Alcoholic gaslighting husband refuses to talk to me - how to tell him I want to separate?

[Seaside1234]

Just that really - have quite abruptly come to the full realisation of how my alcoholic husband is gaslighting me. I’ve asked him twice via text to set aside time to talk to me, and been very firmly pushed back twice. We can’t go on like this, the atmosphere at home is horrendous and will be affecting our kids. Is it ever acceptable to bring up separation via text? I am late-diagnosed autistic, and find direct confrontation/expression of anger difficult due to this and how I was raised. I also suspect I will be accused of ambushing him if I try to talk to him directly without warning.

Married 18 years, DC 16 and 12. H had an affair about 8 years ago, I stayed because I believed we could improve things. Now he’s basically having an affair with alcohol. I support us more or less completely financially and practically. Money shouldn’t be a problem for me if we split, but I suspect significant debt I don’t know about.

Ty for any thoughts on what to do next.

Write a letter and leave it for him. He can read it in his own time. If he refuses to read it, email it to him.
Do you have a plan for what happens after he reads it?

See a solicitor.

Get solicitor to write to him.

@ponygirlcurtiswell, I’m fully anticipating him being very angry, which I will just have to let happen. But that’s a good question - I’ve become so fixed on how to tell him that I’m not sure what I’d do next! Ask him to move out, I guess, and tell him we both need a solicitor to agree terms. My hope would be to buy him out of the house.

Start the divorce online.

I think the phrase 'getting your ducks in a row' applies here. Have a plan. Talk to a solicitor. Make plans for separating that involve him leaving but know what you will do next if he refuses (which sounds like is a real possibility). Be a step ahead.

If he gets angry, will you be safe?

You file for divorce. You don't need, and won't get, his cooperation. Just make sure you protect yourself if you think he could get (more) abusive.
Be prepared to call police to get him to leave.
Take care of yourself. He's had his chances, it seems to me.

It’s the telling him that I’m struggling with - even if I file for divorce, I’ll still have to tell him that! I can’t win, he won’t make time to talk to me, but will accuse me of ambushing him if I text/write/somehow get up the courage to speak to him without prior warning. He’s very deep in denial.

Yes, I think I would be safe.

See a solicitor first before you speak to him. Get your paperwork in order - copies of anything financial etc, solicitor will be able to advise you. There's no point in trying to have a reasonable conversation or negotiate with an alcoholic. You'll just have to present him with the facts - "this marriage is over and you need to leave".

Where is the gaslighting?

You don't have to tell him if he refuses to listen. Your solicitor will serve the divorce papers.
There's no discussion or argument to be had.

Get legal advice first.

It doesn’t matter if your H says he feels ‘ambushed’. It’s probable he will be unhappy about however you handle things, so focus on what is best for you and the DC.

your H is unlikely to agree to leave the house.

@MemorableTrenchcoathe says he doesn’t have a drink problem, he’s just trying to find some kind of enjoyment in life as I’m so miserable to be with. Hasn’t contributed to the mortgage or bills in over five years, is usually out drinking 4-6 nights a week, goes out with friends, off to London for a gig next week. Complains that he can’t get any work. Tells me to leave him alone as he can’t think about this kind of stuff on top of being worried about work and money. While I completely support us financially as a family.

Sounds like he’s telling you lies, and/or minimising things, but that’s not gaslighting.

I think it's fine to tell him in a text message. You've tried to tell him face to face, but he's shut it down. It's on him if he doesn't like the mode of delivery.

Not really here to argue about that - there is a long background of me being told I’m responsible for many of his problem behaviours, to the extent I believed it and was constantly trying to work out how I could make things better for him by changing myself and my behaviour, rather than what was best for me and the children

It's like you think you need his permission to talk to him. You don't. If he says you're ambushing him, just say, 'Yes, I am.' It's OK if he thinks you are ambushing him. If you're getting divorced, that's the least of your problems.

The more pressing issue is, why do you assume he will move out? Why would he? I think if you are the one who wants to separate, you need to accept that you might need to be the one to leave.

Really @MemorableTrenchcoat ? That’s what you’re taking out of the OP’s posts.

Say to him “I need to talk to you about separating. If you won’t make time to do that, then we can do it through solicitors. I don’t mind either way. But either way, it is happening.”

So what if he accuses you of ambushing him. You don’t need his permission for anything - even divorcing him.

I wish you luck op. He sounds like a prince amongst men.

He's abusive, a cocklodger and an alcoholic. Has he ever been physically violent? Are you scared for your safety if you tell him? As others have said you don't need a conversation with him this will just drag it all out as he'll try to win you back or talk you out of it. As above- solicitor, RL support from friends and family and file for divorce. You must get away from him asap. I wouldn't do anything face to face, what's the point? At most a brief email or letter; I want a divorce, you'll be hearing from my lawyer. I wouldnt even tell him why- he knows!!

Yes. Gaslighting is a very specific, insidious type of use, but the term is becoming meaningless due to being used to describe almost any dishonest behaviour.

He’s made me feel like I must be wrong, that his behaviour is perfectly reasonable and the problem is all in my head. If that’s not gaslighting, fine, I’m not here to quibble about terminology. It’s a well recognised behaviour of addicts.

“DH, I am finding it very challenging to continue to live with you and it’s time for a break from each other. I need you to move out for a while”.

This is all you need to say.

@Seaside1234 massive squishes.

stop trying to converse with someone that won’t engage for starters.

secondly - as the M’net saying goes - get your ducks in a row. Instead of waiting for him to discuss with you - YOU decide what you want to happen. Get advice. Start talking to others to make plans.

Do you need to preempt any possible aggressive or destructive (verbal or physical - even if aimed at doors and walls rather than you) tendencies he might have when he realises this is really happening?

Do you need to collect evidence of his financial contributions or lack off?

Do you want to secure passports, birth certificates and financial paperwork or any valuables elsewhere?

Definitely speak to solicitors asap. Don’t stick with first one. Contact at least 3.

Is it worth advising your children’s school that things are going on so they are aware of any issues?

how are you financially? Do you need to start putting some money aside on store cards (like Sainsbury’s etc) so you have something to fall back on in a worst case situation. If so I’d advise little and often.

make a note of any access he has to savings, banks, utility companies etc.

change passwords on devices.

good luck.

He doesn't have to like what you do. Your days of trying to please or placate him are over. You want to separate and divorce so go ahead with it however you please. He doesn't have to agree or like it.

What you need to do is to understand your rights and the paperwork needed to divorce. A solicitor is a great place to start but basically you need a divorce (to legally separate), a financial order (to legally separate finances) and a child order (to legally separate kids). You can avoid the child order if you think you can be amicable about custody but don't skip the financial order.

You'll need to know the basics of when you married, names, dates of birth etc.. for the divorce part. For the financial order you need to know what you own - houses, cars, money, savings, pensions and what you owe. For pensions you need to contact the pension companies and get statements - you just tell them you are getting divorced and need the right statement) and that can take some time. Then you need to know what you are asking for. The basic starting point is 50:50 split with the intent to leave neither party destitiute. The money is then further considered in light of who is having the kids more (hence now needing a child order). The aim is to ensure that the kids don't lose out. You can start all this paperwork without telling him and then give him a fait accompli with paperwork to sign if you prefer.

Either way he's going to shout and yell and moan and cry and make your life difficult. The trick is not to care. All you want is a divorce, not to make him happy anymore. Just text him. "As you won't make time to speak to me I am telling you by text, I want a divorce and will be making an appointment with a solicitor next week. You might want to meet one yourself and if you choose to get one please let me know so I can tell mine who to contact." Then proceed with paperwork.

Of course it's easier if you can be civil, mediate, etc.. but sounds like that ship has long sinced sailed so best just to crack on and ignore him.

So do you have a joint account now? Can you see how much he's spending on himself each week?

What makes you suspect debt? Are there things he's buying that you can't account for financially?

Have you done a credit check on yourself? I'm not sure whether you can do one on him but if it's possible, I'd definitely do it.

Do have some family that could be there to support you and just incase he gets abusive?

Dont schedule time. Just be waiting or get home when you know he will be, with someone, and just say “husband I want a divorce I need you to pack a bag and find somewhere to stay”