Relationship wobbles

[StrongTea22]

Been married for 17 years and together 20ish. Still quite young children in FTE.

a number of years ago I was lucky enough to be gifted a home in a good area by a grandparent, which means we are mortgage free. I know we are very fortunate in that respect and in this climate.

i was a sahm for around 10 years and my husband paid for everything and I was given a small allowance to cover playgym/petrol and coffee.

i now work very part time and have school holidays off and am around for childcare pick ups most days.

the issue is I don’t feel as if my contribution to our finances of being mortgage free or providing childcare is being valued. I earn less than a quarter of what my husband does and I’m limited by his job as it can involve working away/abroad. Neither of us wants the kids in lots of wrap around care each week.

Recently over the last 2 years I’ve ventured off on trips to see friends (stayed with them) and taken individual kids away (to save money and have 1-1) and one trip abroad with a friend for 2 nights last year which was a big deal for me. I saved really hard for them over a year in some cases.

over the last few years he has ventured away on holidays with family and friends separate to me also.

when I started working he started making comments about me being able to pay for everyone to go abroad, and last year said that he pays for everything when we are on holiday.

he doesn’t btw he has complete money blindness to anything I spend on as it’s seen as non essential (food/entry fees/bus fares/clothes whatever). I currently pay a third of my wage out in household bills and childcare. Which after petrol and life stuff, there’s not much left.

this year he’s booked a 10 day holiday in Devon for us as a family and then quickly said he’s taking the kids away over summer with his friends (families that I aren’t really friends with and wouldn’t want want to go) because I’m back working (Inonly work 3 days) and that if I want I can just take the kids away on my own, which means I have just one family holiday or go with them.

Icant afford to do that and why isn’t this a discussion if it’s family money?

he sees my being upset about this as some sort of control issue and me telling him what he can and can’t do- we are married, am I being stupid/naive/unfair about my expectations?

maybe we need to look at what is being paid for more fairly now I’m working if he feels it’s a disadvantage for him,?

Honestly, your relationship sounds ridiculous.
You have no financial plans, no transparency, no common financial goals.
Do you know what your shared values are, as a couple and a family?
Why are you vacationing separately rather than as a family?

I don't get it. Are you roommates with children, or a couple? I couldn't live like this.

Put everything into a joint account.
All this ‘I pay for X, he pays for Y’ doesn’t work. It’s messy and confusing and there’s no transparency. Someone will always feel like they are covering more because they can’t account for the other expenses if they can’t see them.

Is the 10 day holiday the one he’s taking the kids on his own? Or are you going and he’s taking the kids later in the summer?

Yeah we could do that, maybe I should suggest it, it’s probably a bit of a hangover from me being a sahm and him taking over everything and paying for it out of what was the joint account.

The 10 day one is the family holiday with me.

think it’s 4 nights or something that he’s doing with pals.

If it's in a joint account, how likely is he to guilt you out every time you spend money on the kids' clothes?

Before any practical changes you need to make sure you are working as respected equals in your marriage.

How might your past be affecting your attitude towards money and how deserving you are?

I don’t know if it is all paid out of a joint account, it was after I got pregnant but he manages it all so i don’t know and I didn’t have capacity/headspace for this when kids were very small, and had nothing to contribute financially anyway as I was at home. So it’s stayed that way.

My money now is classed as extra money I suppose, I’d love a holiday abroad but everywhere is so expensive so it’s caravan holidays and day trips for us as a family.

suppose I’m upset as I earn so little in comparison when he earns a good wage and my contribution towards our money in terms of no mortgage is almost a given as it’s just been absorbed with the col increasing where everything is so expensive.

i get child benefit so that goes towards some kids clothes but it’s mostly second hand, he does periodically give me money for that or I say kids need x/y/z and he pays for it like shoes/coats/uniform.

So what is the issue then? You’ve said yourself that you have taken the kids away without him. Why isn’t an issue for him to take them somewhere you don’t even want to go for 4 days while you work?

I’ve worked my arse off being a sahm, to then get a job and still do wraparound for kids and home and even though it’s referred to as ‘family Money’ it isn’t, it’s his money paying for my bills, bar my small contribution financially.

he will pay lip service to all of the above and say it’s family money, and does pay for things without mention/blame or anything (car insurance, life insurance, phone etc) but I have worked for those things, even if not in paid traditional work setting but O don’t get a say in how many holidays we go on, where or what is or isn’t spent and that’s because he probably feels I am not contributing maybe?

Because this will be his third holiday this year that he’s able to pay for outright.

I don’t have the ability to just randomly book holidays for myself and all our children to go away,
and none of my nights away have ever come at a cost of him being financially not able to do something independently or impacted us as a family having holidays together.

Your title is "Relationship wobbles" rather than "Want to reorganise our finances". What is it you'd like to change?

Probably my entire personality and my decision to post on mumsne currently @80s

what can I say it’s complicated and layered and without writing a life story on here what you see is what you get.

I get it, OP.

I'm too busy at work to answer right now but just wanted to validate you. Been there, done that. Now getting divorced.

You're gut reaction/emotions are telling you the set-up is wrong.

It needs sorting out.

*Your.

The setup is clearly wrong, but it's hard to tell whether a divorce or a new bank account would sort it out best. If a reasonable conversation doesn't help then it could be a form of financial abuse.

If the answers are upsetting @StrongTea22 it could be because we're a bit slow on the uptake, but it could also be that we're stirring something up in you. Some issues can be painful to address, but remember the phrase "like lancing a boil"?

Was your lack of headspace for financial issues early on related to a lack of practical/emotional support from him?

he sees my being upset about this as some sort of control issue

This jumped out amongst all the words I was reading about him making all the decisions. His accusations are admissions.

He’s a CF. Never had to work his arse off to pay towards rent/mortgage of a home which the law now sees as half his, provided by your grandparents, is so ungrateful.
If you’d had a home for 17 years, say it was £1000 as mortgage (just picked a figure it’s not meant to be accurate!) then that’s £12,000 a year. At current value that would be £204,000. That’s what you’ve already contributed and he gets half the benefit of that.
This enables him to have a lot of financial freedom which he is clearly taking advantage of.
Considering the value of that property you have brought, what he sees as your ‘wife’ work and then your paid work, he is one CF to say you are being controlling by being upset with him.
You need a financial plan, one which is fair and takes into account you are a married couple of many years and not two teenage Uni roommates.

What a mess! How are you in this position after nearly 20 years together and with children? You put all money into one shared pot - it's the only way.

Woah, a wobble is a wobble! It does upset me though.

It does need to be discussed, I aren’t sure what else I can contribute though in terms of money and how that would change anything financially.

in real terms I want a proper discussion about how money for family holidays is spent and time away as a family is decided upon.

Sometimes I feel its as though he wants me to whisk out my wage and hand it over (because I live for free and have NO overheads) and say save that for a holiday or whatever and that’s just not realistic
and nor should I have to.

But maybe my wage and his should go into a joint account and we look at how that is fair. Currently he says we roughly have the same left over each month which is felt to be fair.

i have said I can and will save towards holidays abroad but they are so expensive that I can’t save or contribute £3k
over a year when my wage is around £10k with c.b.

when we met I had my own house and ran/paid for everything myself for my own life. Things just changed as we got married and had a child/moved etc andI was just consumed with other things I suppose.

You’ve provided a mortgage free home and years of childcare and he’s given you a small allowance? That’s very wrong. As is you paying a third of your part time wages and struggling financially while he has enough money to book three holidays a year. You should have both benefitted from being mortgage free, not just him, it sounds like he kept you in poverty while you were a sahm.

You need to do some digging and you need full financial disclosure. Like all financial abusers he probably has significant secret savings. Financial abuse often occurs with other types of abuse because ultimately it’s about control. Is there anything else going on?

Rid yourself of the notion that he doesn’t value your contribution. He does value it and he’s doing very nicely out of it. You’ll see how much he values it when you want things to change.

He has paid a mortgage for many years on property we have owned, he has absolutely not had a free ride and he supported all
of us whilst I was a sahm
mortgage and the works.

the house is ours, but obviously we benfit from this because of me initially and we both benefit from being mortgage free, we have both put money into it, which I do kind of want taking into account in our financial discussion going forward as it’s. A huge thing to not have to worry about.

That said, I DO get the benefit as we can afford to pay for cars/insurance holidays etc without having to factor that in to finding, it’s just not got a cash value on the face of it that I am bringing to the table.

I think this is not really about the money. It’s about the shared goals, stories and priorities and how to get back to them. It’s about recognising and valuing (and with that validating) the strengths and needs of each other.
The fact that he earns more - and why wouldn’t he with a wonderful person like you picking up all of his jobs at home and doing extra? - but also puts you in a position where you feel and are constantly aware of how little you put in comes from his projection of you’re contributions not being worthwhile on you. Counselling something you want to do? Don’t wait until you have lost all confidence in you and the relationship.

Imagine if you asked him to pay you rent for the major asset - the most major asset you share - that you and your contribution (doesn’t matter that it’s family and not work) you live in? That is no more unreasonable than the expectations he seems to have of you as part time worker and free wrap around childcare mum.

Also - would you like to go back to work more F/T? Childcare isn’t terrible.

I got an ok allowance and he wasn’t splashing the cash himself that’s for sure we managed on very little and had no fun money for takeaways or many splurges back then.

i feel like I need to be clear here, we are mortgage free now, we were not mortgage free for a number of years and he paid for everything, mortgage included and worked very hard in a challenging job.

that said, things change and I am working now and we are mortgage free and I need that to be recognised and get a handle on our finances and feel like I am contributing and benefitting from both of our contributions

This has crossed my mind. I couldn’t and would never do that. But it would mean I had financial freedom to book holidays wouldn’t it 😆

I recently got asked to up my hours and it just wouldn’t work for us with the kids at the ages they are and with the commitments he has and I end up stressed and the house more of a mess than normal so decided against it.

additional hours would more than pay for childcare, but the kids just don’t cope well all day there and we have meltdown after meltdown as it is. The kids school for wrap around is not brill in the am start times so that adds to it on a headache basis as I’m in education sector and no flexibility.

I'm a man, but I'd say this kind of financial arrangement would only work if you have great understanding and communication, which evidently isn't there. You need a joint account or a joint credit card as he doesn't seem able to understand what you and the kids need.

In his defence, I'd say him taking the kids away for a trip for 4 days, when single-parent trips seems an established thing in the family, isn't necessarily a bad thing. He might actually think he's giving you a break.