So sad ....... a good man, but (sorry a bit long)

[MargoLivebetter]

I'm in my mid 50s. Been in a relationship for about 5 years now with DP. We are both financially independent, have our own place, do lots of nice things together, share interests, go on great holidays. He is consistent, generous, reliable, interesting and I find him physically attractive, which is nothing short of a miracle by the time you get to your mid-50s. We don't live together.

I have two early 20s children and a medium sized family who I see regularly. He has no children, one surviving parent and an estranged sibling who is 14 years younger than him. One of my DC still lives at home and the other lives in a shared house with friends, but comes home reasonably frequently.

Part of the reason we don't live together is that when we discussed it seriously, I said that it was really important to me that wherever I lived my children would always have a place to stay. Their father is a complete tool and they definitely are not welcome to stay with him, so I want them to feel that there is a home for them with me. My eldest is autistic and does now have a decent job with career prospects but still needs a fair bit of support with personal admin and just life generally. I see that DC living independently but not quite yet. DP said that whilst he'd always be happy to welcome both my DC into a shared home, it would have to be on a strictly time limited basis. I found that very off-putting and it made me decide to continue living in my own home.

I'm increasingly noticing that he has huge difficulties sharing people and is very insular. He doesn't like sharing his remaining parent with the step-parent and always prefers to meet them alone. Part of the reason I think he is estranged from his sibling is because he went from being an only child, who was clearly the apple of his parents' eye to having to share that attention. And he dislikes sharing me, not with friends and he isn't trying to isolate me, but sharing me with my family and particularly my children. He is incredibly reluctant to join in with my larger family events and more often than not will have other commitments that seem to prevent him from coming to birthday celebrations and so on. Obviously, with only one remaining family member that he sees at all, it is not something that happens much in his life.

He reiterated this weekend how important it was for him that we spend time together "alone". I don't disagree but we already spend every second weekend together alone and we also spend every holiday we go on "alone". For me it is important that he can be part of my family, which he definitely isn't at all. He sits on the outside dipping in very, very occasionally. I felt so profoundly sad when he said his alone thing again this weekend and I'm still trying to process it.

I can't change him, the only thing I can change is my approach and my response. I am a post-therapy people pleaser. My first instinct is to want to "fix" this by giving him more alone time, but my post-therapy self knows that this is not the solution. What I'm not entirely sure is how to tackle the issue, if it is even worth tackling, or if I accept that to have a relationship with him, this is how it has to be.

Thoughts welcome!

@Impostersyndicate we see each other every weekend and sometimes during the week. He hasn't asked to see me more frequently.

I don't know, if you're only alone together every other weekend and holidays, I can see his point. He is sharing you if he's giving you plenty of time to see them.

I'd rather not spend time with DP's family and friends. They're perfectly pleasant, but they're his people and I'm not particularly confident socially, I'd rather he saw them without me and gave me some downtime. It's nothing to do with not wanting to share him.

I also wouldn't be at all keen to share my home with someone else's adult DC, but agree my DC will always be welcome here, which is why I won't ever live with DP, but then as a woman in her 50s with her own home, I don't know why you'd want to merge homes and finances!

I am someone who really likes their alone time. I am also someone who as an adult had to endure my mother's partner, who was jealous of my mother's relationship with me and made that felt many many times. On the basis of both, I agree with PPs that you and your bf are not compatible.

My mother's partner isolated her from her family. He would sit at family events looking uncomfortable and bored, and tried to get my mother to leave as soon as possible. Everyone was gritting their teeth trying to be friendly for my mother's sake, but every single family member had at least one story of the condescending things he would say that showed how he looked down on them. He also made it clear on occasion when I visited that my presence was merely tolerated. He thought my mother "coddled" me (actually, we were just very close), and he really resented her focus on me, and then later my childen. He was a very self-aborbed, selfish person.

My mother was not a pushover and fought with him about this but looking back, I realize my mother and I did a lot of placating and centralizing him to keep him happy so that we could keep seeing each other without him skulking around scowling and being difficult. It was bloody awful, actually.

When my mother died, I stopped seeing him, he made one shitty comment too many and that was that. I look back and see that 25-year relationship in my life as being one of the most difficult and unpleasant relationships that I ever had in my life.

As PPs have said, you can't change someone, especially not someone already in their 50s. Don't live together, he will eventually do to you and your DC what my mother's partner did to my mother, me, and her entire family of origin.

What a shame …

I do think the grandchild point needs highlighting.

Even if your own children don’t have children, the fact that you’re close to your family is likely to mean other small family members becoming important to you over the years. Plenty of child free mature adults spend years of their lives hosting the family toddlers, primary schoolers, or young adults for weekends or parts of vacations. You would be giving up any prospect of that if you acceded to his isolationist preferences.

How does your children feel about this man? Do they have a good and comfortable relationship with him? It sounds like he just wants them out of the way so he can have you all to himself, that has got to be quite hurtful for your kids and you. I couldn't imagine being with a man who felt like that towards my kids, regardless of their age.

At the moment he is complaining about your lack of alone time yet your spending every 2nd weekend with him, going on holidays with him and you may be seeing him the odd night also. He is not willing to attend family events with you and always has an excuse not to attend.

I think that you have realised that your relationship is all about him and what he wants. To me relationships required give and take. It's not just about what suits him now and in the future. You don't want to be turning down going to family events because he won't attend.
Then something happens one of your kids and they need to live with you until they get a new apartment or get on there feet again. Meanwhile he is there moaning or perhaps making snide remarks to your adult child.
What happens if you have grandkids and they call around with there parents or they ask you to do some childcare for say 2-3 days a week?

I think that you have realised that your not going to be happy with this situation long term. If he did not want to get married or have kid's that was his decision. He can't expect in his 50's to have a relationship that will just suit him, his life and that a woman will agree to all this.

In your situation I would just tell him that you have decided to end things with him as it's clear you both want different things long term.

He is not closed off to discussion and hates being seen as "unreasonable", so that might give me a bit of leverage.

Does he hate being unreasonable or does he hate being been seen as unreasonable?

The difference looks subtle but it's rather deep. If he hates being unreasonable then he realises that sometimes he is, but wants to be better. If he hates being seen as unreasonable, then it's about what other people think of him not about genuinely trying to be reasonable, and once he is really secure with you he will stop trying to put a mask on. How well do you know him? What happens when you say No to him?

Fwiw I don't want to get into accusations of selfishness, but I think your children come first by some way and I think that his general unwillingness for you to have close relationships with others than him just isn't okay. In the long term you'll likely find yourself isolated. Don't underestimate the power of unspoken disapproval when you're living with it long term.

MIL was in a relationship with a man like this
Older than her from a wealthy family and while he did have grown up DC of his own he didn't have much of a relationship with them. He wasn't too bad until we had DC (so did SIL) and he really didn't like us visiting or MIL visiting us and he struggled to tolerate ordinary child type noise.
He got worse as he got older and didn't want to spend any time with anyone except MIL and resented her time with anyone else, it was more difficult because it was his house (although MIL had paid for renovations)
She ended up leaving him

What will happen if you have grandchildren. He will have to share you even more.

I am also mid 50s. Here is my take:

You're getting on pretty well, you fancy each other, he wants more of you...it sounds to me as if you are in a pretty sunny position. He needs reassurance. you need flexibility. Talk to each other! My biggest fuckups happened due to lack of communication.

My suggestion would be, invite him to family stuff out of courtesy but don't expect him to go, and reassure him that you are very fond of him (or that you love him, if you use the word love) however that you will be seeing your family as much as it suits you to, and you need a little give and take from him.

I hope it all works out. At our age we all come with baggage and broken dreams, routines and eccentricities. It can still be beautiful.

Don’t lose the clarity you have gained via therapy. He's being honest and transparent with you. Only you can decide if his attitude is a dealbreaker or not.

@Snoken the DC have a low bar to compare him with as their own father is so dreadful. They don't have particularly strong feelings about him. He does engage in constructive career discussions with them, which they have really appreciated. He buys them gifts for Christmas and birthday and they are appreciative there too.

@DucklingSwimmingInstructress that is a good distinction and definitely worth considering. I am not entirely sure if it is the perception of unreasonableness or the actual being unreasonable itself. I will have to give that some thought. I very much take on board your point about the power of unspoken disapproval. As an empathetic person, I am far to attuned to that and I will hear the unspoken loud and clear. However, I can definitely say 'no' and we had worked to compromises on plenty of things.

He genuinely isn't a selfish arsehole. He is generous and often very considerate. He always puts a great deal of thought into my birthday and Christmas gifts and is happy to treat me and is a kind person generally. He has very long standing friendships with nice people. I wouldn't have been with him that long if there weren't lots of positives to him I guess I am looking at the future and seeing all the questions that so many of you have raised and asking them too.

Thank you @chatelai . I do feel like we have more talking to do.

Given the alternatives out there, this seems a reasonably pleasant situation.

I wouldn’t bet on him becoming more integrated into the family. He sounds kind and polite to your children, which is reasonable. In his shoes I wouldn’t see the point in visiting your extended family with you, either. It’s too forced and try-hard. He neither wants nor needs them in his life.

If this arrangement isn’t working for you, break it off. But no need to make him out as somehow deficient or uncooperative.

Your relationship with your adult children is totally normal - we no longer have any living at home but they pop in frequently, help themselves from the fridge and generally treat this house as their home, because it always will be.

Your partner just doesn't get this as he doesn't have children or a close relationship with his wider family. He has shown that he has no wish to be involved with your family events as your partner.

It sounds like you're incompatible as your circumstances aren't going to change and you'll probably end up feeling very resentful of his lack of involvement. I'd also be wary of him insisting that you need time alone, more than you have already. Does he expect you to spend every weekend at his house? Or ask your DC to vacate your house when he's there?

It's good that you've realised this. Ultimately, he sounds like he has a few issues.

My step-dad is like this, he has some good qualities however my DM is now old with healt issues and isolated hours away from her DC.

Also, so set parameters te your autistic DC is definitely OK.

I'd be looking for someone more suitable.

@Endofyear no he doesn't expect me to spend every weekend at his and nor does he ask that the DC vacate my house. However, when he is at mine, he has a tendency to mention the importance of time alone together, which I can only take to mean time without my DC being present.

He manages two wider family events per year. I'm less fussed about those, but I do find his refusal to change any plans he has made to attend a family birthday celebration or special occasion not being in the spirit of being a partner.

Is he asking for alone time because he doesn’t see enough if you or because he wants you all to himself?

If you lived together, would the extra time as a couple be enough?

Imo it’s reasonable to say you don’t want to live with someone else’s adult children. Autism can be a scary word.

See this doesn't seem unreasonable to me at all.

Of course he wants to spend time just the two of you, it would be much worse if he didn't and it doesn't sound like you live in each other's pockets.

Why would you expect anyone to cancel plans? I don't let people down, it would need to be something huge for me to cancel something to attend your family gathering, but equally if I'd said yes to you first, I wouldn't cancel you for anyone else. Maybe he just isn't very comfortable at these dos, but it sounds like he will attend them, with enough notice, for you, even though they're not really his thing.

And yes to this.

Your post is very lucid, OP: I'm sure you know your answers. Good luck with everything 💐

well, it’s not in “your” spirit of being a partner. Which is fine, but so is his approach.

I have encountered my childfree SO’s extended family a handful of times at weddings, Boxing Day, over five years or so, and we’re cordial, but zero desire to spend my precious leisure time attending kiddie parties or general get togethers on random weekends. He attends as he sees fit. I do my own thing and vice versa.

Hé sounds perfect.

Maybe like me hé is an introvert. I find the noise and busy ness of family célébrations overwhelming sô préfèr to meet one to one.

Hé comes from a small family and grew up as an only child.

It's nothing sinister. Enjoy your time together and keep your separate places.

I'm a similar age to you, OP. I would have made the same decision that you did with regards to your adult children; they will always have a home with me if needed and I would also priorotise them over a romantic relationship every time.

'He'd always be happy to welcome both my DC into a shared home, it would have to be on a strictly time limited basis.' Yikes. Well, you made the right decision back then to stay in your own home.

I would definitely find the estrangement from the sibling and the only seeing his surviving parent alone (without the step-parent present) concerning - and possibly controlling. I would want to know more about the reason for his estrangement from the sibling for sure.

You are at a crossroads and the only way forward for your relationship would be either you accept his terms or for him to change (unlikely as he hasn't changed for anyone else).

Ultimately, being with someone who has 'terms' wouldn't be for me so I would be ending it at this point and focusing my energy on my garden, a good book or something.

Just my take on things. All the best, OP.

@MargoLivebetter "I very much take on board your point about the power of unspoken disapproval. As an empathetic person, I am far to attuned to that and I will hear the unspoken loud and clear. However, I can definitely say 'no' and we had worked to compromises on plenty of things."

My mother was a very empathetic person, so for her, the battle against her partner's unspoken (and sometimes spoken) disapproval of her family was both external (from him) AND herself, because she was raised to be a people pleaser and to centralise men. So the battle was on two fronts, and it was exhausting for her.

The battle was also unrelenting. It arose not only when we actually interacted with her physically but also any time she mentioned us, or received an email/text/call from us and wanted to share it with him. He could not contain himself from making derogatory comments, or sniffing condescendingly, or pointedly not saying anything. She either had to argue with him, not talk to him about her family, or - her go-to - constantly try to put family members in a favorable light so that he would approve of them and stop being such a dick.

@Supersimkin7 had an important question: "Is he asking for alone time because he doesn’t see enough if you or because he wants you all to himself?"

It's important because the latter indicates possessiveness, a patriarchal sense of ownership over you that leads to competitiveness with your DC for your affection and time. You've already mentioned that he has trouble sharing his other loved ones with others, so it does sound like he feels possessive over you.

If he does, you should not move in with him, because he will alienate you from your family over time, no matter how you try to resist his unspoken disapproval. It happened to my mother, and she was the most family oriented person I ever met.

Good points @LouiseMadetheBestBroccoliPasta . With regards to @Supersimkin7 's question. He wants time for us to be together alone because he wants to be on his own with me, not because he wants more time with me.

He is an introvert, a bit of a loaner, although like I have said is sociable and has very good, long-standing friends. However, there is undoubtedly an element of possessiveness there too and he wants all of me in our time together. As a Mum, sister, daughter, I have years of practice at being there for lots of people and have no difficulty accommodating all the people who I love in my life and my affections. He has never had to do that and doesn't know how and may never do.

You have such incompatible attitudes to family that I think the only way this relationship could work is if it were quite casual. As you're already struggling with the number of family events he'll attend even now, with you still not living together and being quite independent, I don't think you're going to be able to manage that.