Silly argument - who is unreasonable

[Wiennetta]

Argument which I think has blown out of proportion! Can someone give me some perspective? Should I have apologised?

I got home at 10:45pm from meeting friends, DH works shifts and had been on early shifts but was not working the next day.

He knew I was going out - just casual local drinks with friends. He didn’t ask me what time I would be home or anything in advance and didn’t text me when I was out to check in.

When I got home he was grumpy and ranting about doing all the night time chores (taking the dog out and closing the blinds etc). He didn’t say hello or ask how I was or anything.

It became apparent that he was pissed off that I was out late. He said he wanted to get an early night and said if he had known that it would be 10:45 by the time I got back, he would have gone to sleep earlier.

I said I’m entitled to go out and if he wanted to know what time I was going to be home he could have asked. I didn’t know in advance the time I would be home as it was just drinks with friends.

This had escalated as now - the next morning - he’s still pissed because apparently I ‘never apologise’ and I should have just said sorry for keeping him up. He said if I just apologised everything would have been fine.

He said it’s fine to apologise for things that aren’t your fault (like, sorry I just trod on your toe). I said if I come home and he’s grumpy and rude I don’t immediately feel like apologising.

Are we both unreasonable? I struggle to know as I don’t feel like I did anything wrong but I also agree sometimes just apologising even if something isn’t your fault helps the situation.

Thanks so much for all the replies. Just digesting everything but thought I’d quickly respond to posters asking if he’s generally controlling about seeing friends etc.

He’s not, the issue isn’t me socialising and seeing friends. He is protective of his sleep as he works shifts and I do understand that sleep is important. But I think it’s on him to check in what time I’ll be home or decide if he’s going to sleep before I get home. I did actually send him a message 30 mins before I got home to say I was leaving soon and wouldn’t be long (this was at 10:20) so it’s not like I went off the radar or anything. I don’t always know how long I’ll be out - surely it’s normal if you meet friends for a drink you don’t know exactly what time you’ll be home? Sometimes you might just meet for an hour or two and sometimes a bit longer depending on how the chat is going and how everyone is feeling.

I do think he has form for playing the victim and pushing responsibility on me for his bad moods or stress.

I'm an arsehole with my sleep, DH knows it and does everything he can to ensure nothing is interrupted or delayed 🤣

However, "playing the victim and pushing responsibility on me for his bad moods or stress" is not nice to live with.

No, you have nothing to apologise for. Is this part of a pattern?

We don’t know that he has a usual bedtime or that she was out much later than it. The OP states that the issue was that he wanted an early night. He didn’t inform her of said early night beforehand, nor was she keeping him from it.

So, yes, I do think it’s weird that you think the onus is on her to anticipate all this, as opposed to him just dropping her a text and asking. And, now that he’s stropping about, you think the onus is on her to apologise.

I’m still entirely unclear as to where and how she, as part of said couple, is being unreasonable.

That doesn’t really make sense. How does you being out affect his sleep? If he’s so protective of it, why didn’t he just go to bed?

Well I don’t think it makes sense either - I would have expected him to go to sleep if he wanted to.

If he was out - assuming I knew he was OK etc - I would just go to bed if I wanted to.

He was annoyed with me for keeping him up, but I think it’s his responsibility to ask what time I’ll be home, or just go to bed if he wanted to go to bed. He was then separately annoyed at me that I didn’t apologise for disrupting his sleep.

Well I don’t think it makes sense either - I would have expected him to go to sleep if he wanted to.

Have you said this to him? If so, what’s his response?

You didn’t disrupt his sleep. He decided not to go to bed. Blaming you for that is so nuts, that I’m having difficulty believing this isn’t a control tactic. Particularly as you really don’t seem to realise how nuts it is.

I did say to him he should have just gone to sleep. I think he basically accepts he should have been more assertive to check what time I’d be home and/or just crack on and go to sleep when he wants. But then he was annoyed that I hadn’t apologised (he basically said I should apologise even if it wasn’t my fault). I would be more up for apologising if he had been calm and polite when I got home - I could have just said ‘oh sorry if you were waiting up, I hadn’t realised you wanted an early night’. But because he was grumpy and moody when I got home, I didn’t feel particularly like being the one to make peace (when I felt like I hadn’t done anything wrong).

Ask him why, though. I’m not sure if this is the case with you, but often posters on MN seem wholly incapable of (or unwilling to) having adult conversations with their partners. Genuinely ask him.

• Why didn’t he just go to sleep?
• Why did he wait up for you if he didn’t want to?
• Why does he think he’s entitled to an apology even though he agrees you did nothing wrong?
• Why does he think he’s gets to be grumpy and moody with you when he’s the one behaving irrationally?

You’re going ‘he says X’. You aren’t required to accept any of that without an explanation. Do not seek to placate, require that you are treated with respect and consideration.

I’m not sure what you have to apologise for. Very passive aggressive but what would you have said ‘I’m sorry that you didn’t take the initiative and either go to bed or text/call me to find out what time I’d be home’

As for having to do all the night time chores, I presume you do them with no complaining when he’s either at work or sleeping?

We did have a conversation along the lines you’re suggesting, and he agreed he should have gone to sleep when he wanted. He basically said that next time he would go to sleep or be more proactive in checking in on times with me. That was said in a bit of a huff though. He does go to therapy and he does ask himself ‘why’ he reacts in a certain way. But he maintains that I should have apologised - even though he accepts it’s not my fault. I can see an apology would de-escalate things but I don’t feel like apologising when I come home and he’s using weaponised moodiness on me.

I do all the night time chores on any day he is working (he’s either in bed so early it’s too early to take the dog for a walk etc or he’s home so late that it’s all been done). If we are both in we tend to split, someone take the dog out and someone switch off lights, do any small chores like put the dishwasher on etc.

He had to close the blinds and walk the dog! The horror!

What a damn crybaby. He could have checked in with you rather than waiting up.

I wouldn't be apologizing. He's being ridiculous. It wasn't like you were out till 5 in the morning and stumbling in drunk.

Does he get huffy every time you go out?

Set up a sulk corner for him. This is absurd.

I don’t feel like you’re really engaging with what I’m saying, OP.

I hope it works out.

He had to close the blinds, switch the lights off AND let the dog out without any help? I hope he had a lie in and an extra nap today to recover, the poor lamb.

I love the closing of the blinds being a big night time job. By his definition of a job I reckon I must do 20,000 jobs a day.
Leave him to his tanty, you've done nothing wrong. Don't apologise, that's a slippery slope of you bowing down to him for a peaceful life every time he decides he's grumpy.

Was he waiting for you to get him in his PJs and read him a bedtime story? Why can't he get himself off to bed and leave a note saying he was tired etc. Sounds like he was just looking for a reason to start an argument.

I don't understand this OP. What was stopping him from going to bed? Why did the time you return from a night out have any bearing on that?

I think she’s being slightly rigid with her husband. Her response is about how she’s right, and he’s wrong / being unreasonable. Rather than approaching the issue with curiosity and compassion. So as a couple they are not solving the issue relationally they are getting entrenched in who is right and who is wrong.

He is wrong/being unreasonable. He’s being grumpy and rude, has told her that he thinks she should apologise (despite acknowledging that she has nothing to apologise for), and has form for playing the victim and pushing responsibility on me for his bad moods or stress (verbatim).

If you believe that she should approach what appears to be abusive behaviour ‘with curiosity and compassion’ and is being ‘rigid’ and unreasonable for not doing so, then I believe you have an extremely unhealthy idea of what a relationship should look like.

As I’ve said, if it’s part of a pattern abuse then that would be different but the OP would need to give more evidence to demonstrate this. Being grumpy and unreasonable on occasion isn’t abuse. We’re only getting a tiny snapshot here of a no doubt long and complex relationship. We all have our issues and lots of these can be worked out relationally. Relationships can be a brilliant conduit for maturation and personal development if both parties have that vulnerability and motivation. That’s certainly what I’ve found in my relationship.

He’s an absolute twat.

He is unreasonable because he can ask or going to bed.
You are unreasonable to reasoning to him why he is having a tantrum. He is just having it because you went out and he did not.

She doesn’t need to ‘give evidence’. It’s a Mumsnet post. She’s said he has form for it, so we (at least, those of us who don’t bend over backwards to excuse poor male behaviour) believe her.