Anger issues in relationship

[Lassiedoggie]

Namechanged.

Late 40s. Been with DH a long time - teen/young adult kids. He’s always had something of a short fuse, but this is getting much worse as he gets older, and I am now feeling like our marriage will end if he doesn’t change his behaviour.

We’ve just come back from a very nice holiday. DH has returned to some pretty intense work stress - though nothing that won’t pass- and as a result he seems to be losing his shit with me over the tiniest things on a daily basis. Shouting and hurling insults, impersonating things I say. It’s awful, and I cannot cope any longer.

Our lovely teenage kids just eyeroll at him and we have calmly discussed that he’s ‘stressed’ right now, but this isn’t acceptable to me, and I think it is very damaging to them in what it models etc.

Obviously he doesn’t behave like this with his colleagues or friends. I think our mutual friends would be shocked and appalled if they could see him in one of his stupid rages.

It would be one thing if this were a ‘one off’ due to the work stress, but this type of episode is increasing. As I say, he’s always been prone to losing his temper quickly. However, when we were younger it was MUCH less frequent and he would apologise very quickly and cool down. Now he doesn’t seem to bother. I am not sure he cares about how he makes me (or the DC) feel anymore tbh.

Our marriage has been broadly pretty good over the years (as I say his outbursts used to be rare, and he used to treat me kindly and respectfully most of the time). But I am thinking our lives might only become harder and more stressful as we get older. I do not want to be a 70 year old woman being shouted at on a daily basis.

Can anyone relate to this? And has anyone’s DH taken steps to change - perhaps getting anger management help? DH has always said he’d be unwilling to have any therapy- he’s had challenges with his parents and siblings that have upset him greatly over the years, but flat out refused to talk to anyone about it. I sense it might be the ultimatum I need to issue though.

Sorry this is long, but I’d love to hear thoughts and advice.

This all sounds…. Horrible

especially for the teens growing up around all this

and I think it is very damaging to them in what it models etc.

understatement

and their mother to be putting up with it

When he shouts and you and impersonates you…. What do the teens do?

impersonating you? For that alone I’d have left

Get rid, it’s emotional abuse to you and your kids.

@Someiremember - yes it is horrible and that’s why I’m asking for advice.

DC are often not always present thankfully. But there have been times they have overheard. In those instances I have calmly tried to talk to them about it afterwards, and (I know this isn’t ok) have tried to excuse it by explaining why he is stressed. But increasingly I have said ‘of course it’s unacceptable to shout, and he shouldn’t’. They usually just say ‘don’t worry mum, it’s ok, we understand’. Not great.

Just to say, I am not sure I need lots of posts telling me to leave him and how awful this is. I do know that and will do that if things don’t change.

But equally, I’m not about to throw away a very long - and (in the past) generally happy marriage - without trying to fix it. So I’d love to hear from those who have faced similar, and if anything worked (or didn’t!)

This sounds so upsetting, OP. Hurling insults at you and belittling and mocking you isn’t love. And it’s increasing in frequency. If you don’t want to outright end things right now then you at least need to give the ultimatum and mean it: he engages, properly, in something like anger management and with a therapist of his own and one together - or the marriage is over. Does he swear at, shout at, and impersonate his colleagues when something hasn’t gone right? I bet not. Saying it happens because he’s frustrated is a cop out for him, it happens because he disrespects you - and that’s the quagmire to work on.

All children, but teens and young adults particularly, learn about what a healthy relationship looks like from their parents, and that informs their own templates for their adult relationships. It’s so important: DH and I have always acknowledged that neither of us have ever had a bad relationship or a bad partner - and we ascribe this to having both grown up with such good templates from our respective parents of what marriage and love should look like, and have therefore never gone down the path of accepting anger, arguing, aggression, name-calling or general dysfunction in our relationships as “just how relationships are sometimes.” Your DC are learning that accepting behaviour like their dad’s from a partner is normal - their “yeah, that’s just how dad is” eye rolling is showing that.

If you’d be devastated for one of your DC to be treated by a partner the way you are then be equally devastated for yourself and show yourself and them that rejecting it is the right thing to do.

I'm sorry that you're going through this. Stress might be a factor but it's not an excuse.

Are you able to tell him, calmly but assertively, that you find his behaviour unacceptable and will not tolerate it?

Remind him that he gives courtesy to strangers so does his partner and children not deserve that basic courtesy?

I find people get too comfortable with one another and, as a result, show their worst side to those they trust but it's not good.

Maybe he needs a reminder that you're there to support him but not to be used as a verbal punching bag.

If he needs an outlet, suggest a journal, the gym or something other than you and maybe point out he's being a less than stellar example to the children.

So what do you want?

he won’t do therapy
so you need to issue an ultimatum
although this is clear abuse so not sure a therapist will even work with you

there’s nothing else. You are married to a nasty nasty arsehole

What do they understand? Their father is impersonating their mother and hurling abuse at her?

Shouting and hurling insults, impersonating things I say.

Yeah fuck that, I'd have been out the first time any of this happened, no matter how long the marriage.

What's to fix here? He doesn't respect you, someone who did would never treat you like that. Why would you possibly want to stay with someone who treats you like you're a piece of shit on the bottom of his shoe?

Why do you think he will change? He has been like this your whole relationship- just getting worse and worse. He clearly doesn’t like you or love you - if he did then he wouldn’t do this. Why would you want to stay with an abusive man who is escalating?

Based on what youve written, personally I would be taking steps to leave. However, you've said that's not where you are at and that's your choice and should be respected. However, if there is even a hint of physical escalation, not even at you but throwing stuff, hitting walls then my answer changes to leave immediately.

If you feel there is still something to salvage I would first get therapy for yourself. Understand your boundaries, really explore the relationship and what you want out of it. If he doesn't change can you live with that? What level of anger would you put up with? I say this because without really understanding what you want and your boundaries you risk falling into the trap of throwing ultimatums, he tries for a bit, you slip back into old habits and each time he takes you less and less seriously and your power is eroded. I know a woman who is married to a cankerous old grouch and wont divorce him because she likes the comforts and just jollies him along as best as she can and has her own life. It's not what I'd choose but women are allowed to make their own choices.

Once you have worked through exactly what you will and won't tolerate, and if you have made the decision that leaving is an option if he doesnt follow through, get your ducks in a row. Knowing you can leave/ start a divorce will give you power to hold him to account.

Then have a come to jesus talk, if you can find a relationship therapist to do it with then great. Otherwise lay it all out. I will not accept being shouted at, I will not accept being mocked. I understand anger is a natural human emotion so when you feel it let's talk about solutions that work for us both ie you take yourself off to a seperate space. If you need another outlet like exercise or a hobby we can discuss making time for that. I love you let's move forward productively. If this doesn't work I am going to insist you do anger management. If you refuse, as if your right, then this marriage no longer works for me in its current set up and I will be taking steps to leave.

That's my advice if you do want to fight for it. However, explore if you've found yourself in a boiling frog situation. No one should be shouted at and mocked by their family, the person who swore to love, honour and cherish them.

Strongly suggest that DH gets a thorough health check with particular reference to the angry outbursts, likely high blood pressure, pain levels causing stress and inability to be tolerant.
Ask GP to help navigate DH calming his own reactions, being aware of his emotions and behaving in a civilised manner near all other humans.
Offer to accompany DH to the doctor and offer to be proactive with his treatment.

Are there any external factors causing stress to DH.
Suggest he eliminate those, one by one.

He’s angry and unwilling to seek therapy. He’s very comfortable being a domineering, nasty piece of work.
You’re an abused woman, nothing less.
Go seek therapy for you. Give yourself that gift to restore your identity, your strength . Build up your resilience, build up trust in yourself and above all, trust in your ability to carve out a more meaningful life without him circling your joy like a predatory vulture. When you build up resilience and rebuild your sense of self worth through therapy, you leave him (study your assets! Is there at least one decent pension? Do you own a property? Etc. Time to be pragmatic and begin to see how you can make an eventual and inevitable divorce work.).
There’s a woman named Dr. Emma Katz who I recommend to anyone in a marriage like yours. Google her! Also, listen to podcasts where she’s a guest.
Laura Richards, who hosts Crime Analyst, has a great, very recent episode on coercive control which I would say you, OP, should listen to. Do it while you’re cooking. Grab some headphones and listen… build up your resilience.
The fact that you’ve started this thread says you’re taking the very first steps in no longer accepting your husband’s shitty treatment of you. Go, you! Seriously! Kudos! Be proud of yourself.

My marriage had wonderful, outstanding moments. That didn’t make it a good marriage and those wonderful moments didn’t stop my ex-husband from ending up battering me. He’d previously never touched me! I couldn’t see it coming but when it did, everything made sense and fell into place: I was married to a man who loathed me for reasons I’ve accepted I’ll never know. The years of our long marriage were suddenly reduced to a flip book, showing me with such simple clarity and honesty the reality of my sham marriage. I’d lost years of my life to an abuser I couldn’t leave. I didn’t think I was abused. I didn’t know. I just thought I had a grumpy husband and I just had to wait for the better times. They were never going to come. And finally, in the most blunt and terrifying way, I understood who I was married to and that I and our children could end up dead.
Anger doesn’t diminish on its own. It expands. It consumes families.
It is so insidiously destructive.

The very fact he hurls abuse at and impersonates anyone let alone his wife and mother of his children means he’s fundamentally a nasty twat and no amount of marriage therapy or individual therapy is going to change that

@ComtesseDeSpair - thank you. Yes you are quite right - he doesn't behave this way with friends or colleagues (in fact most of our friends think he's a fun, lovely guy - and he can certainly be that, when he wants to be). You are also spot on about template modelling.

Unfortunately both DH and I didn't have the best examples ourselves - he went to boarding school from a young age and his parents are very difficult, he's not close to them at all. Both my parents are dead and both and had a history of addiction and mental illness. I am sure that I am far from perfect to be married to (none of us are) but the difference is that I understand the impact a screwy upbringing has, unlike DH who just seems to bury stuff. I have had therapy (this aligns with your brilliant and kind advice @Firstsuggestions , thank you) and have worked on myself not to impart my own issues onto our kids - as far as I can, at least. That's part of my resentment towards DH I think - why do I take all the accountability, and he just behaves (badly) as he chooses?

And fwiw, our kids ARE happy and thriving - doing very well at school/uni, with lovely friendships and my eldest is in a respectful, secure relationship with their partner. But increasingly I feel like raising them well is down to me.

@FluffyWabbit - thank you so much also. I have used those exact words to him 'don't use me as your verbal punchbag'. Weirdly if anything he has been exercising more than ever over the past year and has actually said it helps his stress levels! He's SO un-self aware. But in answer to your question, if I tell him his behaviour is unacceptable, which I often do, he will sometimes apologise and promise to 'try', but more often than not he will aggressively say stuff like 'oh yes it's all my fault isn't it?! What have I done wrong now?!' Nothing seems to change.

@MadameCholetsDirtySecret - the point is, he hasn't always been like this. Maybe he would overreact to a disagreement, or take his stress out on me once or twice a year. He would always apologise quickly and profusely, explain his reaction, try to make it up to me. The rest of the time he would be what I think most of us would call a 'good husband'. Loving and caring towards me and the DC. Doing masses around the house etc. Respectful. But it's changed. Not out of the blue before someone suggests he's having an affair - but an increase in shitty behaviour since his early 40s. Part of this is down to his career stagnating a bit, I think, and we've had some financial worries over the past few years. But nothing massive and nothing we cannot navigate.

@user1492757084 - he recently had a basic health check at work and came out quite well, though interestingly his BP was a little high - not enough to medicate though, they just said 'keep an eye on it'. Can BP issues make you bad tempered?! I also wonder about declining hormones at his age - though quite honestly, I lean towards thinking 'fuck you' on that front - as I'm navigating menopause and I'm sure that's a lot worse. I don't behave like a total dick though 😂

in a calm sea there can be an undertow, ie, he can go to therapy and mimic being a normal, kind husband when beneath this fascade the resentment is festering and growing

@DorisTheFinkasaurus - I am so sorry you went through that, and I hope you are leading a more peaceful life now. DH has never been physically violent towards me, though he has slammed doors a couple of times, which I find appalling.

If I am honest over the past few years I have made deadlines in my own mind whenever there is a pattern of bad behaviour - 'if I still feel this way next summer/after DC's exams/after Christmas I will ask him to leave'. Or I've thought 'let's just get through this stressful thing and see how things are.' But it's difficult to action when it's not bad all the time (and we do still have very good times where he returns to behaving the man l fell in love with all those years ago).

It's just that the past few days he's been a c**t every. single. day. It's work related for him I know, but we are JUST back from holiday. I know that can make things worse (post holiday blues etc), but on the flip side - we've just had a lovely time away with our lovely DC. We had the means to do that, unlike so many. We are all healthy, unlike so many. Isn't that bigger picture stuff? Shouldn't it be making him realise what's important?

I have to get on with some work now so forgive me if I go quiet. But I will continue to read all responses.

I would love to hear if anyone has dealt with a similar situation, and what happened. Also, if anyone has any recommendations for therapists please DM me. In all honesty and without meaning to sound arrogant, I think this something DH needs to fix and change himself with external help. I am not saying I am perfect, but I have dealt with a lot of my own shit with therapy. I am not sure relationship counselling is what we need.

I stayed far too long in a marriage like yours. He kept promising to get anger management therapy but never did. He ended up kicking the shit out of me in front of my youngest.

He CAN control his behaviour as evidenced by not behaving like this around colleagues / others etc

the problem is he is permitting himself to behave like this to you and in front of the kids

a good therapist would not see you together, as one of you is emotionally abusive to the other,

if he seeks therapy - unlikely, it would have to be a therapist willing and able to call him out on abusive behaviour not collude with it by allowing him to vent all the reasons why he does it

the best way forward would for him to engage with the 2 day intensive programme for men - perpetrators of emotional abuse FREEDOM PROGRAMMe

suggest this to him - this will tell you everything you need to know about how much responsibility he is willing to accept regarding his behaviour

“We had the means to do that, unlike so many. We are all healthy, unlike so many. Isn't that bigger picture stuff? Shouldn't it be making him realise what's important?”

I’ll be dead honest- I’m always reluctant to write or talk about our own lifestyle for fear of sounding boastful but, my ex and I had everything: the great holidays, the German cars on the drive, great food and a wife who loved cooking it; health, wealth, and if not happiness then at least an idea of it. These trappings can excuse so much. Reality’s sharp edges are blunted by life’s creature comforts and the safety of having disposable income. That’s my own personal experience anyway. We can’t understand why a person in that marriage, especially one where the lifestyle is a good one, isn’t appreciating the good stuff, the abundant blessings, the plenty that so many others can only dream of having. These are men who don’t understand gratitude because they’re in total lockstep with their own inflated sense of entitlement. The world owes them. Humility is lost on them. Appreciation is an on-the-surface experience. The way he treats you shows you that Big Picture stuff matters not a jot to him. He doesn’t at all value the life he has. Isn’t that terribly sad? And perhaps the questions you ought to ask him are: Do you value this? Do you value me?

Is there enough there to fight for? You have to wonder, with honesty. And trust that you’re the best judge of that. 💐

Life is way too short to put up with this shit