Who are these woman that want to be with men who treat their exs and children poorly?

[Glitterbug21]

This is a question that had been pondering me for a while. My ex abused me and caused all kinds of problems and as a result his daughter who is 13 refuses to see him. His son who is 9 is barely interested either. The new gf was an affair partner who he moved into our home weeks after kicking me and the kids out. this was quite a while ago but I still get agro and my kids still feel the effects of these events.

now obviously the first person to blame here is the man, but my situation is not rare, and these men are often not short of girlfriends.

as a woman it baffles me how any one could see that behaviour and find that person attractive! I could never be with someone who could cause harm to their own children, yet it’s very common, but we never here from these woman?

literally just random thoughts on my behalf and I’m interes To hear what others think.

They are desperate women that would date anyone as long as it is a man.
Broken damaged women easily coercible and manipulable.

Honestly I have no idea. My ex’s girlfriend is a long standing friend of his (and formerly also my friend) she knows our marriage ended due to his drug addiction and that I’m raising 4 kids alone rather than stay married to him. Good luck to her I say! Can’t say she didn’t go into it with her eyes open. Interestingly they’ve been together a long time now and they don’t live together…I wonder if she knows deep down what a huge nightmare that would be for her.

They're you, without the benefit of experience. You didn't have kids with this charmer thinking he was going to leave you and treat them like crap. They see the first guy, not the second one.

I wouldn't use the word desperate, but agree far too many women are damaged and believe this is what it'ssupposed to be orbits.all the women's fault, if only they or the previous partner had been better.

I mean, you had a child with him....why was that?

She'll believe what he's told her, that you're mad and it's all your fault.

These threads pop up quite regularly and the general consensus is that women have varying abilities of being able to recognise the red flags. Women are socialised from an early age to be more tolerant of poor behaviour and to adopt more than their fair share of household/childcare responsibilities. Add in cultural messaging where grand gestures from men mean all should be forgiven or shitty behaviour means ‘he needs support’ and this explains a lot of it.

These men will tell a completely different story to the new women - she stops me from seeing my DC, she was having an affair, etc. Sometimes it’s a matter of perspective, sometimes outright lies.

Try not to be judgmental though. It’s hurtful and doesn’t help. For example, some judgy types might argue that leopards don’t change their spots so your ex will have displayed signs he was like this at an earlier stage in the relationship yet you chose to have two children with him. Everyone’s background, socialisation, personality, current set of circumstances/vulnerability etc all play into the ability to recognise these men.

I might be the complete odd one out here. I had a horribly abusive relationship. My ex tells his new wife I’m the abusive one, a story she and her family have bought. But…from the outside at least they have a very different relationship to the one he and I had. He genuinely seems much happier, when his nose isn’t in my business.

There's a reality here to these situations that no one ever really talks about.

The GF doesn't care about the ex or the children in the least. In fact, having them out of the picture is the best outcome for them. They can have their relationship without the baggage.

That is the bottom line.

There's no sisterhood or women feeling sorry for other women. That is a myth. Women can be just as ruthless as men, we just don't like to admit that.

We try to explain it away by saying they must be lying to the new partner etc and that might be true to an extent but 9 times out of 10 its just that the GF doesn't care and is happy with them being airbrushed out.

It really is as simple as that. There's nothing more to understand.

Some people are dysfunctional and seek other dysfunctional people.

Some people are desperate.

This is absolutely the case with my ex-husband’s now wife (was OW). She simply doesn’t care about his/our DC and is quite satisfied that he barely sees them.

Many of these men are accomplished liars and master manipulators.

They don't announce to new girlfriends that they have children they don't bother with. They are always the victim in their narrative.

And because that "she doesn't let me see the kids" narrative is so common in peoples friends, brothers, other relatives, it's believable for many.

My ex has 7 children by 3 women (me, then his now ex wife, then a girlfriend) and his latest girlfriend is making social media posts about how hard done by he is and how she's going to help him fight to regain contact with his children when he tracks them down... mine are adults and he knows where they live. No word. His ex wife lives in the former marital home - no word. His ex girlfriend lives in the same house she has since childhood - no word.

He's spun a tale and he's a very convincing man.

Totally I hear you OP but so many of these men are gaslighting lying cheating cunts who put on a very good act to convince people they’re a decent bloke with a crazy ex.

And they always have a well worn sob story as to how none of it was their fault.

I think it's an uncomfortable truth for many. We try to explain it away by saying the ex is manipulative or an accomplished liar but really women have chosen to believe those lies.

Many men are manipulative or lie but it's often in the GFs interests to believe that lie.

There's many posters on Mumsnet who fall into that category but would never admit it.

I think because from birth girls are taught that having a boyfriend or husband is a goal, a prize. That being in a relationship is aspirational. Add in biological clocks and peer pressure and financial inequality-women are still paid less and do most of the unpaid caring roles, the stigma of being single and of having sex outside of a relationship and the message is pretty heavily hammered home that even a rubbish man is better than being single.

In my case, the OW was a desperate lonely woman who was at the very end of her biological clock and saw a man who was in a relationship that was going through a tough time after the birth of a baby. She got her claws in and got pregnant within months. She's welcome to him though, I only saw how truly awful he was when he was gone!

I don't get why anyone has children with abusive men but they do, but we are told there is never any red flags at the beginning yes people tell us about how bad their partner is but they are 'in love with him' or 'I thought having a baby will change him' or 'I can fix him' then there is the is the ones who like to mother them

Then the daughters end up finding men who treat them the same

But none of get why others make decisions they do I suppose

A lot of women just have cripplingly low self esteem, unsurprising given the abuse of women is rife. If you haven’t done the inner work, the pattern is just repeated.

“But he wouldn’t do that to ME. He loves ME. She was crazy/mean/selfish/abusive/fill in whatever nonsense he tells new woman/bitchy”

Because he’s characterised you as crazy or made up lies where it’s not his fault. He’s hardly going to have told the truth where he looks bad.

I was going to say exactly what 2 posters have just said.
These women, especially if they are childless, couldn’t care less about their partners kids and would much rather they were out of the picture, even more so when they have kids of their own.
I don’t necessarily think they are always vulnerable or the man is talking crazy ex stuff.

These women must not have the sense they were born with. If he will walk out on his previous GF and his kids with her, he will do the same to you.

Honestly, these men lie and manipulate and play the victim. They tell the new woman that their ex is crazy and vindictive, emotionally abused them and turned their children against them. A lot of women are 'rescuers' and want to care for and nurture a new partner - they don't find out what he's like till further down the line.

When you got together with your abusive ex, you probably didn't see that side of him until it was too late and you were already involved. Men like this often love bomb a new partner & the relationship moves quickly to living together/having children. It's all about control.

It's human nature to be egotistical and think it won't happen to you and you're somehow different or better.

This will have been stoked very effectively by the man who will give the impression that she is different or better and who will usually assassinate his ex's character etc.

Also, for the sake of argument, many men do not walk out on their second partner ...... They can see it's "different person, same shit" after a while and can't be bothered to move on again. They realise they're not going to get anything different with a third partner.

They also realise that they will very much look like the problem if they do it a third time and the narrative about it not being"right" with their first wife and her being xyz - will fall apart.

Women don't have to believe or go along with it, they do have brains and need to stop letting men do all their thinking for them, can they not think for themselves?

They are my mum - codependent, enabling, desperate for validation and insecure. They get their sense of self-worth from being a martyr and rescuing people and think they are special because they can see what someone could become with the power of their love and attention. It’s bollocks. But it’s part of their identity and probably a role they’ve been playing all their lives, including as a child.

My mum married a man with a ‘crazy gold digger ex’ who’s adult children went NC with him in their late teens (we are late 30s/40s now). He abused at least one of them, has been convicted of abuse. Literally brought all his court paperwork out on their first date. She can see the good in him apparently. Knew he’d never do it again. He’s a good man under it all, but only she can bring it out in him. She’s lost her entire family (we are all NC with them) and most of her oldest friends, but “people just don’t understand” apparently. 🙄

I have a bit of empathy. It comes from some deep childhood stuff. But people need to put their own wellbeing and that of their children ahead of a man. Sort their shit out. Get some therapy. Be single if necessary. There are too many fish in the sea to through everything away for a loser, but it’s hard I imagine when it’s all you’ve ever done.

Exactly this.

It's human nature to think 'oh that will never happen to me'.

And sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't.

But humans are great at repeating the same mistakes over and over with little or no thought.