my issue but im in the middle. I don't know how to help or what to say to my mum or brother.

Any ideas??

You're only stuck in the middle if you choose to put yourself there. You don't need to help them sort out the issues that they have between them. This isn't on you. It sounds like you have some pretty intense family dynamics and you'll be part of that - maybe as the fixer? The diplomat? The good one?

I would personally hold the line of ' I love you both but this issue is between you, so I don't want to get involved'.

It's nothing to do with you. You're not your brother's go between. If he's got things to say to your mum then tell him to go and see her. Manipulating everyone won't do him any good. My dad died end of September. My mum has dementia. I have 5 siblings (we're all older than you but equally mum never worked and there is a good deal of resentment around many things ) one sister hasn't been in contact with my parents for 15 years, huge arguments, but my mum doesn't remember them so now treats sister like the prodigal daughter. I just don't get involved.

To he honest id always have said we are a close family. We don't tend to have arguments or any family drama. My brother can definitely be blunt. He's the same with my nan. If she complains she hadnt seen him he will literally say to her 'you're selfish. Im not coming back and then walk out!

He obviously has issues and his feelings are valid but he is unable to have discussions like a 'normal' adult. If he has something in his head. He's said hes going to 'have it out' with my mum. He's not going to have a nice, calm conversation with her though. He'll just tell her she's lazy, useless and let us down.

I hate knowing my mum is so upset. She messaged a few hours ago asking if id heard from my brother but I don't know what to say! The truth will upset her.

Don't allow yourself to be put in the middle. Spend time with your mum and do what you feel you can to look after her. It's easy to judge and think she doesn't do much but it sounds like she is living with a chronic health condition and that's bound to affect her energy levels. Do you drive? Maybe you can get her out to somewhere where she can get some fresh air and be outside in nature - it can be a real tonic and might be just what she needs. Tell your brother not to speak to you about mum as you don't want to be in the middle of it. Sympathise with your mum but tell her you can't be a go-between for her and your brother. They're both adults and it's up to them to sort their differences out.

Tbh, I'd say to DM that yes, I had spoken to him, he's told me what he said to her, I've told him what he's done is absolutely awful (because it bloody is, from what you've said, and if you've not told him that then you should!) and what he's said about how you feel is a load of absolutely bollocks.

His GF shagging someone else has fuck all to do with his mother! How dare he go out trying to wound people who love him because he's hurting.

From what you've said, what he's said to her is entirely baseless, and she's not useless, she's in serious pain and it sounds like she has been for a very long time. Of course she finds things difficult and has to rest a lot.

I wouldn't be in the middle. I'd be firmly on DMs side, frankly.

He is 34. Do not be in the middle of this. Sorry op.

That's so hard OP, and it's all very well saying to keep out of it but it's incredibly difficult when loved ones are really upset.

I think what your brother has said is extremely cruel (unconscionable really, the suicide threat). Personally I'd be telling him what I thought, and reassuring your mum that you don't feel like that. I'd be honest and say I thought he was taking out anger over the relationship on her and being very unfair. Are you with her for Christmas?

Fgs OP he sounds like a complete arsehole!

Has no one ever told him to shut up and behave himself when he was growing up? He seems to think he's the centre of the universe!

Jesus, that's an awful message to send. You mentioned your dad being an alcoholic, is your brother also going down that road? He obviously enjoys feeling resentful and sorry for himself and then lashing out and doubling down when called to account - very familiar alcoholic patterns of behaviour.

I think in your shoes I'd say similar to what @GrannyAchingsShepherdsHut suggested - that yes you've spoken to him and that he shows no signs of being suicidal, but that he's clearly unwell and unhappy in his own life right now and that he has, unacceptably, taken that out on her. And I'd reassure her that I love her and just try to have best peaceful Xmas day with her.

I honesty think he has a lot of issues. To me, he is obviously depressed and lonely and has issues. However his emotional intelligence is evidently not great. We are generally close and hes obviously unhappy but I don't condone any of this. Especially a few days before Christmas.

I have told him that hes been cruel and that if he has any issues then he could have discussed them in a calm and respectful manner. Ive told told my mum that I love her and that I don't feel the same way he does.

I know I should just keep out but im worried hes going to cause a lot more upset. He evidently has issues from our childhood. He said its his job to look after me since dad has died as we have no-one. I do agree that my mum could do a bit more to help herself, (not currently as she's in a lot of pain). However, he doesnt understand her health issues and that being so nasty and cruel is not the way to get his point across.

That seems awful and unwarranted from your brother. Even if you mum had worked I doubt that would have meant money for him

You and your brother could have had quite different childhood experiences. When you went off to university at 18 (if you did) he may have been left to fend for himself in a household with an alcoholic father and a mother who had given up on caring responsibilities. Has she had fibromyalgia for the last 20 years or is this a more recent diagnosis?

Threatening suicide is obviously beyond the pale if he doesn’t mean it and is just saying it to wound her but if he genuinely has mental heath problems triggered by his relationship with his girlfriend breaking down and significant unresolved childhood trauma, these things sometimes come out at this time of year.

Chronic pain or not, your mum also sounds like very hard work!

No, my brother does not have issues with drink. He occasionally drinks but its not a regular thing.

So my mum and brother live in the same village we grew up in. I live 100 miles away. We alternate xmas this year, so I will be there boxing day with thr children. My brother is supposed to be there too with his son but has told her hes not going. Basically my mum messaged him yesterday to ask if he'd be having xmas dinner with them and then he started the abuse.

Just to say that my mum hadn't given up on caring responsibilities when we were children, not at all. She did everything for us in terms of cooking, cleaning etc. Always allowed friends over. We never had much money but we would have days out to the beach etc. I know my dad said a lot of derogatory things about my mum when we were younger, I dont think this helped. The herh issues have occurred since we became adults, although I think he resents her for not having worked.

On what planet are his feelings about your mother "valid"?

Do not give him any credit here, he sounds like an arse.

You may be close to your brother generally but at this point Id be taking a long hard look at his underlying character. And it's not nice. He sounds far more selfish than your mother and vicious to boot.

It is not his responsibility to look after you; it is yours. He also does not have power over you, and I suspect he thinks he does.

His behaviour to your poor mother is appalling. Which decent person repeatedly calls their mother useless? No matter what she did or didn't do, this is, as a pp said, unconscionable behaviour. He sounds aggressive and nasty.

In your shoes I'd be slowly distancing myself from your brother.

I wonder what your brother would do if he went off on one of his "blunt" rants, to be told to his face that he is a rude and nasty piece of work, with appalling behaviour. And that he should take himself out of the door and not come back until he grew up and apologised for behaving like a spoiled toddler.

I find it really difficult to reconcile what you have said about being a close family and no drama, with your brother's behaviour. He sounds absolutely vile.

I last messaged him and said 'I dont agree with what you've done. You've been unnecessarily nasty and cruel and I dont want to be in the middle of it".

His reply 'i know. Shes not exactly been great with us though, has she'.

You’re not in the middle. He’s trying to put you there, but you can say no. Tell him to stop messaging you about your mum, that you won’t be having those conversations with him and if it doesn’t stop, block him.

Now my mum has messaged to say he hasn't replied to her message, she's really worried about him but doesnt want to make him worse by calling him.

Your brother is being horribly abusive towards your mum, and she needs protecting from his behaviour.

He clearly has a lot of issues. But that does not excuse what he's done.

I know. She's messaged me again saying she feels awful and hates to think of him being on his own. Ive told her that its a choice hes made, he doesnt have to be alone and that hes been incredibly nasty and has to take responsibility for his actions

Your brother sounds abusive and manipulative. Rather like his father. He's said some vile things to your Mum, and the suicide threats are disgusting.

Presumably your Mum brought you up more or less on her own, and provided for you, while your father was busy being an alcoholic.

The health conditions she has will be incredibly painful and debilitating for her. My advice to her would be to ignore his tantrums, let him fester in his own vitriol until he apologises, and to get on with her life, and ignore any messages from him. Delete without reading.

You aren't in the middle, you have options, you can tell both of them not to involve you in any way, or you can support your Mum and protect her from his abuse. I'm sure she went through enough of that with your father, she doesn't need it from your arsehole of a brother.

@AmyDudley it was a strange situation with my dad. He was i suppose a functional alcoholic. He had a good job as an engineer but would drink every evening. At weekends he'd start drinking at 11am. He was very depressed after he and my mum split up. He'd always talk about her and he was obviously incredibly unhappy. He wasn't abusive. Unfortunately as a child I didn't have the ability to help and support him. In face a few years before he died he got a girlfriend and he actually wasn't as good at keeping in touch.

I feel as though my brother is having a hard time right now and decided it is all my mums fault. She is his focus and nothing anyone says will change that.

@Daffodilsareyellow1 It's hard to comment constructively as families are so complex and only the members of the family really know all the ins and outs. I guess I tend to naturally side with women against men who are rude and nasty and threaten suicide (having had a very abusive XH). I feel very sorry for your Mum and for you, it's a horrible situation epecially at this time of year. I wish you luck and strength in dealing with it all