Social services after alleged DV

[Emrose88]

Hi,
I just wanted to get some advice. A couple of days ago me and my partner got into a row in which the police was called by a neighbour and had told them he had kicked in my head Infront of my children- this did not happen at all and other people in the house to witness this. However when the police came round they was question the adults in the house Infront of the children about the allegations. My youngest (4 year old) hears absolutely everything. My partner has been NFA'd but a DVPO has been set for a breather. Today social services came round and question my children and my 4 year old told her that I was kicked in the head but this is because she heard what the police was saying, my eldest daughter (8) told the social worker that did not happen and it was an argument but the social worker kept dismissing her and wouldn't let her talk as she just wanted to listen to my youngest. Can SW even be asking my 4 year old things like that. I would have thought that they would have been spoken to separately. Now I'm made to look like a liar as the SW didn't speak to me after and just left so I could say that's what the police were asking. Where do I go from here? Please just advice as I know the argument wasn't good for the police to have been called in the first place. They have also said that my child l witnessed this but there is no way they can see into my house with the angle its facing

So the neighbour is lying along with your four year old ?
Your version does not sound plausible.
You sound like your covering up for him, your partner clearly has anger issues.
Thank God neighbour did decent thing and alerted the police.

In answer to your questions, yes the SW can ask your 4 year old, but it does all sound a bit messy with the children having been present when the police discussed it the day before. The duty SW would have been getting an initial sense of safety, and the appointed SW will likely do an assessment next. This might mean speaking to the children again, maybe at school.
i won’t repeat what others have said but do agree, best thing now is to go with the process and be as honest as you can, accept support if offered.

OP. You're focusing on the wrong thing

Your 'argument' was so violent that the police were called
Your children were in the house
I guarantee that they are not 'fine'

Take a step back and look at the bigger picture

It's a huge wake up call. I will never ever raise my voice every around them again. Don't think for one minute that Ive taken this lightly I've hugged not kids so tightly ever since as the guilt of this has taken over hugely.

Okay, but even if the neighbour misinterpreted it as a kick to the head, it must have been an act of physical aggression (unless the neighbour was intoxicated or high on drugs or suffers from a severe mental illness that makes him hallucinate).

Was it a kick to the neck or chest or back?

People don't usually walk around and imagine random people being violent when they're not.

Thankyou for this, it's all very messy. My youngest doesn't understand what is going on but my eldest does and she was so upset that she was shut down. My youngest is alot louder and kept interrupting and the duty SW allowed her too which meant my eldest didn't get to speak much at all. When I heard the words my youngest used it was way too adult for any young child to use. She had literally repeated everything that was said on the night it happened. She wasn't even downstairs

I'm confused, OP. You seem to think that your kids slept through the argument and only woke up when the police arrived.

But your neighbours called the police because they heard you having a row. So how could your kids not have been woken up by the argument? What were the police doing that meant they were so much louder than the actual argument?

I'm not buying it personally. You seem to be in denial at the very least about the extent to which your kids may have been affected by the row. And I suspect that you may be in denial about a whole lot more.

It's interesting to me that your 8yo seems to be quite insistent about the fact that the kick didn't happen, and that you were annoyed by the social worker didn't listen to her. If she was in bed asleep as you have said, surely the truthful answer from your 8yo would be that she didn't know what had happened?

I would add that I would be concerned about your older dd's level of distress about the fact that she couldn't get her version of events across to the social worker, given that she supposedly didn't know anything anyway. It sounds like she feels like she needs to protect your partner.

Agree entirely with all of this and especially the latter part.

You are focusing on wrong thing entirely and came on here to see if the Sw was in the wrong and court favour that this was the case.

The words my 4 year old used was far to adult for any 4 year old. She even said they was arguing because drink was involved. My children would never know what that means. She has taken what the police were asking me and their aunty. When she asked her does she know why the police were here she's taking it from what the police said...

The fact that you are saying you will do whatever SS tell you you need to isn't going to reassure them that you are safeguarding your children - it comes across as you are minimising the violence and not acknowledging the impact witnessing DV has on children

If both kids were asleep how does the 8yo know there was no violence? Also, was the neighbour who called the police one of the other adults in the house? Why did the neighbour think he kicked you in the head or it looked as though he did?

Unfortunately, the children may have heard or seen more than you know. All you can do now is make sure you never put them in that situation again.

What did happen? You appear to be minimising what happened and feel that neighbour and SW haven’t handled things well. Do you understand why your neighbour called the Police? How is it possible that your neighbour could hear but your children couldn’t and that they only woke up when the Police arrived? You need to be honest with yourself.

As someone how spoke to police on multiple occasions as a child, watched my step dad hit my mum and smash her belongings in the street I'd say, Run! I'm 30 and I can still see my mums mascara streaked face looking over me. It's a core memory and not a good one. Your children will be affected by this, both me and my sister went on to have DV relationships when we grew up. What were you arguing about that was so bad the police were called?

It’s indicative of serious concerns. The fact that your concern is your child being questioned rather than an argument that led to the police being called is also a concern.

How did the neighbour see so clearly into your house? He saw your children in the room and your husband attack you.

Children are known to protect their parents which is why the social worker is asking both children what happened. All your 8 year old will say is that she was asleep.

It doesn't make sense that you were arguing loud enough for the police to be called and your children slept through it.

OP I don't know what's going on but you have a golden opportunity to get away if he's abusive. Social services and a domestic abuse organisation will help you to leave.

Please don't bring your children up in an abusive household.

People always kid themselves that the children are fine, they were in bed, it was the police who upset them, not the screaming row audible next door etc. Your children aren’t fine. They are living in an abusive home. They will have been lying awake listening to the two of you, terrified. If they seem fine, that’s because they are used to making themselves small and trying not to rock the boat. It’s a horrible life for them and it will leave lasting scars.

I think it’s likely SS will require you to end the relationship in order to keep the children safe. I bloody hope that’s what happens, because you clearly aren’t making the responsible choices on your own and those children deserve better. So do you - you deserve not to be abused, but you are an adult and have a choice. Your children don’t.

Yeah, they do tend to grow up far too much and far too quickly when they see and hear abusive relationships around them. She's certainly lost her innocence as a result of her father's behaviour, hasn't she?

Hi I just wanted to add a different perspective. Firstly I am not saying this argument was ok it wasn't you accept that. On the other hand arguments do sometimes happen and kids need to see people fall out then work it out ( in safe and correct circumstances) but it does sound extreme op, the order made should not have been made lightly but I work in legal not in family but I have assisted and find some Judges make a rash decision on a case due to not having all evidence at this stage but at the same time since recent changes to DV laws DVPO they are sometimes just to simply protect which is better than how it was.
I once worked on a case where the mother was clearly a risk this is a few years ago but it went on for 2 years that they were ordering unsupervised contact and overnights still child was at risk of harm, I knew It I had a bad feeling with her. It all came out in the end child is now with dad full time 0 contact with mum only because the family worked extremely hard to get to the truth social services were backing mum, I knew mum was not all she seemed but she really did manipulate the system until there was independent evidence. So I think even if this happened as you say then good on them protecting the children making sure they are safe.

Another point about arguments, if you live in a new build you can hear everything. I rarely hear my neighbours even though we're in semi stone built older homes. So it could have seemed louder than the neighbours could actually make out. But the question remains why did the neighbours say he kicked you in the head? Are there marks? Did they witness it? Maybe heard things before.
If they did and your 4 year old is telling what she heard or saw then this will only get worse get honest now or it's all going to end very badly cafcass will be involved and they will get to the truth if they are good at their job usually they are in my experience. Social worker can ask in the right circumstances but can't put words in the child's mouth, I mean kids do also repeat what's been said no matter who said it. I think social will get carcass or should be ordered to if your staying together so an independent report can be done the cafcass worker should do child age appropriate discussion / play they are trained in getting the truth without putting words into child's mouth. But you say children were asleep so how do they know if he kicked you? I feel your not saying everything here.

Be honest with yourself even if you were shouting at your husband he cannot kick you or hit you,, you have children to protect if the argument was as bad as they neighbours tell it then it's not good for kids and I'm inclined to agree with what everyone is saying that the neighbours and police, ss, clearly believe they have enough evidence and suspect you are scared to tell the truth, they will also suspect you told the older children not to say anything. Stay on board with SS and remember if he's abusing you it's likely you are trauma bonded and therefore your going to do anything to stop that pain that pain is temporary things will get worse they always do, but you need to come to terms if he is abusive ss will remove the children if they believe he's a risk or any of you if your protecting him and not ending the marriage then your a risk too. I hope your children are ok.

I don't understand how a neighbour reported that you were kicked in the head if there was NO physical violence.

The neighbour must have seen something, or heard something to make him think there was physical violence.

I don't understand how your 8 year old is insistent that you weren't kicked if she was sleeping and unaware what was happening. Surely what she should be saying is that she was sleeping and don't hear anything. Or that she and her sister were both sleeping.

SW will feel your younger child is being more truthful, as we can lie easier and protect others as we get older. Younger kids are more innocent.

I think as others here have said you seem to be downplaying this.Loud arguments can be upsetting for children to hear.The NDN was probably scared for you .Also why did they think you were kicked in the head? I would be very careful .Without being Alarmist, a lady was on TV yesterday warning others after DV was so bad he blinded her. This was extreme but she wanted to warn others.

I imagine the police have got body cam footage too

you say he didn’t touch you but perhaps your screams proved otherwise

Why would your neighbour have said they witnessed physical violence and even named the type of violence? Why a kick in the head? Were you lying on the floor?

Why would you want your older daughter to lie and say the violence didn’t happen if she was asleep during it and therefore can’t know either way?

no argument should get that bad especially in front of the kids. me and my husband never raise our voices in front of our kids. i grew up with parents beating eachother up all the time and its mentally scarred me so i dont want that for my kids. your kids get one childhood don’t let them witness all this shit it’s crap for them. as soon as your partner starts just walk away or leave him and take the kids with you. awful atmosphere for kids to be around. i’m sorry the police were called but if the police were called it’s got to have been bad for the neighbours to hear never mind the kids

If you really do want to do right by your children then your relationship to this man needs to end immediately.

You have a choice re this man, your children do not. They cannot afford to grow up in such a toxic and otherwise hostile, not just to say abusive, household. This damages children immensely into their adulthood.

Their home is a war zone, not the sanctuary it should be and it’s not their fault either their dad has decided to embark on his own private based war against you.