SEPTEMBER 2025 - Well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

I have now set up a new thread as the previous one is now full.
This long runnning thread has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.
The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!
One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;
'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'
Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.
Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.
NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.
You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.
'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.
I started with this book and found it really useful.
Here are some excerpts:
"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.
Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.
Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:
"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.
YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".
"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.
YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".
"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."
"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"
"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."
YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."
"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.
YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."
Helpful Websites
Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat for details.
Some books:
Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa
This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:
"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

We can stop the cycle but can we ever completely fill that little hole inside of ourselves? I can fill my children’s but my own I don’t know. I live for my kids but I can feel a sense of incompleteness in myself sometimes. I can never get back what was never given.

Perhaps that is why we differ form the narcs. we are deciding to carry the pain and deal with the pain so that our children don’t ever have to. They just pass the pain on because of their refusal.

I try not to dwell on it although I do have the odd sad day where I just wish I could go back in time to that little girl who tried so hard to please a mother that was never going to be pleased but then I pull myself together and remember that that girl has grown up into a strong woman and is not passing down generational trauma to her own child. I also live for my son. I wont allow him to be made feel like I did. I cant claw that time back but I can give my child a better and more supportive life than the one I had.

I know what you mean. I see my DH and BILs, and male friends, being loving, protective fathers to their DC and I know that I never had that. I do feel a sense of sadness even now, that my F, far from protecting me did me great harm.

And my DM, though I know she meant well, wasn’t able to properly love me as a mother should. Practically she can be very helpful, but the emotional connection isn’t there. Not her fault at all, it’s because of her own experiences, it’s just how it is.

As a result, I know that I haven’t been the mother that my adopted DDs (16 and 13) needed, especially DD2. I’m doing my best to put it right, but DD2 has emotional difficulties that are at least partly down to me not having been there for her emotionally because of my own mental health issues. (Although obviously the adoption trauma also plays a big part, too.)

That sounds really hard. This is really hard. My eldest has ADHD and I can’t help but blame the fact I had a child with a Narc. Would she have had if not, has the trauma of our separation harmed her (she was only 2). Has all the things that’s happened because of this contributed. It’s hard so hard. But my
kids will never do the hard without me as long as I live. I think we all have our hard but it’s the going through it alone that causes the most damage. My children won’t ever be alone.

Well I have diagnosed Audhd and my son is in the process of a diagnosis but I do not 'blame' anyone on mine and his neurological 'issues'.

@Strawberrypjs It’s very hard to know what’s to blame very often or who. In my DD1’s case it’s obvious; she’s been diagnosed with probable FASD because of her birth mum’s drinking through her pregnancy. She has hearing and sight loss, probably because of birth trauma (it was detected at 6 weeks.) And she has probable ND, she’s still waiting for a neurodevelopmental assessment.

It sounds like you’re a wonderful mum and I really don’t think your DD’s ADHD has anything to do with her dad being a narc, no one is to blame for it. From what I understand about it, it’s genetic.

I think it’s just in my family genes as me and my mum are both ND. My daughter has her challenges but she is amazing and spirited and very artistic like her mum. I just worry like her mum she will be and is extremely vulnerable to narcs. She does see through some of her dad’s behaviour though. She has support so I think she will be ok.

Oh my that is very sad, what a life she has gone through. It’s hard to carry the weight of your choices when at the time the choices were appauling. Blame is a strange thing really as at the time we didn’t know. Am I to blame for choosing a terrible father for my daughter, I should have known better but I didn’t. My girls are both amazing and very spirited kids 😂

I am not 'susceptible' to narcs, I was raised by one. It was forced upon me. Actually i am a fairly good judge of character and can tell when someone is being fake. I was always the one sitting back thinking 'how does everyone seem to love this person when I would not trust them with a cardboard cut out of myself'? But now i know its my ND 'superpowers' for want of a better phrase and I can suss out a fake a mile away.

When I was 20 I fell for a narc man who abused the shit out of me for a long time until I had a breakdown. My ND super powers were pushed down so far but I can definitely feel them now. Back then I thought everyone was good and decent because I didn’t operate out of any malice so everyone was the same. How wrong!

I know. It’s a question that my DM asks herself, is she to blame for my F’s CSA of my DSis and me? And we sometimes feel blame for her, for not keeping us safe. But at the end of the day, only he is to blame.

Maybe it would have helped if we’d had justice, there would have been closure.

And you are not to blame either, you’re doing all you can to be the best mum that you can be and that’s the most important thing.

I’ve had this discussion with a friend whose partner and father of her 2 young kids is abusive. I had to tell her that at some point those 2 children may come back and blame you because you keep choosing him. She knows that his shouting and swearing at her in front of them is wrong but she won’t leave. Is it just his fault or is she also to blame?

I think I probably would say that your friend should accept some responsibility for not leaving, though I’ve never been in her shoes so it wouldn’t be right for me to judge.

You got away from your narc ex, so you did act to protect your DDs.

In my case, it isn’t right to blame my DM asks I do believe her when she says she didn’t know what was happening and she’s blaming herself too much already.

She's enabling.

Forgiveness is very personal. I have forgiven my own mum and the anger for her dissipated a couple of years ago. She has made a great effort practically with the kids and that does stand for something. Sometimes forgiveness is in recognising someone is trying their best. It wasn’t enough really when I was her child. There are other people in my life where forgiveness will never be offered.

It’s such a difficult situation to be in. Basically if they split he won’t bother to see the kids and she will have to carry that. She feels awful.

What I’ve found is that forgiveness is about moving on with your life as well. At one time I was filled with anger with my F, but through therapy and my own Christian faith, I’ve been able to let go of my bitterness. Apart from anything else, hating a dead man is pointless.

My DD1 has every reason to be angry at her birth mum for drinking through her pregnancy and this will be something for her to explore through therapy. We have read her life story book and later letter with her, and pointed out to her that her birth mum did love her but she was unable to make the right choices due to the trauma she herself went through as a result of growing up with dysfunctional parents and years in care.

Very sad the impact we have on each other. Poor little girl. 😢

That’s very true. Thankfully, DD1 is now at a specialist college where she’s doing very well. She couldn’t cope at all in mainstream but we’ve finally found the right place for her after years of fighting to get her the EHCP she needed.

@LizzieW1969i agree with you I am not sure I have totally forgiven dsis but I have chosen to accept what she has done for my mental well being i have let go of most of my anger towards her and hurt of how she has treated me and dc as it was only me it was affecting she couldn’t give a toss and is living her life

I do still have my moments though where I can’t believe she’s got away with all this and feel the need to prove to everyone what she has done but I soon snap out of it these days because it will only cause me more stress

That’s the bit that sometimes catches me out. They don’t give a toss! They are protected by their own delusion and lack of empathy. I thought it must be good to not care but then I think about the people they’ve hurt. I wouldn’t want to be someone who had no empathy even though they seem good in health.

I think it’s important to recognise that when we look back and reflect and regret the imperfect mother we were to our children that that act of introspection in itself is one of deep emotional intelligence and ongoing love.

Some people are unable to reflect, to be accountable and to take responsibility for their ‘choices’, behaviours and actions in the context it happened. And our evaluation and reframing is constantly ongoing if we are emotionally growing and not stuck in a brittle bitterness of shame and rage.

We should always start with self compassion and

remember Maya Angelou who said:

”I did then what I knew how to do. Now that I know better, I do better" which is often paraphrased as "Do the best you can until you know better. Then when you know better, do better".

Thats the very best we can do as mothers today. To accept and move on from our ‘choices’ then but to be more intentional in out parenting now. We (hopefully) still have the opportunity to be a better parent every day. I have ND children now in their 20s (I am also ND) - I had zero info back then about the environment they needed and my sometimes chaotic reactive and volatile home was not great. But since I have learned about ND, childhood trauma, etc I proactively bring this info to them. I can now help them heal or avoid pitfalls by being calm, informed, steady, available, attuned, humble - but it starts with self compassion and healing yourself so that they can sense this steady calm person available to them for the rest of their lives and not the twitchy, exhausted, reactive mother who was spinning inter generational emotional plates in a futile attempt to keep it all together. I have had 10 years now of re-growth and my children are benefiting from that and that’s priceless if you look at the relentless hope on here of middle aged posters devastated and in pain desperate to resolve and repair with their elderly parents.

Just by taking the first step of being on this thread demonstrates and awareness and willingness to be a better mother no matter what ages our DC.

That’s lovely and true. I can’t believe I am now middle aged (well 42) where on earth has all that time gone!

@Hirik that’s so helpful, thank you for sharing that. It means a lot, especially with the guilt I feel about the mistakes I made with DD2.